When will they retire Jagr's number?

[ziggyjoe212]

I think you have to include Fleury in there too.

He has a case. I wouldn't do it but I think he definitely has a case. Especially if he plays 3-5 more seasons and ends his career with the 2nd most wins in history.

 

[EightyOne]

He has a case. I wouldn't do it but I think he definitely has a case. Especially if he plays 3-5 more seasons and ends his career with the 2nd most wins in history.

Accomplishments off the team????

 

[HandshakeLine]

Thread needs more goalie chat. How about Murraaaaaay?

 

[HandshakeLine]

Accomplishments off the team????

We’ll put a set of his veneers on the concourse for all to see.

 

[ziggyjoe212]

Accomplishments off the team????

I'm not sure what you're trying to say. He played 12/15 seasons in Pittsburgh and he:

-5th all time in career wins
- 3(technically 2) Stanley Cups wins
-5 (technically 4) Stanley Cup appearances
-5x NHL all star (4 with Pens)

He was never an elite goalie but he certaily has an elite resume. Hell, he will have a case for the NHL HoF once he's #3 on the all time wins list. He only needs 24 wins to do so.

 

[EightyOne]

HHoF maybe. He's choked too much for me to respect him enough to pull for a number retirement. Hell, he even lost the Finals for VGK.

Imagine if the Pens actually had a legit goalie since 2004.

 

[JRS91]

HHoF maybe. He's choked too much for me to respect him enough to pull for a number retirement. Hell, he even lost the Finals for VGK.

Imagine if the Pens actually had a legit goalie since 2004.

Not sure why fans still have this idea that Fleury was bad.

He was a solid goalie for them. They don't win in 2016 or 2017 without Fleury.

 

[wgknestrick]

Crosby is also the penguins all time leader in playoff points. Not Lemieux... Crosby. That’s pretty significant

It only took 57 more games for Sid to score 14 more points than Mario...and Mario still outscored Crosby in the POs. That IS significant. Crosby isn't anywhere near Mario's level. Sorry.

 

[Gurglesons]

Not sure why fans still have this idea that Fleury was bad.

He was a solid goalie for them. They don't win in 2016 or 2017 without Fleury.

Probably because his run between 2011-2014 was statistically one of the worst goaltending performances in the playoffs EVER. In the history of the sport. While Sid and Malkin were winning Art Ross and Hart trophies

 

[HandshakeLine]

Not sure why OP only posts controversial opinions in the thread after we've achieved equilibrium. Own that shit from the jump!

Also, what happened to that guy in the other thread who was "conducting research" on players or whatever?

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

It only took 57 more games for Sid to score 14 more points than Mario...and Mario still outscored Crosby in the POs. That IS significant. Crosby isn't anywhere near Mario's level. Sorry.

Look at my avatar lmao

 

[saveusjoebiden]

Jagr played for way too many teams and burned the bridge with Mario and the fanbase, signing with the Flyers that summer after originally stating he would play for Mario for league minimum.

I would not like to see his number retired here at all.

Your number should retire if you were a great ambassador to the Pittsburgh Penguins and once-in-a-lifetime talent, Jagr treated us like any other franchise. Sure, he scored the so called goal that saved the franchise, but I'm not sure how much I believe of that and I lived through it all.

Sid, Geno & Fleury should get the number retired, don't forget, Fleury made sacrifices to help us get cup #5.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

For me, the story of Jagr mocking veterans about their salaries really told me who Jagr was, there was a time where his fantastic play blinded me from the kind of guy he was from the things you heard about him, but in the later years, you really got a good look at a man that never really matured into a well respected person.

Jagr only played for himself. That's not the kind of player I would want hanging beside Mario & Briere.

Crosby & Malkin, they deserve that honour. As does Letang.

66, 21, 71, 87, and 58.

That's not a lot of numbers. Those guys earned the right to be up there. I know Pixies and others want to destroy Fleury, but his stretch of bad years is a stretch, not his entire resume with the Penguins, the things he did for the Penguins as an ambassador to the team as many are when they're players for them, are things you have to also look at. He was a community leader in Pittsburgh, he was a leader on the team, he is forever etched on 3 Stanley Cups and was instrumental in huge ways for all 3 as well, no shitty biased bullshit stat shit will change what is a known fact.

So if 29 goes up there, I am 100% fine with that and would applaud it. Fleury was never a bad teammate. The back 2 backs don't happen without him doing some of the crazy heavy lifting against some really tough teams and in the 1st one, the season he was having before his concussion was just phenomenal and he was, for the most part, one of the MVP's of the team that season.

So f*** the haters. Oh boo f***ing hoo. 2011 to 2014.

 

[The Great Mighty Poo]

For me, the story of Jagr mocking veterans about their salaries really told me who Jagr was, there was a time where his fantastic play blinded me from the kind of guy he was from the things you heard about him, but in the later years, you really got a good look at a man that never really matured into a well respected person.

Jagr only played for himself. That's not the kind of player I would want hanging beside Mario & Briere.

Crosby & Malkin, they deserve that honour. As does Letang.

66, 21, 71, 87, and 58.

That's not a lot of numbers. Those guys earned the right to be up there. I know Pixies and others want to destroy Fleury, but his stretch of bad years is a stretch, not his entire resume with the Penguins, the things he did for the Penguins as an ambassador to the team as many are when they're players for them, are things you have to also look at. He was a community leader in Pittsburgh, he was a leader on the team, he is forever etched on 3 Stanley Cups and was instrumental in huge ways for all 3 as well, no shitty biased bullshit stat shit will change what is a known fact.

So if 29 goes up there, I am 100% fine with that and would applaud it. Fleury was never a bad teammate. The back 2 backs don't happen without him doing some of the crazy heavy lifting against some really tough teams and in the 1st one, the season he was having before his concussion was just phenomenal and he was, for the most part, one of the MVP's of the team that season.

So f*** the haters. Oh boo f***ing hoo. 2011 to 2014.

 

[Ugene Magic]

For me, the story of Jagr mocking veterans about their salaries really told me who Jagr was, there was a time where his fantastic play blinded me from the kind of guy he was from the things you heard about him, but in the later years, you really got a good look at a man that never really matured into a well respected person.

Jagr only played for himself. That's not the kind of player I would want hanging beside Mario & Briere.

Crosby & Malkin, they deserve that honour. As does Letang.

66, 21, 71, 87, and 58.

That's not a lot of numbers. Those guys earned the right to be up there. I know Pixies and others want to destroy Fleury, but his stretch of bad years is a stretch, not his entire resume with the Penguins, the things he did for the Penguins as an ambassador to the team as many are when they're players for them, are things you have to also look at. He was a community leader in Pittsburgh, he was a leader on the team, he is forever etched on 3 Stanley Cups and was instrumental in huge ways for all 3 as well, no shitty biased bullshit stat shit will change what is a known fact.

So if 29 goes up there, I am 100% fine with that and would applaud it. Fleury was never a bad teammate. The back 2 backs don't happen without him doing some of the crazy heavy lifting against some really tough teams and in the 1st one, the season he was having before his concussion was just phenomenal and he was, for the most part, one of the MVP's of the team that season.

So f*** the haters. Oh boo f***ing hoo. 2011 to 2014.

You can't have 87 without 58+29....

 

[Gurglesons]

You can't have 87 without 58+29....

But you can have 3 without 29.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

But you can have 3 without 29.

Mate, really? For that you get...

 

[The Great Mighty Poo]

But you can have 3 without 29.

....What about 14? I've heard reports of him being there.

 

[Dessloch]

Its never happening. Mario wouldn't even let him comeback for a reunion tour. I don't blame Mario either he saved the organization and has every right to make that call.

Lemieux sure did a good if not amazing job of hiding his "supposed bitterness" in the press:

Lemieux talked about how he could one day see No. 68 retired by the franchise.

“Oh, absolutely. He’s been a big part of our franchise,” Lemieux said. “He’s won two Cups in Pittsburgh. He’s a Hall of Famer, by far, and I’m sure he’ll be up there eventually.”

Lemieux and Jagr, one of the top duos in the NHL during the 1990s, don’t see one another very often these days, so nights like Friday are a great opportunity to catch up and talk about old times.
“We don’t talk a lot but when we see each other we have a good time,” Lemieux said. “He loves life and is always smiling, so it was nice to spend a little time and [he got to] see my wife as well. He hadn’t seen her in a while. It’s always good to see him.”
“It’s very special. I have to say thanks to those guys [that] I made it,” Jagr said. “They were big help for me — Mario, Ron Francis, Bryan Trottier, Paul Coffey, even Luc, I played a little with him. I never played with Sid. I would have probably more goals by now.”

Mario Lemieux 'absolutely' sees a day when Penguins retire Jaromir Jagr's number

 

[Dessloch]

The reason he didn’t sign here is a perfect example why his legacy should be tainted within the org. Always about himself, HIS money and HIS production. That’s why we didn’t do shit without Lemieux even though Jags was easily the best player in the league during those 4-5 years.

What an absolute joke of a statement. The ONLY reason the Penguins made the playoffs these seasons was because Jagr carried the team on his back, everyone without, a massive axe to grind should realize that. Not even Gretzky would have gotten anywhere with the roster the Pens had. If not for Jagr the Penguins would be playing in Kansas or some other location, Jagrs 1999 playoff performance saved the franchise at that point before Mario saved it again.

 

[Dessloch]

Jarda don't give a f*** about Pittsburgh at all, but it's cute to see people trying anyhow.

Like the dude could not be any clearer that he despises us and the city, and yet...

What kind of idiotic made up nonsense is this? Jagr has done nothing but praise the Penguins, Lemieux, Francis and every other player on the roster since the day he left. Have you lived under a rock? I really dont get it, I have been following Jagrs career post Penguins and Jagr has always been very vocal about how great his time was in Pittsburgh and how he owes his career to the Penguins etc. This had been done on a regular basis from 2001 to 2021 on TV and in a great number of articles during the years.

 

[Gurglesons]

What an absolute joke of a statement. The ONLY reason the Penguins made the playoffs these seasons was because Jagr carried the team on his back, everyone without, a massive axe to grind should realize that. Not even Gretzky would have gotten anywhere with the roster the Pens had. If not for Jagr the Penguins would be playing in Kansas or some other location, Jagrs 1999 playoff performance saved the franchise at that point before Mario saved it again.

I love when non-Pens fans educate us on our history.

 

[Dessloch]

I love when non-Pens fans educate us on our history.

Jagr and Lemieux made me a Penguins fan and I have my house decorated in black and gold and have not missed a game in 25 years, but hey, still a non-fan I guess.
----
Given the context of everything around that day — the financial state of the team and its uncertain future, the fact the Penguins were expected to lose, Jagr playing through a major injury and dominating — it was just a mind-blowing performance.

"Back in 2013 Jagr recalled that game and called the overtime goal one of the biggest goals of his career.

“I remember that like it happened yesterday,” Jagr said. “I pulled my groin in the first game. We were losing 3-2 in the series and if we would lose the first round I think the team would move to Kansas City because they had no money. We had to make the second round to get the (money) for the payments.
Jagr continued: “I came back and I tied it with a minute-and-a-half to go and then I scored in overtime. That was probably my best game ever, I would say. My most important for sure. I’ll probably never score a goal that important.
“Probably if I hadn’t scored that goal the team wouldn’t be in Pittsburgh right now. (Sidney) Crosby would be in Kansas City.”​

The day Jaromir Jagr (probably) saved the Penguins - ProHockeyTalk | NBC Sports

 

[Gurglesons]

Jagr and Lemieux made me a Penguins fan and I have my house decorated in black and gold and have not missed a game in 25 years, but hey, still a non-fan I guess.
----
Given the context of everything around that day — the financial state of the team and its uncertain future, the fact the Penguins were expected to lose, Jagr playing through a major injury and dominating — it was just a mind-blowing performance.

"Back in 2013 Jagr recalled that game and called the overtime goal one of the biggest goals of his career.

“I remember that like it happened yesterday,” Jagr said. “I pulled my groin in the first game. We were losing 3-2 in the series and if we would lose the first round I think the team would move to Kansas City because they had no money. We had to make the second round to get the (money) for the payments.
Jagr continued: “I came back and I tied it with a minute-and-a-half to go and then I scored in overtime. That was probably my best game ever, I would say. My most important for sure. I’ll probably never score a goal that important.
“Probably if I hadn’t scored that goal the team wouldn’t be in Pittsburgh right now. (Sidney) Crosby would be in Kansas City.”​

The day Jaromir Jagr (probably) saved the Penguins - ProHockeyTalk | NBC Sports

We all remember the game. Notice how the story is all about Jags and how “he saved the team”.

You’d never hear that self serving shit from the players we actually should retire.

And I’m curious how Jagr getting us to the 2nd round proves me wrong in what I said? Also, interesting to act like Jagr was on an island when that team had Kovalev and Straka who tied and out scored him in the playoffs.

 

[Dessloch]

Maybe, just maybe the team owner, who's also the one the best players in the history of the sport got pissed he ducked them for the a whole 1 million more after jerking them around for 3 and half years while playing in Russia of all teams in the league he picked the f***ing Flyers?, That could have something to do with it, he had his change to reconnect with the owner, team and city to prove he grew up matured and changed, and he pissed it away for a whooping 1 million more that he didnt need at all. f*** him and his mark fans.

Ray Shero was a bad GM, but a smart man. The only reason Penguins fans are upset about Jagr not signing with the Pens in 2011 is because they have been fooled by the Pittsburgh media and do not understand the context of Jagrs NHL return. Jagr wanted to return to the NHL to prove he was still an 1st line player and not on a 1 year farewell tour. The Penguins indicated to Jagr that he had to wait because the Penguins wanted to sign Tyler Kennedy first, that was their priority. As Jagr have said: "No disrespect towards Tyler Kennedy, but it showed the Penguins interest was not serious".

To be able to stay in the NHL and play a significant role, Jagr needed to go to a team that would give him 1st line minutes and 1st PP role. The Penguins clearly could not offer that to Jagr, and more so with thinking Tyler Kennedy was more important than Jagr. Further more Jagr said he felt Ray Shero had no real interest in having him on the team. Ray Shero lowballed Jagr with a 1.5$ one year deal and had Tyler Kennedy signed at 2$ million instead.

Shero then removed the Penguins offer to Jagr 10 minutes before free agency begun, so Jagr never could have signed with the Penguins. Its thought Shero did all of this to avoid a backslash from the Penguins fan base for not signing Jagr. Instead lowball Jagr and make him feel unwanted, and then have Jagr become the scapegoat for not returning to Pittsburgh. Any Penguins fans hating on Jagr because of what happened in 2011, needs to understand all of this and direct their anger towards Shero instead, if still feeling bitter about it. Shero could have landed a Penguins legend who went on to have 6 amazing years in the NHL on the cheap.

With regards to Jagrs conduct:

People grow and mature with age, Jagr has certainly changed and he has praised the Penguins every time he has got a chance since he left. Time for Penguins fans to forgive what happened 20 years ago. I am baffled as to how people can feel so much anger still.