Value of: Gudas/Simmonds package deal to Toronto

[Oryx05]

I could see a Kapanen for Simmonds swap happening if Simmonds was having a better season, and Kapanen having a worse season. Fact of the matter is Simmonds isn't having a strong year and Kapanen is. I imagine if the Leafs are looking to add some scoring and grit depth, they'd be looking to do so with Picks, or their spare parts, not a guy who's quickly solidifying himself on that team. Teams that compete for several years retain young players playing above their pay grade - which is exactly what Kapanen is doing.

I'd imagine Leafs are only looking to move Kapanen if they're getting a bonafide d-man back, someone who slots into #2/#3, young and under control as well. In this scenario, Leafs would be adding.

 

[Starat327]

I think you are discounting Simmonds.

I think the Flyers could easily get a first and a pretty solid prospect for him.

I'm admittedly a little lower on Simmonds than most. I appreciate what he brings - a great net front presence and basucally an automatic 30 goals a year. But his toughness is largely overrated, in my opinion. If we can get more, great. But i'm not going to insist that Simmonds is like 2 firsts territory.

 

[Starat327]

That’s a steeep ask... how about Willy and a 1st?

No dice. Im already selling low on Gritty at Matthews +.

 

[wankstifier]

Sure, so lets forget about Simmonds and just rarget Gudas.

You guys won't like the ask on a top 4 RHD making well under $5MM

 

[justafan22]

Gudas for Leafs 1st, Brown

 

[qqaz]

I would prefer if Toronto sticks with their forward group and spends the picks on a defender. Simmonds is great, but we have great forwards already. And I don't think Gudas is the answer on the blueline.

 

[Critical13]

What about?

Simmonds

For

Kapanen
Brown
1st round in 2019
3rd round pick in 2019

I think thats fair

I shall maybe accept a deal in which I trade expendable parts for your 20 goal scorer with intangibles, of which I'm exactly looking for.

Flyers aren't going to give Simmonds away, rental or not, the guy can score and is a beast.

Looks like some people haven't learned for the rental deals of the last few years.

The number of teams willing to give up a 1st, let alone a young player on pace for 30g and 58 points while playing top pk minutes, for a rental just don't exist anymore.

 

[StoneHands]

I'm ok with trading Simmonds and Gudas but that would instantly make the Flyers the softest team in the NHL and they're already pretty soft as it is.

 

[Tripod]

Gudas for Leafs 1st, Brown

Done

 

[JackFr]

Also as a Pens fan it makes me a bit nauseous to say but Gudas might be the most underrated defenceman in the NHL.

 

[Tripod]

Looks like some people haven't learned for the rental deals of the last few years.

The number of teams willing to give up a 1st, let alone a young player on pace for 30g and 58 points while playing top pk minutes, for a rental just don't exist anymore.

Rick Nash was traded for a 1st + a guy on pace for 53 points, just last deadline.

 

[Liferleafer]

Also as a Pens fan it makes me a bit nauseous to say but Gudas might be the most underrated defenceman in the NHL.

I agree, i really would like him in Toronto.

 

[Liferleafer]

Gudas for Leafs 1st, Brown

Come on.....Gudas doesn't land that. Brown+a later pick? Maybe....but a 1st? No.

 

[Critical13]

Rick Nash was traded for a 1st + a guy on pace for 53 points, just last deadline.

If you think Ryan Spooner (26 years old, career pace of 31points) is a a young 30g pace, 58 point pace who plays PK, then you should probably watch Ryan Spooner a little more closely

 

[StoneHands]

Looks like some people haven't learned for the rental deals of the last few years.

The number of teams willing to give up a 1st, let alone a young player on pace for 30g and 58 points while playing top pk minutes, for a rental just don't exist anymore.

Except they do.

Brassard got Ian Cole, a recent 2nd rounder and a 1st.

Nash got Spooner, Beleskey, a recent 2nd rounder, and a 1st. He retired at the end of the season.

Every year people say rental players aren't worth what teams think they're worth and then every year deals like this happen.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Why would Toronto give up a first?!?

To get a player that is needed (desired) now - simple answer. You got to give something to get something unless you are of the opinion that by offering scraps it will return something valuable.

The other option is to wait and let one of your young defenders graduate.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

My initial proposal was this:

Simmonds

For

Kapanen
Brown
1st round in 2019
3rd round pick in 2019

Objections?

We need a defender a lot more than a forward.

 

[Critical13]

Except they do.

Brassard got Ian Cole, a recent 2nd rounder and a 1st.

Nash got Spooner, Beleskey, a recent 2nd rounder, and a 1st. He retired at the end of the season.

Every year people say rental players aren't worth what teams think they're worth and then every year deals like this happen.

None of those packages even come close to Kapanen+1st+ for Simmonds.

 

[Liferleafer]

To get a player that is needed (desired) now - simple answer. You got to give something to get something unless you are of the opinion that by offering scraps it will something valuable.

The other option is to wait and let one of your young defenders graduate.

While i have no issue trading a 1st for a D upgrade, as well as liking Gudas...he just doesn't carry the value to land a 1st. A 2nd+...yup.

 

[JackFr]

I agree, i really would like him in Toronto.

Come on.....Gudas doesn't land that. Brown+a later pick? Maybe....but a 1st? No.

Wait is he super underrated or not?

If Gudas is a top 4 defenceman then as a non rental making less than 4 million bucks he should garner a 1st and something else. Connor Brown really isn't anything special at this point to be honest and definitely isn't an instrumental piece of the Leafs' success.

 

[Tripod]

If you think Ryan Spooner (26 years old, career pace of 31points) is a a young 30g pace, 58 point pace who plays PK, then you should probably watch Ryan Spooner a little more closely

No...you said "the # of teams willing to give up a 1st". I showed that just last year Boston traded a 1st+ a 53 point pace guy for Rick Nash who was on his last legs.

If you look back, I said Kap for BOTH Simmonds and Gudas. So obviously I don't think Simmonds should/can fetch Kap on his own.

But I also said the Flyers will be looking for NHL ready/already playing players vs a 1st that will maybe help 3 years from now.

 

[sxvnert]

Have a feeling Dubas will be dumb enough to sign Simmons this summer to a long term deal.

 

[JackFr]

Except they do.

Brassard got Ian Cole, a recent 2nd rounder and a 1st.

Nash got Spooner, Beleskey, a recent 2nd rounder, and a 1st. He retired at the end of the season.

Every year people say rental players aren't worth what teams think they're worth and then every year deals like this happen.

Brassard wasn't a rental and came retained down to 3 million bucks. Not comparable.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

My post was more general in nature rather than focused on the specifics of the sugggested trade. Personally I don’t mind waiting until a prospect graduates.

 

[Liferleafer]

Wait is he super underrated or not?

If Gudas is a top 4 defenceman then as a non rental making less than 4 million bucks he should garner a 1st and something else. Connor Brown really isn't anything special at this point to be honest and definitely isn't an instrumental piece of the Leafs' success.

He's underrated on here because people compare him to Polak...he's better than that. That said, he isn't a player you pay a 1st+ for. I would easily do a 2nd+ another pick/ prospect.