Official Coyotes 2019-2020 Roster Discussion Thread #4

Discussion in 'Arizona Coyotes' started by TheLegend, Feb 5, 2020.

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  1. XX

    XX Sticky Icky Icky

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    Sure, I just miss the days when you tried to make a cogent argument.

    Yeah, I want him gone almost solely due to his cap hit and his availability issues. It's super obnoxious to have to flip a coin every day to see if he can go. I don't even care if he's lights out. They can't keep his cap hit and his health issues are not going to go away as he gets older. Hill is a good enough backup.

    He's just not the reason the team has been sliding. At all.
     
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  2. hbk

    hbk Registered User Sponsor

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    Watch the games. Count the number of softies. It’s not hard.
     
  3. XX

    XX Sticky Icky Icky

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    As I said before: people are terrible at grading goalies...

    ... Hill has better stats than Kuemper 5v5 as of now.

    He's plenty good enough. If you want a laugh, take a look at the amount of chances and the quality of chances Hill has to deal with on the PK. Average goal distance is over 4ft closer than Kuemper.

    Hill needs to not flop around as drastically as he does at times but he has been good.
     
  4. hbk

    hbk Registered User Sponsor

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    I think Hill needs to establish himself as a elite goalie at the AHL level before I hand him the backup role full time.
     
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  5. XX

    XX Sticky Icky Icky

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    This makes zero sense because you're not going to find a better goalie for cheaper than an ELC. You don't learn to be an NHL backup against AHL players. He's also stylistically very similar to Kuemper which helps the team avoid having to make adjustments when he is in net. He has the third best GSAA/60 in the league right now ahead of Kuemper and guys like Jarry (Mike Smith has the 6th worst teehee). If he can clean up his technique then he has a great future.

    Look at the list of UFA goalies. You're not going to get a better goalie for less than Raanta money. The Coyotes don't really have the assets to be trading for one either. If Hill falls on his face then you call up Prosvetov. If they both fail, you trade for a body.
     
  6. hbk

    hbk Registered User Sponsor

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    Has he established himself as a number 1 netminder at the AHL level? Is he a finished product or are there improvements to his technique that can be fine tuned at the AHL level?
     
  7. XX

    XX Sticky Icky Icky

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    Being a #1 in the AHL doesn't matter. Some guys skip that stage due to circumstance. It's not a driving license test. Schwab and Bierk can help him the same in either place.

    They need the $3m between Raanta and Hill to pay for Kuemper's raise
    They need the difference between Stepan and Hayton to pay for Keller's raise

    These things probably have to happen even if Hall walks.

    Which clearly better goalie did you have in mind?
     
  8. hbk

    hbk Registered User Sponsor

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    I’m just saying to bring in another option in case Hill isn’t ready.

    cap is going up a minimum of $2-3 Million. I’d rather have a backup we can trust to play and give the team a chance to win when in the net then go cheap.

    my perspective is I don’t think Hill is quite yet ready for full time backup duty. He’s close but I think he has some technique issues that I’d rather see him fine tune at the AHL level. I don’t think I’m an idiot for having that opinion.
     
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  9. Jakey53

    Jakey53 Registered User

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    Raanta was injured, came back to soon, was injured again. Took awhile to get back into the groove. When or should I say IF he's healthy he's elite.
     
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  10. Jakey53

    Jakey53 Registered User

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    I agree, but I think Raanta is better with rebounds than Kuemper.
     
  11. Jamieh

    Jamieh Registered User

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    Serious question, is there any reason to believe either can be a 55 plus starter in the NHL?
     
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  12. Jakey53

    Jakey53 Registered User

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    In all honesty, Kuemper has not proven he can handle a starter role either. He had a couple so so games before he was injured.
     
  13. Mosby

    Mosby Howl On

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    Kuemper played 55 games last year.
     
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  14. Jamieh

    Jamieh Registered User

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    One time and about to turn 30. Yeah that's reassuring. They have both so far proven they are platoon goalies at best. Might be a slight risk to consider either a starter with an unproven backup.
     
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  15. SniperHF

    SniperHF You might surprise yourself

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    Kuemper is more proven than Mike Smith was before he carried us to the conference finals. Goalies are almost all timing, they don't "prove" to be starter capable before being so in the vast majority of the cases. Kuemper is as good a bet as there is in our price range. Oh and we're already paying him and the bet is made.
     
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  16. Canis Latrans

    Canis Latrans Registered User

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    I think Chayka is content with the cost and caphit for our goaltending duo. They've both shown they can play at an elite level, just that it can't be an entire season. We're going with a platoon system, and if injuries happen, the other shoulders a larger load. I don't think in the past 2 seasons we've ever had an extended period where one player wasn't nursing something at the very least, but I don't think you're going to see us run a single goalie anywhere near the of games we used to run with Smith. I assume Chayka has better data and insights leading him to go with this system, and even in the future if we have a disproportionate level of skill between the starter and backup, the backup is going to need to play a higher load than has been seen in seasons past.

    Furthermore, goalies don't draw a lot in a trades. Come expansion draft time, I presume we'll leave Raanta open as he's a year older and traditionally has been more injury prone. It wouldn't surprise me if three other teams have more appealing goaltenders available to Seattle, and he isn't selected at all. If he is selected, the pipeline looks pretty promising anyway, with Hill showing he can backup and Prosvetov developing nicely.
     
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  17. WrinkledPossum

    WrinkledPossum Play Dead

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    With how Raanta has played recently I want him back. Get rid of Stepan, Goligoski, Grabner and Oesterle to create cap space. And let Soderberg walk or bring him back on a cheap deal.
     
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  18. TheLegend

    TheLegend Megathread Gadfly

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  19. Sinurgy

    Sinurgy Uncle G

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    I'd be ok if they squeaked into the 8th spot and St. Louis was the #1 seed. I think there's opportunity for a little Stanley Cup hangover upset there.
     
  20. Edenjung

    Edenjung Registered User

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    Could we get Marleau?
    He could be a leader in the Locker room and help some of our guys.
     
  21. cobra427

    cobra427 Registered User

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    I have been saying we have had primarily a team D problem the last 25 games or so and not a goal tending problem. Raanta is injury prone, and can't be counted on for the length of a season, other than that he is a good goal tender.
     
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  22. The Feckless Puck

    The Feckless Puck Registered Loser

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    I'd love to have Marleau in our room, but I think he'd only go to a contender.

    Which is not us.
     
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  23. MIG

    MIG Undocumented User Sponsor

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    We have a 1% chance of winning the Cup. Better odds than Team USA beating the Red Army team. It could happen. :wg:
    2019-20 NHL playoff chances and standings projections
     
  24. TheLegend

    TheLegend Megathread Gadfly

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    San Jose is taking calls on both Marleau and Thorton.
     
  25. BUX7PHX

    BUX7PHX Registered User

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    I agree and it is not even about finding a cheaper guy. Much like players, reps are important. Goalies need to understand angles, positioning, etc. at a much higher level. Guaranteeing 20-40 games in the NHL too early has a "flavor of the month" type feel to it. It will be special if a good run happens where Hill is primary backup and shows spot duty. I also think that there will be some regression to a mean if he has a good showing, and the idea is that more situational time in the AHL before backup duty could (and should) raise that mean.
     
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