When will they retire Jagr's number?

[Honour Over Glory]

Four Cups?

Three. In my heart there is 4.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Nothing says "good idea" like coming into another team's board and telling them that however they feel about a player is illegitimate and you know better. That's always something that ends well.

 

[HandshakeLine]

If he does not care, why do it? The fans are not asking for it. He left in bad terms. He said the stupid "I'd play for the league minimum for Mario" thing. I mean, I would not be mad if they did, but I do not see why they would.

The player does not care, the fan base has no strong connection with the player.

Sid, Geno, Letang and Fleury will probably get their day and they all deserve it more than Jagr. They either have had bigger impacts and mean much more to the community. Obviously, Letang and Geno it will depend how their Pens career end. Sid is a lock either way.

I think people really don't understand that retiring numbers for the Pens seems to be less about how great a player was (and Jagr's a great, no matter what he or I think on the matter), and more about what a player meant to the franchise as a whole beyond statistics or individual awards. Jagr not having his number retired isn't a sign of disrespect, it's a sign of the relationship between him and the franchise and city. It's a complicated thing.

Jagr has been vocal in the English and Czech press over the years about how he feels like he was mistreated in Pittsburgh, and how he doesn't owe the franchise anything. That's fine. He seems a lot happier now in Kladno than he ever was in Pittsburgh post-1993. I wish him well and I'm glad I saw him in his prime, but I don't care if we never see his number in the rafters and I doubt he gives a flying anything about being recognized by Pittsburgh.

Also, even without retiring the number, I doubt anyone is going to wear 68 for the Pens in my lifetime.

 

[EightyOne]

I'm surprised the hate Jagr is getting here. Whatever transpired in Pittsburgh aside if anything even did Jagr is one of the all time greats. He deserves the honor and at worst is 3rd all time among Penguins in my opinion. He would be number 2 for me if he stayed in Pittsburgh longer as well. The guy was an amazing force in his prime there.

Thanks for calling, but I don't think we care what Vancouver thinks about anything.

But if we need advice on how to riot after a playoff loss, we'll call you.

Nothing says "good idea" like coming into another team's board and telling them that however they feel about a player is illegitimate and you know better. That's always something that ends well.

@HandshakeLin
You're being a bit mean.

He wasn't calling us idiots for hating on Jags.

We've had a billion threads on this, and you've said your piece, you can let this one fade into history....like we will with #68, lol.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I just don't get other fans' obsessions with telling us how we should feel about our team, I guess.

 

[Gurglesons]

@HandshakeLin
You're being a bit mean.

He wasn't calling us idiots for hating on Jags.

We've had a billion threads on this, and you've said your piece, you can let this one fade into history....like we will with #68, lol.

He said Jagr was better than Letang. That is a fight.

 

[Ugene Magic]

Let's put it this way...

He'll want to be paid for us to come and honor him. Paid...

He gets his respect for his time here and for being an all-time great. But let's not act like he was exactly the model person here. He was a child in a grownups body. We put up with that because he was great on the ice. He had to be saved from himself on many of occasions both on and off the ice. By his mother, Mario and I'm sure a lot more from within the circle. For wanting it all, he didn't look like it or handle it well. If he has full control of himself now and he is happy....Great for him.

He didn't exactly leave gracefully, constantly asking to be traded. Personally, Francis should have been made captain, and maybe his ego takes a hit, but he would not have had forced upon pressure he clearly could not handle adversity or the simple actions of being interviewed while the team struggled. Things are great when it was easy or someone else had the pressure of dealing with it all. He grew up more after he left.

He acted like he was doing the team and the fans a favor. In reality he did. We got to move on and get guys more mature than he ever was and by far more deserving. He actually had a chance at saving face and chose not to only to increase his personna to the fans even more. Philly gave him more, can't fault that, but it's still driving that knife in even more, and Talbot really had a part in that too.


Can we just not even go there? I think the feelings are mutual./

 

[EightyOne]

I just don't get other fans' obsessions with telling us how we should feel about our team, I guess.

Yeah, but...imagine how bad it must feel every day, to not be a pens fan?

That's gotta mess a person up.

He said Jagr was better than Letang. That is a fight.

They both SEVERELY lack defensively. Lol.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Man, the stories I could tell you from the Czech / Slovak expat circles in Pittsburgh... Dude burned a lot of bridges in a lot of cities / lot of countries.

Although I still consider it a highlight watching two prostitutes duke it out INSIDE of his old restaurant on Wenceslaus Square.

 

[Peat]

From memory, I think it was in a radio interview, either with Madden or Joe Starkey. Probably somewhere around 4 years ago.

Gotcha.

Thing is, this piece came out in The Athletic earlier in the season - Finding Jagr: On Phil Bourque’s quest to connect with his... - and I think it's got a different message. It's about Phil Bourque going over to the Czech Republic and talking to Jagr, but there's quite a lot about the possibility of him getting his number retired.
...I'm gonna quote from bits of it:

"The Penguins, at Lemieux’s request, have been trying for years to persuade Jagr to return to Pittsburgh to have his number retired.
...
“I told him then that we want to retire his number,” McMillan [VP of Communications] said [at NHL 100 event]. “I said to him then: ’68 belongs up with 66, your number next to Mario’s.'”
...
However, since Bourque, like others, had heard Lemieux was the person in the organization most insistent on Jagr joining him in a form of franchise immortality — well, maybe that was a point only Bourque could make clear to Jagr, who told Bourque the last time he spoke with Lemieux was at that NHL centennial event.
...
Jagr made Bourque a promise: Within a year of playing his last professional hockey game, he would return to Pittsburgh for the Penguins to retire No. 68.
On one condition.
Bourque had to make sure fans in attendance cheered — “and for a long time.” "

Apols to mods if that's too much quoted, but I thought it more impactful to quote than summarise. McMillan and Bourque aren't providing quotes for this article unless a) The Pens org really wants it b) They're pretty damn sure there won't be egg on their face. To me that supersedes Tocchet's comments from four years ago.

Life can change quick but right now it looks like it's happening, whether people like it or not, and it's just a matter of when.

 

[HandshakeLine]

In many ways, I don't doubt that the organization would like to retire Jagr. I just don't think he feels the same way about it.

What I mean is, I don't think Jagr's ego will let him risk getting anything than total adoration. He threw a fit a few years ago when hockey commentators here criticized his performance in the WC and he's really the closest thing to a living national icon here. It was the most emotional I've ever seen him.

I think that's why he went back to Kladno in the end, because it's the one place in the entire country which adores him unconditionally and gives him the public affection he craves without the criticism. It also helps that Jagr and Wittgenstein were the only things of any value to come out of Kladno, so... y'know, he's got that going for him.

 

[Gurglesons]

In many ways, I don't doubt that the organization would like to retire Jagr. I just don't think he feels the same way about it.

What I mean is, I don't think Jagr's ego will let him risk getting anything than total adoration. He threw a fit a few years ago when hockey commentators here criticized his performance in the Olympics and he's really the closest thing to a living national icon here. It was the most emotional I've ever seen him.

I think that's why he went back to Kladno in the end, because it's the one place in the entire country which adores him unconditionally and gives him the public affection he craves without the criticism. It also helps that Jagr and Wittgenstein were the only things of any value to come out of Kladno, so... y'know, he's got that going for him.

Or how he only played for teams in his return where he was given top six.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Or how he only played for teams in his return where he was given top six.

That was the whole thing about him blowing up at the criticism here in the Czech Republic! People were saying "oh, it's great, he's a legend, we love watching him play... but maybe play him as a PP specialist/fewer minutes/veteran leader" and he lost it/the Czechs got trounced.

(Edit: and it was about the IIHF World Cup, not the Olympics, my bad. )

 

[HandshakeLine]

The more we talk about this, the more I feel like Jagr is the Kanye of the NHL.

 

[Gurglesons]

The more we talk about this, the more I feel like Jagr is the Kanye of the NHL.

Kanye has had success alone.

 

[Pens1566]

It won't happen.

 

[HandshakeLine]

It won't happen.

I can see it happening in like 10 years, after Jagr has faded from the spotlight and needs a boost to the ego. I don’t see it happening in the near future.

 

[K Fleur]

“If you want to blame anyone, blame the coaching staff at the time for not thinking more highly of him”

I actually blame you @JRS91

I was starting to kinda like Jagr again until I opened this incredibly original and not stupid at all thread.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Kanye has had success alone.

And is a billionaire. Jagr probably still owes half a billion to the Russian mob in gambling debts.

I meant in the sense of a fantastically talented individual (say what you will but My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy and Late Registration are killer), who has burnt a ton of bridges and good will the longer his or her career goes on.

 

[Ugene Magic]

I can see it happening in like 10 years, after Jagr has faded from the spotlight and needs a boost to the ego. I don’t see it happening in the near future.

An entire generation will need to die alive/off.

 

[HandshakeLine]

An entire generation will need to die alive/off.

I hate how hard I laughed at this. My GF is complaining because I woke her up.

 

[The Great Mighty Poo]

Maybe, just maybe the team owner, who's also the one the best players in the history of the sport got pissed he ducked them for the a whole 1 million more after jerking them around for 3 and half years while playing in Russia of all teams in the league he picked the f***ing Flyers?, That could have something to do with it, he had his change to reconnect with the owner, team and city to prove he grew up matured and changed, and he pissed it away for a whooping 1 million more that he didnt need at all. f*** him and his mark fans.

 

[HandshakeLine]

To be fair to Jarda, that million probably meant the difference between having his thumbs broken or not by an angry Uzbekistani man.

 

[Al Smith]

I loved watching Jagr play. He was truly a transcendent talent.
I didn't care that much when he left cause I had more important things to worry about in my life once any given game ended.
I never understood the knuckleheads who booed him every time he touched the puck after he came back, cause it meant they weren't really focusing on the entire game.
They'll retire his number when he and Mario reach an accord on date and conditions.
I couldn't care less whether and when that happens.

 

[spiny norman]

I think they're waiting until Jagr officially retires from playing.