Proposal: Trade Rumours/Proposals PART XXXX

[Micklebot]

I don't know that I buy Garrioch saying the Sens wouldn't be interested in giving Fiala 7.875M. They're going to give similar money to an inferior player in Josh Norris.

If Fiala nixed Ottawa as a destination you would never hear that from a mouthpiece like Bruce. He would just say what he said about the money being too much, and maybe that's the case. Or maybe not.

Norris is ahead of Fiala at the same age, heck production this year is pretty close, he paced about 16 pts back but with more goals, and plays the more important position.

Team almost certainly values Norris more than Fiala.

 

[GCK]

This would be franchise altering

Keller we don’t even know if he is available

Cat…well we weren’t going to pay fiala so I doubt it

Keller fits the salary structure far, far better than Debrincat. Getting Keller would require a very, very good package but 6 years of his contract is worth it.

1. Brown - provides cap for Arizona to hit floor and they can flip him at the deadline.

2. One of JBD/Thomson/Brannstrom

3. 7OA

4. Top 10 protected 2023 1st

5. Zaitsev - after bonus he has higher cap than salary which helps get Arizona and he is a placeholder RD for 2 years.


I would not do this personally as I think we need D far more than a winger.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Would you do 7OA, Boucher and Greig for Caufield?

Yes

 

[Micklebot]

Friedman saying Hawks turned down a package that included a high first and another first for Debrincat

 

[DJB]

Kassian is making 3.5 mil this year. I don't want to hear about how 7.9 mil is too much for a PPG winger while we pay 3.5 mil for someone to play on the fourth line.

Trading for Kassian without salary retention would put Dorion in the running for worst GM of all time.

We aren’t taking on Kassian unless we dump a contract back

 

[Agent Zub]

Norris is ahead of Fiala at the same age, heck production this year is pretty close, he paced about 16 pts back but with more goals, and plays the more important position.

Team almost certainly values Norris more than Fiala.

Fiala put up 67 even strength points playing with inferior line mates this season and little PP time. He probably puts up 90-100 points on our team with better linemates and PP time.

as a 22 year old Fiala put up 48 points when he was 9th in ice time on his team with little pp time in a lower scoring league.

Norris got his teams best line mates and best PP time from the start.

I don't think it's as simple as that.

 

[GCK]

Fiala put up 67 even strength points playing with inferior line mates this season and little PP time. He probably puts up 90-100 points on our team with better linemates and PP time.

as a 22 year old Fiala put up 48 points when he was 9th in ice time on his team with little pp time in a lower scoring league.

Norris got his teams best line mates and best PP time from the start.

I don't think it's as simple as that.

Production is production. My general impression, and correct me if I’m wrong, is that you prefer the flashier production vs the straight line hockey that Norris/Tkachuk play.

 

[Peptic Balcers]

any update on zaitsev getting moved? bonus pays out today garrioch said a few teams would be interested in taking him on with a pick after it was paid

 

[Crosside]

I think Keller is good friend with Tkachuk no.

 

[Micklebot]

Fiala put up 67 even strength points playing with inferior line mates this season and little PP time. He probably puts up 90-100 points on our team with better linemates and PP time.

as a 22 year old Fiala put up 48 points when he was 9th in ice time on his team with little pp time in a lower scoring league.

Norris got his teams best line mates and best PP time from the start.

I don't think it's as simple as that.

You're right, it's not simple, Norris was 16th in the league in goals per game as a 22 year old. That's ahead of DeBrincat, Stamkos, M.Tkachuck, McKinnon, Gaudreau, Rantanen, Malin, ect.

But 48 pts is pretty good, right?

 

[Agent Zub]

Production is production. My general impression, and correct me if I’m wrong, is that you prefer the flashier production vs the straight line hockey that Norris/Tkachuk play.

No like I have said many times I don't care what style a player plays as long as its effective. Alfredsson was the least flashiest star ive ever seen. I only saw him attempt a toe drag move between the legs once. But he is the player I admire most because his game was so simple yet so skilled and effective. Just elite common sense hockey.

And Fiala was one of the most productive even strength players in the league. Top 10 i'm pretty sure.

Looked it up and he had 1 less even strength point than Leon Draisaitl and only 10 less than Connor f***ing McDavid.

 

[Alex1234]

White has put up 40 points because of Stone
Thats a no brainer

 

[Agent Zub]

You're right, it's not simple, Norris was 16th in the league in goals per game as a 22 year old. That's ahead of DeBrincat, Stamkos, M.Tkachuck, McKinnon, Gaudreau, Rantanen, Malin, ect.

But 48 pts is pretty good, right?

yes it was impressive, and I do love Norris because he does that while being a good defensive player. but literally our only play on the powerplay is to feed a open Norris for a one time. It is the only dynamic part of his game.

 

[Ouroboros]

No like I have said many times I don't care what style a player plays as long as its effective. Alfredsson was the least flashiest star ive ever seen. I only saw him attempt a toe drag move between the legs once. But he is the player I admire most because his game was so simple yet so skilled and effective. Just elite common sense hockey.

And Fiala was one of the most productive even strength players in the league. Top 10 i'm pretty sure.

Looked it up and he had 1 less even strength point than Leon Draisaitl and only 10 less than Connor f***ing McDavid.

No doubt.

Over the last 3 seasons, Fiala is 22nd in the NHL in even strength scoring. He is a prolific driver of offense at 5-on-5 and that's a rare skill. Right now Norris is just a PP sniper; he doesn't create for himself and he doesn't create for others much either. He's still valuable, but less valuable than Fiala.

 

[Micklebot]

yes it was impressive, and I do love Norris because he does that while being a good defensive player. but literally our only play on the powerplay is to feed a open Norris for a one time. It is the only dynamic part of his game.

If that's our only play, it's that much more impressive that teams can't stop him.

 

[Big Muddy]

If Poolparty and Kassian are the guys available right now, I'd rather stand pat and hold off on any trades for awhile.

Doing nothing at this point is better than making a bad trade. And we need skill...a good dose of both playmaking and scoring on the front end. Not fodder for the bottom 6.

Ya, I'm hoping for something more high end than Poolparty and Kassian.

 

[Agent Zub]

If that's our only play, it's that much more impressive that teams can't stop him.

mhmm we'll see what happens this season, I'm sure opposing coaches are paying even more attention.

but come on blasting pp shots while pucks are solely being funneled to you is no where near as impressive as producing at McDavid level even strength with secondary line mates.

 

[Big Muddy]

I see there's rumors that the TBL are shopping Ryan McDonagh now. Not saying we need a LD.

But, I expect a lot of player movement this offseason as teams struggle to squeeze under the cap.

 

[Ice-Tray]

No doubt.

Over the last 3 seasons, Fiala is 22nd in the NHL in even strength scoring. He is a prolific driver of offense at 5-on-5 and that's a rare skill. Right now Norris is just a PP sniper; he doesn't create for himself and he doesn't create for others much either. He's still valuable, but less valuable than Fiala.

Fiala was invisible in our games against Minny, I wasn’t too impressed though obviously he’s a good player. I’m not sure he’s a ‘prolific driver of offence’ as you describe him.

We would never trade Norris for him one for one.

Norris is the more valuable player for us in my opinion. We’ve watched him drive in alone and score, we’ve seen him dish, and we have all obviously seen him score on the PP in a way that only a handful of layers in the NHL can (everyone knows the shot is coming).

He has lots of time to expand in his various skill sets before he reaches Fialas current age.

 

[ATdaisuki]

mhmm we'll see what happens this season, I'm sure opposing coaches are paying even more attention.

but come on blasting pp shots while pucks are solely being funneled to you is no where near as impressive as producing at McDavid level even strength with secondary line mates.

I somewhat agree on your Norris vs Fiala point, but I have to disagree on your comments about our PP. Batherson down low is a deadly passer and when everyone was healthy, Norris was either scoring at will or a decoy opening up passing lanes for Batherson. We are going to have a very strong PP1 if everyone can stay in the lineup and Norris is a big part of it.

Fiala is far better than Norris at even strength if you compare where they were this past season. Hopefully Norris can improve that aspect of his game. He has the time to do it.

 

[Ouroboros]

Fiala was invisible in our games against Minny, I wasn’t too impressed though obviously he’s a good player. I’m not sure he’s a ‘prolific driver of offence’ as you describe him.

We would never trade Norris for him one for one.

Norris is the more valuable player for us in my opinion. We’ve watched him drive in alone and score, we’ve seen him dish, and we have all obviously seen him score on the PP in a way that only a handful of layers in the NHL can (everyone knows the shot is coming).

He has lots of time to expand in his various skill sets before he reaches Fialas current age.

Invisible? He had 4 points in the 2 games including the primary assist on an OT winner after he stripped Stutzle of the puck in the defensive zone. If you didn't notice that I'm not sure what to tell you.

Don't know what to say about you questioning his output either, really. The stats are the stats - he has 129 EVP over the last 3 seasons combined. As a point of comparison that's more than Batherson and Norris have combined over the same period. Fiala has been driving offense and he's been doing it playing primarily with the likes of Freddie Gaudreau, Marcus Johansson, Eric Staal and Marcus Foligno.

Kinda just sounds like you prefer Norris because you've watched him more.

 

[SpezDispenser]

I think the thing is - even when teams KNOW Norris is getting that pass and prepare for it, including goalies, he still scores. That's a crazy shot, you can't teach that.

I don't want to do a Fiala vs Norris comparison because it's pointless. We have Norris, we're lucky to have him, let's sign him long term.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

The only real tough endeavour for Dorion should be to acquire a top 4 RD and perhaps extending Zub.

Buying out White is no brainer.
Re-signing Norris is a no brainer and won’t be too difficult.
Trading Brown should be very straight forward for a protected 1st +
Acquiring a top 6 forward should be really straightforward due to the plethora of options available. At worst we should be looking at Burakovsky.
Trading Zaitsev with sweeter should be straightforward with sweeters as we see this type of move done every summer.

With Melnyk gone and better hockey minds around him with a bright future (arena and players), it should be a busy offseason, but one that isn’t completely perplexing to a legit hockey professional.

Tkachuk-Norris-Batherson
xxxxxx-Stutzle-xxxxxxx
Formenton-Pinto-Joseph
Kelly-xxxxx-Watson

Chabot-Hamonic
Sanderson-Zub
Holden-Brannstrom
MDZ

In theory, the defence has “less holes”, but to be serious contenders for playoffs, we need to bring in a top 4 and notch down Hamonic.

Zaitsev+2nd+3rd for Petry retained 25% I can see.

 

[coladin]

I find it equally sad and inspiring that people were actually getting their hopes up for Fiala. You know this team and Dorion are being optimistic.

But we are going bargain hunting, I can feel it. It will be Kapanen from PIttsburgh, been saying all along. Personally I am glad they didn't go for Fiala, who no doubt would have had a better offer form Ottawa as far as a trade, but he was going to be a rental here. This team has so, so many picks in this draft and they can't possibly draft everyone. They will package some to get some middling players.

Gloomy, but hard to be optimistic about this team's budget. They are going to scramble just to sign the players we alreafy have and will have little left

 

[Micklebot]

Invisible? He had 4 points in the 2 games including the primary assist on an OT winner after he stripped Stutzle of the puck in the defensive zone. If you didn't notice that I'm not sure what to tell you.

His invisibility is how he was able to get an edge on us. How do you defend against a guy you can't see!

Fiala is great, and certainly ahead of Norris right now, I wasn't trying to suggest otherwise, my point was more that Norris is ahead of where Fiala was at the same age, which imo is pretty hard to argue against since at 22 Fiala was not near the player he is today. Will he get to Fiala's level? Here's hoping, but I he's off to a good start. Whether you score on the PP or at ES they all count the same when the game is over. Fun fact, Fiala actually had more PP time than Norris this year (mostly with Kaprisov), but Norris scored 11 more PP goals.