Value of: Gudas/Simmonds package deal to Toronto

[Sasso09]

Kapanen is also a much better player at this point in their careers. People who think the Leafs would trade Kapanen for Simmonds are insane (I'm a Flyers fan by the way).

You're a noted Simmonds hater. Very minority opinion you have. Put Simmonds with Matthews and the numbers aren't close. Simmonds is the only pure old school power forward left in the league and does a lot more than Kapanen off the score sheets

 

[Erndog]

Simmonds is easily better

Kapanen is 8 years younger... largely controllable. Simmonds is a pending UFA, likely who's best years are behind him...kapanens best years are ahead of him.

Kapanen for Simmonds is an absolute ridiculous joke. Never happening.

It's the same template every damn year.

Simmonds for a 1st and prospect/2nd.

 

[Sasso09]

No way does it favour the Leafs.
Kapanen does everything for us. Brown is a workhorse.
Everyone seems to know Simmonds is on the decline and Gudas is a bottom pairing dman that could be had for no more than a 2nd.

You're literally wrong on everything you just said. Gudas is a solid 2nd pair defenseman, Simmonds does more, so he'd do "everything ++" and Simmonds "decline " is simply him playing with Weal and losing PP time to JVR and Patrick on the top unit as all provide similar roles.

 

[Sasso09]

To the Flyers: Kasperi Kapanen and Calle Rosen
To the Leafs: Wayne Simmonds and Phillipe Myers

Wow..... just wow

 

[Tripod]

You could be right, but...

A package of Johnsson + Liljegren and a 1st is nothing to scoff about.

I agree....honestly I overlooked Lilj as he is normally listed in the "want to keeps".

I have said this before, but if I was the Leafs, I overpay for the best Dman I can get...say a Parayko or Pietrangelo and go for that cup this year. But we all know that those guys are not always available and everyone will be bidding on them. But it will be worth it.

 

[Sasso09]

Kapanen is 8 years younger... largely controllable. Simmonds is a pending UFA, likely who's best years are behind him...kapanens best years are ahead of him.

Kapanen for Simmonds is an absolute ridiculous joke. Never happening.

It's the same template every damn year.

Simmonds for a 1st and prospect/2nd.

You're wrong, period. Rarely do these situations happen where it's not a sign and trade. IF Simmonds refused to sign and was a UFA, sure you're right. That won't be the case and Simmonds signed at 6.5 holds more value than Kap. He's a nice point producer playing in an idea situation but otherwise hollow in comparison to what Simmonds brings.

 

[Tripod]

Simmonds is easily better

Disagree.

I would take Kapanen over Simmonds now even if the contracts were the same. With Simmonds being a UFA, it's Kapanen.

 

[Erndog]

You're wrong, period. Rarely do these situations happen where it's not a sign and trade. IF Simmonds refused to sign and was a UFA, sure you're right. That won't be the case and Simmonds signed at 6.5 holds more value than Kap. He's a nice point producer playing in an idea situation but otherwise hollow in comparison to what Simmonds brings.

Let's bookmark this for the end of February shall we?

 

[Erndog]

You're wrong, period. Rarely do these situations happen where it's not a sign and trade. IF Simmonds refused to sign and was a UFA, sure you're right. That won't be the case and Simmonds signed at 6.5 holds more value than Kap. He's a nice point producer playing in an idea situation but otherwise hollow in comparison to what Simmonds brings.

I also love how I'm wrong when everything I said is pretty much fact.

Kapanen is 8 years younger. Fact.

Kapanen is controllable (RFA) while Simmomds is a pending UFA. Fact.

Simmomds best years are *likely* behind him. Fact

Kapanens best years are *likely* ahead of him. Fact.

Same template every year. A 1st (or recent first) and a 2nd or b level prospect. You can do the research yourself but this is a pretty standard package for players of this ilk.

Pretty much spot on I'd say.

 

[Starat327]

You'll have to forgive me if I don't trust the talent evaluation of a guy who consistently gets his facts mixed up since the Flyers were also getting a first round pick in the deal. You are in a desperate need of some new material homie.

You wanted Duclair as the main piece in the deal for someone who you thought topped out as a 2C.

It doesnt matter how you spin it, 'homie' your talen evaluation is suspect at best.

 

[DougGilmour93]

You're wrong, period. Rarely do these situations happen where it's not a sign and trade. IF Simmonds refused to sign and was a UFA, sure you're right. That won't be the case and Simmonds signed at 6.5 holds more value than Kap. He's a nice point producer playing in an idea situation but otherwise hollow in comparison to what Simmonds brings.

Nobody signs Simmonds at this stage of the game at 6.5. Nobody.

 

[Erndog]

You're wrong, period. Rarely do these situations happen where it's not a sign and trade. IF Simmonds refused to sign and was a UFA, sure you're right. That won't be the case and Simmonds signed at 6.5 holds more value than Kap. He's a nice point producer playing in an idea situation but otherwise hollow in comparison to what Simmonds brings.

Ladd for a 1st and prospect Marko Dano.

Mcdonagh last year for a 1st and a recent 2nd rounder (and namestnikov and Miller offset)

Eric Staal for 2 seconds and a B level prospect

Martin Hanzal for a 1st, 2nd and 4th.

Shattenkirk for a 1st and a couple minor leaguers.

Evander Kane for a conditional 1st and another conditional pick.

Iginla went several years ago to Pitt for a 1st and a couple college prospects.

Vermette to Chicago when the won a cup for a 1st rounder.

Rick Nash last year for Spooner and a conditional pick or two.

These are just off the top of my head for recent high profile rentals. There is ZERO template for getting a player of Kapanens caliber. NONE.

As I said the template is the same. It's a 1st, a 2nd/prospect and maybe another late pick. Same thing every year.

Sorry but you're wrong, period.

 

[The Madrigal]

You wanted Duclair as the main piece in the deal for someone who you thought topped out as a 2C.

It doesnt matter how you spin it, 'homie' your talen evaluation is suspect at best.

So in other words, facts are just a silly little inconvenience to you....got it

 

[The Madrigal]

Ladd for a 1st and prospect Marko Dano.

Mcdonagh last year for a 1st and a recent 2nd rounder (and namestnikov and Miller offset)

Eric Staal for 2 seconds and a B level prospect

Martin Hanzal for a 1st, 2nd and 4th.

Shattenkirk for a 1st and a couple minor leaguers.

Evander Kane for a conditional 1st and another conditional pick.

Iginla went several years ago to Pitt for a 1st and a couple college prospects.

Vermette to Chicago when the won a cup for a 1st rounder.

Rick Nash last year for Spooner and a conditional pick or two.

These are just off the top of my head for recent high profile rentals. There is ZERO template for getting a player of Kapanens caliber. NONE.

As I said the template is the same. It's a 1st, a 2nd/prospect and maybe another late pick. Same thing every year.

Sorry but you're wrong, period.

You would be correct. Simmonds and especially Gudas are being overvalued just a little bit here. On a playoff team Gudas doesn't sniff top four minutes unless there are significant injuries and while Simmonds should return something pretty good (first round pick and a prospect OR additional pick) no chance in hell the Leafs are moving Kapanen for him.

 

[hector morrison]

Disagree.

I would take Kapanen over Simmonds now even if the contracts were the same. With Simmonds being a UFA, it's Kapanen.

World class speed ,youth, expanding his offensive talents...easily beats slower, older, tough,production on the decline. I think Toronto could use the sandpaper that Simmonds brings,but Kappy is just getting stared,so no ,it isn't a worthwhile trade.

 

[Starat327]

So in other words, facts are just a silly little inconvenience to you....got it

I hear this a lot, and yet Couturier has never even been nominated for the award once. His ability as a shutdown center is overblown. He's good in that role but he's no Bergeron, Kopitar, Toews, Kesler, etc and doesn't score like them either.

Yeah, Anthony Duclair, the guy who in his first full NHL season already produced more goals and points in a single season than Sean Couturier did in six.

Duclair career high at 20 goals a 20 years old

Couturier career high 16 goals at 24 years old

You like to ignore facts when they don't suit your BS argument do you.

On a team who struggles to score goals, and is about to have more center depth (after the draft) than at wing, I would prefer to have the productive goal scoring winger on my team than the shutdown/defensive 3rd line center. I guess that makes me a stupid fan though who should get lost. Just my opinion.

Giroux
Patrick / Hischier
Filppula

Looks like pretty decent center depth to me

If you call averaging 15 goals and 35-40 points "scoring," than sure he is an offensive machine. I expect more than that out of someone who is supposed to be a second line center and given those opportunities. Before you launch into the tired old narrative about how he produces like a 2nd line center at even strength, the vast majority of 2nd line centers are productive on their team's power play. Sometimes (get this) they even play and produce on their team's first PP unit. Couturier brings very little to the table on the power play which comes with the territory for what some Flyers fans think/wish he was, whether you like it or not.

Take a lap, my man. Take several. In fact, just keep running until i say stop.

 

[SnS]

Adios.