Post-Game Talk: Just not good enough, Jets lose 2-1

[None]

How does Chevy and Chipman listen to the diarrhea spewing from PoMo in the context of his career and say “That’s our man.”

they have to know Ehlers probably our second best player. Uber elite in certain aspects of the game like zone entries/exits. If they don’t know this team will never win because that’s not the kind of ignorance you can get away with at this level.

No idea, but I don't like the idea of trading players because they don't fit in the coach's system. It would very much be a "change for the sake of change" move to quote Chevy when he spoke about extending Maurice.

 

[FFHockey]

This place is becoming a cess pool of negativity.

It is...but how can a fan not be pissed at these results??

 

[Gabe Kupari]

If I'm moving anyone its Wheeler.. NMC be damned im asking him for a list of teams. This sends a real message

 

[pucka lucka]

#1- #4 top Jets forwards by rank

Schief

Laine

Connor

Ehlers

Nope. Looks at rates. Look at net impact.

 

[DRW204]

Probably our two most creative and dynamic players are Ehlers and Niku (when he’s playing confident).
Straightjacket Paul doesn’t like that kind of player.

Niku sure as hell accomplishes nothing with his creativity and is a crater defensively. Ehlers at least produces and has on-ice results to back it up. Guy leads this team, or is tied for the lead, in every notable 5v5 stat.

 

[GNP]

Manitoba just thumping Ontario for women's Curling Championship --makes me happy.

We need "clutch" players like that on the Jets.

 

[tbcwpg]

I agree. “Message board” or “discussion board” doesn’t mean everything will be positive all the time, especially when the team is playing poorly.

As you mentioned, we are heavily invested in the team. We are dedicated “super fans” essentially. Of course there will be emotion behind posts. It’s not all cupcakes and rainbows sometimes but I feel as long as one is being respectful to the rules of the boards and to fellow posters, then negativity (with or without emotion behind it) should most certainly be allowed.

Just my $0.02

I think there's a difference between overall negativity and over-analyzing each goal against as to who is directly responsible and why it's Maurice's fault.

Negative chat is fine as long as it doesn't involve wishing injury on certain staff members or name-calling.

It does not do well for bringing in new posters, though. Also, the PGTs after losses are double the size, at least, of those with wins. There's a certain appeal to debate what's wrong, I suppose.

 

[surixon]

Yup - nice job expanding on some of the stuff that's going through my head.
He doesn't fit MO's vision of what this team should look and play like -

I honestly didn't see anything in Ehlers's game today that should have benched him or moved him down the line up.
I did notice that the top line is now more meat and potato - in fact, so are the rest of them when you consider how our top players are now playing the game.

I'm a bit torn on this. Maurice clearly is a method coach and his method is based on predictability, straight lines and mitigating risk. In many aspects simplifying things is generally the right approach as its easier to plug and play players and predictability lends itself knowing where certain people are. One of the best players to have ever played the game is Crosby and he plays a very north south almost simplistic/almost boring offensive game at times but he is so proficient because he his incredibly efficient and doesn't waste many chances or energy.

On player development his methods have helped a number of players have good careers when talent alone wouldn't suffice.

• Armia turned into a darn good two-way player
• Same with Tanev
• Copp
• Lowry a great defensive C
• Appelton looks like he is on the Tanev path
• Harkins looks like a gritty player with some touch that will be able to play up and down the lineup
• Chariot as a complimentary stay at home dmen

With regards to skilled players most have turned into excellent players:

• Morrissey very strong two-way dmen with leadership capabilities that will put up 40 ish points with minimal PP time.
• Pionk looks to have found his game in this system as a good PP qB puck Offensive second pairing anchor
• Laine looks like he is rounding into a very strong two way multi-faceted offensive 35 plus goal scorer
• Connor a lethal in close offensive player who is great on the fore-check and cycle (Not close yet defensively)
• Roslovic showing signs of a good all around play and forechecking with some skill thrown in
• Scheifele a dynamic offensive C that when he is on is great on the forecheck and through the nz
• Wheeler's game grew to new levels under Maurice as he simplified things

Ehelers is skilled and good enough in his own end that he has success despite not fully buying in.

Notable failures:

• Petan - Highly skilled but lacked the size and mindset to really excel on the lower lines and on the forecheck in a Maurice system. I thought he performed fairly well in limited minutes from an advanced stats point of view but wasn't to Maurices liking.
• Niku isn't a failure yet but he like Petan isn't great in his end and seems to play more of a creative/risky game.

My main issues are that allowances should be made for very talented players. Its not like this is a foreign concept to him either as Buff pretty much was allowed to due his thing with impunity for years here. I think for this org to have success Maurice needs to find the right balance between his method and allowing players to be creative. If we get another dmen to play with JoMo tomorrow perhaps it allows him to open things up a bit more,

 

[10Ducky10]

If I'm moving anyone its Wheeler.. NMC be damned im asking him for a list of teams. This sends a real message

2-3 years too late...

 

[NotCommitted]

I'm not defending Wheeler , i don't think Wheeler should be on the 1st line anymore ,period . I like Ehlers and i think Maurice was trying to get another line going by putting Ehlers there .

But Maurice basically called out Ehlers. It's not about other lines, it's about Ehlers not giving him what he wants.

 

[pucka lucka]

I'm a bit torn on this. Maurice clearly is a method coach and his method is based on predictability, straight lines and mitigating risk. In many aspects simplifying things is generally the right approach as its easier to plug and play players and predictability lends itself knowing where certain people are. One of the best players to have ever played the game is Crosby and he plays a very north south almost simplistic/almost boring offensive game at times but he is so proficient because he his incredibly efficient and doesn't waste many chances or energy.

On player development his methods have helped a number of players have good careers when talent alone wouldn't suffice.

• Armia turned into a darn good two-way player
• Same with Tanev
• Copp
• Lowry a great defensive C
• Appelton looks like he is on the Tanev path
• Harkins looks like a gritty player with some touch that will be able to play up and down the lineup
• Chariot as a complimentary stay at home dmen

With regards to skilled players most have turned into excellent players:

• Morrissey very strong two-way dmen with leadership capabilities that will put up 40 ish points with minimal PP time.
• Pionk looks to have found his game in this system as a good PP qB puck Offensive second pairing anchor
• Laine looks like he is rounding into a very strong two way multi-faceted offensive 35 plus goal scorer
• Connor a lethal in close offensive player who is great on the fore-check and cycle (Not close yet defensively)
• Roslovic showing signs of a good all around play and forechecking with some skill thrown in
• Scheifele a dynamic offensive C that when he is on is great on the forecheck and through the nz
• Wheeler's game grew to new levels under Maurice as he simplified things

Ehelers is skilled and good enough in his own end that he has success despite not fully buying in.

Notable failures:

• Petan - Highly skilled but lacked the size and mindset to really excel on the lower lines and on the forecheck in a Maurice system. I thought he performed fairly well in limited minutes from an advanced stats point of view but wasn't to Maurices liking.
• Niku isn't a failure yet but he like Petan isn't great in his end and seems to play more of a creative/risky game.

My main issues are that allowances should be made for very talented players. Its not like this is a foreign concept to him either as Buff pretty much was allowed to due his thing with impunity for years here. I think for this org to have success Maurice needs to find the right balance between his method and allowing players to be creative. If we get another dmen to play with JoMo tomorrow perhaps it allows him to open things up a bit more,

In a small market when you are lucky enough to have a period of riches like our forward group a method coach is the exact opposite of what the team should have.
I wish someone could come up with a single reason why TNSE is making a competent decision on this.

 

[10Ducky10]

Manitoba just thumping Ontario for women's Curling Championship --makes me happy.

We need "clutch" players like that on the Jets.

I've known her parents for over 30 years and couldn't be happier for them.

 

[GNP]

I've known her parents for over 30 years and couldn't be happier for them.

__________________________________________________

She's certainly one sharp curler --and underrated. Been great all week, and they deserve this win, if they can hang on.

 

[Ducky10]

Yeah, that was the problem...

No kidding, lol. Lose 2-1 but it’s our crap D that cost us the game. Umm, nope.

 

[Jets 31]

But Maurice basically called out Ehlers. It's not about other lines, it's about Ehlers not giving him what he wants.

I don't know , i watched the interview again and he said what he liked from Harkins , he didn't say Ehlers by name but you could look at it as a demotion i guess . Maurice should have moved Wheeler down though not Ehlers .

 

[Jets 31]

No kidding, lol. Lose 2-1 but it’s our crap D that cost us the game. Umm, nope.

Forwards were crap but half our defenseman can't move the puck up to our forwards with decent passes , it's very frustrating .

 

[Jetfaninflorida]

Just compared their stats/60, ehlers is more productive than wheeler for most of them (not at all of them) but he isn’t even close to being twice as productive is any stat.

Admittedly, it wasn't so much a statistical twice as. It was a bit of a rant.

Ehlers is more productive even strength, about 15% more productive p/60 iirc. Then consider that Wheeler is paid what 36-38% more than Ehlers. And I'm not trying to pump Ehlers tires, I'm frustrated that he drives posession like no one else on this team, and is our best zone entry guy, generates scoring chances like tonight when no one else on the team can get a sog through, but he remains Maurice's public pinata because?

Rant off.

 

[Whodey204]

Looking at the rest of our schedule and Buffalo looks like the worst team we play over the rest of the season. Cant see this team making the playoffs.

If only that mean the coach would get the axe, but we all know that wont happen!

 

[Ducky10]

Forwards were crap but half our defenseman can't move the puck up to our forwards with decent passes , it's very frustrating .

It’s become the excuse du jour. D is the problem defensively, D is the problem offensively. Forwards didn’t finish and once again couldn’t figure out a left wing lock for 12 minutes in the 3rd.

 

[BigZ65]

I'm a bit torn on this. Maurice clearly is a method coach and his method is based on predictability, straight lines and mitigating risk. In many aspects simplifying things is generally the right approach as its easier to plug and play players and predictability lends itself knowing where certain people are. One of the best players to have ever played the game is Crosby and he plays a very north south almost simplistic/almost boring offensive game at times but he is so proficient because he his incredibly efficient and doesn't waste many chances or energy.

On player development his methods have helped a number of players have good careers when talent alone wouldn't suffice.

• Armia turned into a darn good two-way player
• Same with Tanev
• Copp
• Lowry a great defensive C
• Appelton looks like he is on the Tanev path
• Harkins looks like a gritty player with some touch that will be able to play up and down the lineup
• Chariot as a complimentary stay at home dmen

With regards to skilled players most have turned into excellent players:

• Morrissey very strong two-way dmen with leadership capabilities that will put up 40 ish points with minimal PP time.
• Pionk looks to have found his game in this system as a good PP qB puck Offensive second pairing anchor
• Laine looks like he is rounding into a very strong two way multi-faceted offensive 35 plus goal scorer
• Connor a lethal in close offensive player who is great on the fore-check and cycle (Not close yet defensively)
• Roslovic showing signs of a good all around play and forechecking with some skill thrown in
• Scheifele a dynamic offensive C that when he is on is great on the forecheck and through the nz
• Wheeler's game grew to new levels under Maurice as he simplified things

Ehelers is skilled and good enough in his own end that he has success despite not fully buying in.

Notable failures:

• Petan - Highly skilled but lacked the size and mindset to really excel on the lower lines and on the forecheck in a Maurice system. I thought he performed fairly well in limited minutes from an advanced stats point of view but wasn't to Maurices liking.
• Niku isn't a failure yet but he like Petan isn't great in his end and seems to play more of a creative/risky game.

My main issues are that allowances should be made for very talented players. Its not like this is a foreign concept to him either as Buff pretty much was allowed to due his thing with impunity for years here. I think for this org to have success Maurice needs to find the right balance between his method and allowing players to be creative. If we get another dmen to play with JoMo tomorrow perhaps it allows him to open things up a bit more,

The "allowances" are the main coaching problem with this team the past couple seasons RE 55 and 26. They have a blank cheque for their "allowance."

In terms of a guy like Petan the failure is all on him. Anyone can complain about their role, but if they lack basic skills it's on them no matter how great their special skills are, and obviously Petan can do a lot when he does have the puck. Maybe he didn't have the ability to skate better, maybe he didn't work hard enough on it in the summers, but that's what's keeping him out of the league. He's passed through waivers twice this season I believe so if anyone of 29 other GM's beyond Chevy and Dubas saw any glimpse in him they'd have taken him.

 

[Ducky10]

How many “axe the coach” posts do we need? Seriously, we all know it’s not happening. Is it a catharsis thing or something? It’s the very definition of old man yelling at cloud.

We’re getting stale folks.

 

[Naturaledge]

Couple of thoughts:
1. I liked Cody's first game
2. I thought that Harkins should have been one of the stars tonight
3. Niku not playing is absolutely puzzling to me
4. Our effort or at least, execution in the third, down a goal when we need it, was horrible
5. Finally, I was thinking, if PoMo thinks Andrew Copp is a second line Center, he should try and convince Chevy tonight before the trade deadline tomorrow - we have paid a pirates ransom for 2C's before. Does anyone think that A.C. would return a first+.... Didn't think so. As much as I really like Copp as a player, I can not see him ever centering the second line....ever.

 

[Ducky10]

The "allowances" are the main coaching problem with this team the past couple seasons RE 55 and 26. They have a blank cheque for their "allowance."

In terms of a guy like Petan the failure is all on him. Anyone can complain about their role, but if they lack basic skills it's on them no matter how great their special skills are, and obviously Petan can do a lot when he does have the puck. Maybe he didn't have the ability to skate better, maybe he didn't work hard enough on it in the summers, but that's what's keeping him out of the league. He's passed through waivers twice this season I believe so if anyone of 29 other GM's beyond Chevy and Dubas saw any glimpse in him they'd have taken him.

So what exactly do you suggest they do about 55 and 26’s allowances? Do you feel benching them will make them accountable and once they learn the errors of their ways, the others will follow them like the pied pipers?

You can’t alienate your top talent, it just doesn’t work that way.

 

[Howard Chuck]

I think you have hit the nail on the head. He is the one skilled player that really hasn't conformed and simplified his offensive game. All of the other skilled players whether it be on defense or forward now play more of a simplified north/south game with limited risk at the offensive blue line. The other skilled players also play more of a cycle game (Even Laine) then Ehlers does.

I like Ehlers but he is likely the first high impact skilled player that gets moved out if it comes to that due to Maurice preferring different attributes.

Missed the last few games, but overall this is true. We’ve lost rocket finalist Laine, who knows what has happened to top 5 Scheifele, but ehlers refuses to conform to Maurice’s ‘play it safe and simple’ game plan.

if he gets traded to a team that actually utilizes his talents, he is going to be a star.

 

[ecolad]

Couple of thoughts (non-emotional)

* It is utterly mind-blowing that, with Morrissey out, we elect to play Bitetto, instead of Niku. This left us with a lineup whereby the only D capable of moving the puck and/or generating any offense was Pionk, and we saw the result. D pairings that couldnt contribute one iota to generating scoring attacks - with no shots on net for extended periods of time when most desperately needed.

* Harkins showed very well when put with Scheifele/Wheeler and went some way towards confirming my view that Scheifele would play better flanked by 2 puck possession guys than he does flanked by 2 elite shooters. Whether this benefit justifies breaking up the Harkins/Roslovic/Appleton line is debateable but Maurice almost forced the breakup in his zeal(misplaced) to immediately start Eakins on the 3rd line.