Confirmed Trade: [CBJ/WPG] P-L Dubois and '22 3rd for P. Laine, J. Roslovic [Mod warning OP)

[TS Quint]

Dubois is 22 years old and playing his 4th season in the NHL.

Ryan O'Reilly's career high at that age was 55 points.

Mark Scheifele's was 49 points.

Barkov's was 59 points.

MacKinnion's was 63 points.

Dubois put up 61 points in his second season. The only player to do it quicker than that was MacKinnon who put up 63 as a rookie and then didn't score more than 60 for another 3 seasons after that.

Do you really believe that a 22 year old center has reached his max potential and is not going to improve at all going forward. Do you really think he has had his career best season already?

You are only proving my point. HE IS NOT AN ELITE PLAYER YET. He might become one. But he isn’t currently.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

“Pretty much”? No he is not. And he isn’t until he is and does.

I do believe the potential is there but he isn’t elite anything yet.

You are happy giving a career high of 61 and a pro rated 57 points the following year a better contract than Mark Stone, interesting.

If you're going to argue, at least get your facts straight. Mark Stone earns $9.5 million per year.

 

[Adam da bomb]

You are only proving my point. HE IS NOT AN ELITE PLAYER YET. He might become one. But he isn’t currently.

It’s true pld might not be elite. But neither are Roslo or Laine. Laine has a unique skill in goal scoring which is the most important skill but the rest of his game is meh.

 

[TS Quint]

And Schiefele then parlayed that breakout year to an 8 year/$6.125M AAV contract, which is probably like 8x8 right now.

Hmm. I mean, if he does fit in well with the team, I guess 8x8 would be fair and solves a big hole on this team for a long time.

It’s $6,879,800. And I believe Sheifelee had half a great season. Maurice needed Little to go down to give Scheifele a chance at 1C. Boy was he surprised with how wrong his talent evaluation is.

 

[snowkiddin]

Who is your compareable for that contract?

Aho is a pretty good comp. Hischier too. I see Dubois in that tier.

 

[Dumais]

I expect Laine’s numbers to go down on bj and pld to go up on Jets.
Either way we already have our 1 dimensional goal scorer in Connor we don’t need 2.
Overall I expect pld to be the better player in his end and the better play driver, and playmaker. Laine will be the better goal scorer.
I am not sad to lose fans who are only fans of Laine Columbus can have that headache. Complaining how it’s everyone else’s fault that he is held back.
Good luck Roslo hope he can be consistently good. He has had moments where he was close to putting it together in wpg but never did. Hopefully he can be your Pionk.

I kinda expect the opposite. Laine's numbers to go up (being first line now) and PLD's numbers to go down. I suppose he could develop and challenge Schiefele but seems unlikely.

 

[TS Quint]

Aho is a pretty good comp. Hischier too. I see Dubois in that tier.

Hischer? You are all over the place.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I kinda expect the opposite. Laine's numbers to go up (being first line now) and PLD's numbers to go down. I suppose he could develop and challenge Schiefele but seems unlikely.

The second pair wingers are Ehlers and Connor playing against other teams weaker lines. I suspect being a second line they face weaker matchups also I expect Dubois to replace stastny on 1 pp. also Jets are more offensively oriented. I expect Laine will have fewer power play pts without the same quality of passers.

 

[snowkiddin]

Hischer? You are all over the place.

Not really. Elite 1C who signed long-term recently in the $7-8 million range.

 

[TS Quint]

Not really. Elite 1C who signed long-term recently in the $7-8 million range.

I don’t think you know what the word elite means.

 

[snowkiddin]

I don’t think you know what the word elite means.

Likewise with you, good sir.

 

[snowkiddin]

I kinda expect the opposite. Laine's numbers to go up (being first line now) and PLD's numbers to go down. I suppose he could develop and challenge Schiefele but seems unlikely.

Why does that seem unlikely? Not trying to be an ass, genuinely wondering.

 

[heretik27]

The second pair wingers are Ehlers and Connor playing against other teams weaker lines. I suspect being a second line they face weaker matchups also I expect Dubois to replace stastny on 1 pp. also Jets are more offensively oriented. I expect Laine will have fewer power play pts without the same quality of passers.

I think Stastny has been plugged into those situations for faceoffs because we constantly waste 30 seconds retrieving the puck from our end and trying to regain the zone when Scheifele loses a draw. I don't know if we'll see him or Dubois on the first PP unit in the future, but I'm not really a fan of Stastny in the middle on the first unit... he sits in the slot and has no hands for rebounds or tips.. lol

 

[jonlin]

The second pair wingers are Ehlers and Connor playing against other teams weaker lines. I suspect being a second line they face weaker matchups also I expect Dubois to replace stastny on 1 pp. also Jets are more offensively oriented. I expect Laine will have fewer power play pts without the same quality of passers.

I actually feel the same, even though I`m rooting for Laine. PLD has the chance to succeed and I expect him to do it with the wingers he gets now. Scheifele+Wheeler will have the opponents best shutdown players against them, so he should have easire opponents.
Laine has no 1C to play with. Actually not even a 2C, so will be pretty hard to have a functional line. On PP he has Jones and maybe Werenski atleast to feed him, but I dont expect him to be as lethal he could be without better linemates.

 

[majormajor]

You are only proving my point. HE IS NOT AN ELITE PLAYER YET. He might become one. But he isn’t currently.

Not yet, I'd agree. But that ends up feeling like more of a semantic argument. Is a 70 or 80 pt two-way force an elite 1C? I'd say yes, and more importantly I can't imagine that Dubois isn't a 70 or 80 pt two-way force going forward. If he finds that form this year, I'd expect the Jets to be pleased to get him locked up to an 8x8 this summer.

PLD isn’t elite anything yet. He’s on of those guys where if he is your 2nd line center you are doing really well. If he is your 1C you are in trouble.

This is where I think you are pretty far off the mark. You probably think the Leafs had two better centers and they still lost to a team with PLD at #1C. That's obviously just one series, and teams have other players, so it isn't how I would measure value. But it runs quite literally counter to your statement.

And I think more generally you can have a really good team with PLD as your #1C. I think a Getzlaf type impact going forward is well within the cards. I don't think he can be Barkov level but FWIW the analytics crowd was running with Barkov is the best comparison at age 22 and they generally took the view that Dubois is much better than Laine.

 

[TS Quint]

Not yet, I'd agree. But that ends up feeling like more of a semantic argument. Is a 70 or 80 pt two-way force an elite 1C? I'd say yes, and more importantly I can't imagine that Dubois isn't a 70 or 80 pt two-way force going forward. If he finds that form this year, I'd expect the Jets to be pleased to get him locked up to an 8x8 this summer.

He’s not elite is my main point.

Who is this Dubois who puts up 70-80 points? What would it cost for the Jets to acquire him?

 

[MMC]

Why the hell is Dubois playing on the wing?

 

[TS Quint]

Why the hell is Dubois playing on the wing?

Just taking it easy on him after an injury.

 

[majormajor]

He’s not elite is my main point.

Who is this Dubois who puts up 70-80 points? What would it cost for the Jets to acquire him?

That he hasn't been elite yet is a fine point, but you're saying a lot more than that when you say "if he is your 1c you are in trouble". You've been making statements about past and future here, you can't cover all of that by saying "he isn't elite yet".

 

[Hunter368]

Why the hell is Dubois playing on the wing?

He suffered a lower body muscle injury (likely groin). PMO plan to bring him back after long layoffs due to Canadian COVID laws & injury was to ease him back into the lineup to avoid any further injury issues and to get him back into game shape. Playing wing is much easier on the body, less skating, less grind, etc. Good plan TBH IMO.

That's was the plan for game 1 back, now moving forward the plan is slowly having him play more and more time at 2C.

 

[Dumais]

Why does that seem unlikely? Not trying to be an ass, genuinely wondering.

He does everything well, just not great at anything. Maybe that will come out in the next few years (prime development years) but I don't know if it will get him to 1c with Scheifele around. But even if it does, I still see a diminished role (less ice time) on the Jets. And PLD played with bunch of different wingers here, Panarin to Anderson. Yeah maybe CBJ doesn't have the depth Jets do on offense but PLD played top line...

This is probably going to be looked at as a home run for Jarmo once again...other teams really need to stop trading with CBJ lol

 

[snowkiddin]

He does everything well, just not great at anything. Maybe that will come out in the next few years (prime development years) but I don't know if it will get him to 1c with Scheifele around. But even if it does, I still see a diminished role (less ice time) on the Jets. And PLD played with bunch of different wingers here, Panarin to Anderson. Yeah maybe CBJ doesn't have the depth Jets do on offense but PLD played top line...

This is probably going to be looked at as a home run for Jarmo once again...other teams really need to stop trading with CBJ lol

I see this likely to pan out well for Winnipeg too, so maybe other teams should stop trading with Columbus, but I don’t think Winnipeg got killed here.

The Jets are a better team now with Dubois in over Laine and Appleton in Roslovic’s spot. If the Jets lock up PLD long-term, it’s likely a win for them (CBJ can win too). Laine wasn’t gonna sign here without an overpay and Roslovic wanted out so an elite 1C (sure, maybe he will play second line behind Scheif) is an incredible return

 

[wahsnairb]

Was Nick Suzuki better than PLD last night?

Asking for a friend.

 

[Xoggz22]

Not really. Elite 1C who signed long-term recently in the $7-8 million range.

Elite? You might want to pull a dictionary to understand what that term really means.

 

[snowkiddin]

Elite? You might want to pull a dictionary to understand what that term really means.

Sure.

"A select group that is superior in terms of ability or qualities to the rest of a group or society."

Seems to fit the mould pretty well. Unless you're just arguing semantics here.