Daniel & Henrik Sedin Thread - Part III (MOD Notice Post # 53)

[vancityluongo]

Funny thing is if one of them ever did snap and deck someone they'd be criticized for losing their temper.

 

[y2kcanucks]

Funny thing is if one of them ever did snap and deck someone they'd be criticized for losing their temper.

Not at all. But why does it have to be this extreme? I don't think anyone will criticize them for defending themselves. In fact I think they would finally gain some respect. It's clear they aren't too respected around the league, and have become the butt end of jokes among several different players and people.

 

[vancityluongo]

Because that's what the media says about most star players that aren't always edgy? Uncharacteristic physical play is usually a sign of frustration. And frustration = not clutch (unless it = intangibles and leadership).

Anyways, the day they focus on defending themselves rather than trying to score is probably the day they're too old and slow to play in the NHL. I'd rather watch them score 70 points while being Lady Byng worthy players (not that they'd ever get it, because you're right no one respects them) than 40 point muckers.

Is Patrick Kane any less of a player for never "defending himself?"

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Not at all. But why does it have to be this extreme? I don't think anyone will criticize them for defending themselves. In fact I think they would finally gain some respect. It's clear they aren't too respected around the league, and have become the butt end of jokes among several different players and people.

Daniel was hung out to dry by the locals when he went after Bolland in 2010. I liked it, but he got a penalty. I don't understand how known rats like Bolland got so much leeway for so long.

Because that's what the media says about most star players that aren't always edgy? Uncharacteristic physical play is usually a sign of frustration. And frustration = not clutch (unless it = intangibles and leadership).

It's only clutch if your team wins (e.g. Toews throwing a **** fit in the penalty box in Detroit, 2013). It's acceptable to not have a large part in the actual winning, just show some emotion and you're good I guess.

 

[y2kcanucks]

Because that's what the media says about most star players that aren't always edgy? Uncharacteristic physical play is usually a sign of frustration. And frustration = not clutch (unless it = intangibles and leadership).

Anyways, the day they focus on defending themselves rather than trying to score is probably the day they're too old and slow to play in the NHL. I'd rather watch them score 70 points while being Lady Byng worthy players (not that they'd ever get it, because you're right no one respects them) than 40 point muckers.

Is Patrick Kane any less of a player for never "defending himself?"

Except Kane does defend himself. He isn't going to stand there and let someone else just punch him in the face. He isn't going to just stand there and let someone crosscheck him over and over again, and then proceed to pick up the guy's stick and hand it back to him. That's gutless and disgusting, and I have zero respect for that.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Except Kane does defend himself. He isn't going to stand there and let someone else just punch him in the face. He isn't going to just stand there and let someone crosscheck him over and over again, and then proceed to pick up the guy's stick and hand it back to him. That's gutless and disgusting, and I have zero respect for that.

The schoolyard bully isn't going to pick on someone who stands their ground. They want to go after the guys who won't show any resistance.

 

[y2kcanucks]

Daniel was hung out to dry by the locals when he went after Bolland in 2010. I liked it, but he got a penalty. I don't understand how known rats like Bolland got so much leeway for so long.

Probably because he wasn't really doing much of anything that series. Bolland had successfully shut down the Sedins. It wasn't really an act of defending oneself, it was seen more as him letting out his frustrations because he couldn't generate anything offensively.

 

[vancityluongo]

Except Kane does defend himself. He isn't going to stand there and let someone else just punch him in the face. He isn't going to just stand there and let someone crosscheck him over and over again, and then proceed to pick up the guy's stick and hand it back to him. That's gutless and disgusting, and I have zero respect for that.

You've played sports, no? It takes a hundred times more guts and professionalism to stand there and take a punch than to just get angry and punch back. Or keep your cool and maintain sportsmanship when some rat ass punk is trying to get you off your game. Anyone can throw a fit and deck a guy. There's a reason why former junior superstars who can't cut it in the NHL in the same role have to adapt and become pests.

In any case, Kane might throw a blind haymaker when he gets pushed, but he's out of the scrum within 3 seconds while Shaw, Keith, etc. take over. Hardly defending himself, and that's certainly more cowardly than actually taking punches.

What you're talking about essentially boils down to that it looks cooler on TV to see your teams star player play tough guy. Reality TV exists for those dramatic narratives.

 

[vancityluongo]

Not at all. But why does it have to be this extreme? I don't think anyone will criticize them for defending themselves. In fact I think they would finally gain some respect. It's clear they aren't too respected around the league, and have become the butt end of jokes among several different players and people.

Probably because he wasn't really doing much of anything that series. Bolland had successfully shut down the Sedins. It wasn't really an act of defending oneself, it was seen more as him letting out his frustrations because he couldn't generate anything offensively.

Weird...

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Probably because he wasn't really doing much of anything that series. Bolland had successfully shut down the Sedins. It wasn't really an act of defending oneself, it was seen more as him letting out his frustrations because he couldn't generate anything offensively.

Thus proving this train of though correct, no?

Because that's what the media says about most star players that aren't always edgy? Uncharacteristic physical play is usually a sign of frustration. And frustration = not clutch (unless it = intangibles and leadership).

Sedins are damned if they do, damned if they don't IMO

 

[y2kcanucks]

Thus proving this train of though correct, no?

Not at all. They deserved to be criticized for not doing their jobs. If they're scoring, and also defending themselves when being attacked (punched in the face is a good example) I don't think anyone would criticize them.

 

[y2kcanucks]

You've played sports, no? It takes a hundred times more guts and professionalism to stand there and take a punch than to just get angry and punch back. Or keep your cool and maintain sportsmanship when some rat ass punk is trying to get you off your game. Anyone can throw a fit and deck a guy. There's a reason why former junior superstars who can't cut it in the NHL in the same role have to adapt and become pests.

In any case, Kane might throw a blind haymaker when he gets pushed, but he's out of the scrum within 3 seconds while Shaw, Keith, etc. take over. Hardly defending himself, and that's certainly more cowardly than actually taking punches.

What you're talking about essentially boils down to that it looks cooler on TV to see your teams star player play tough guy. Reality TV exists for those dramatic narratives.

Not at all.

And it doesn't take guts and professionalism to let let someone punch you in the face over and over again without defending yourself. It's completely gutless to do so, and I have no respect for that. I also have no respect for that roster of guys who did nothing about it.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Not at all. They deserved to be criticized for not doing their jobs. If they're scoring, and also defending themselves when being attacked (punched in the face is a good example) I don't think anyone would criticize them.

What do they do if they are being attacked and not scoring?

 

[Dana Murzyn]

Except Kane does defend himself. He isn't going to stand there and let someone else just punch him in the face. He isn't going to just stand there and let someone crosscheck him over and over again, and then proceed to pick up the guy's stick and hand it back to him. That's gutless and disgusting, and I have zero respect for that.

What's gutless and pathetic are the initial acts -- the face-punching and cross-checks. You've got it exactly backwards.

You should enjoy this time while it lasts. The NHL is due to emerge from the 1970s pretty soon.

 

[y2kcanucks]

What do they do if they are being attacked and not scoring?

Continue to defend themselves, but at the same time they still deserve criticism for their play.

I seem to recall the play you're talking about though. Daniel was in the goal with Bolland and took his gloves off and started throwing punches. It legitimately looked like he had lost his cool. I personally didn't mind it, but I could see how people would interpret it as him losing his cool.

What I'm more talking about are the plays where Marchand stands there punching him in the face. Or when Wideman crosschecks him repeatedly. Or when Thornton puts his glove in Henrik's face. Or when Eager takes blatant runs at him. And yeah, if Bolland is going to be chippy like that then spear him, right in the gut.

I think the player I want is Corey Perry.

 

[y2kcanucks]

What's gutless and pathetic are the initial acts -- the face-punching and cross-checks. You've got it exactly backwards.

You should enjoy this time while it lasts. The NHL is due to emerge from the 1970s pretty soon.

Those players are going to do it because they know they don't have to answer the bell. Nobody from this team is going to do anything, and the Sedins are just going to stand there and take it.

I imagine it's very disheartening seeing these guys as leaders and watching them stand there and let other people just pummel them.

 

[vancityluongo]

Not at all. They deserved to be criticized for not doing their jobs. If they're scoring, and also defending themselves when being attacked (punched in the face is a good example) I don't think anyone would criticize them.

Wonder why we're hearing about Steven Stamkos' "physicality" right now? It has a little something to do with his lack of scoring...

Henrik Sedin is not Eric Lindros or Mario Lemieux. There's a reason why scoring powerforwards are so coveted.

And again. I agree that the Sedins would need to be/were rightly criticized for not doing their jobs, primarily scoring. So I'd expect them to nut up, take a punch, draw a powerplay and score on it. I would expect Derek Dorsett to do all that ******** of "setting the tone" and having a "physical presence" because that's his role, not Daniel Sedin's.

Not at all.

And it doesn't take guts and professionalism to let let someone punch you in the face over and over again without defending yourself. It's completely gutless to do so, and I have no respect for that. I also have no respect for that roster of guys who did nothing about it.

Well we've had different definitions of gutless for the better part of a decade, so it's not going to change now. I respect the **** out of how nonchalant the Sedins are when getting hit with punches from goons. Much more than I respect the Toews' of the world who throw hissy fits at the slightest contact, face wash a guy with their glove and skate away to let someone else deal with it.

 

[Dana Murzyn]

Those players are going to do it because they know they don't have to answer the bell. Nobody from this team is going to do anything, and the Sedins are just going to stand there and take it.

I imagine it's very disheartening seeing these guys as leaders and watching them stand there and let other people just pummel them.

In every other circumstance on earth, attacking someone who you know won't fight back is recognized as gutless and pathetic.

But not in hockey, according you. Because, as ever, you have it totally backwards.

 

[y2kcanucks]

Wonder why we're hearing about Steven Stamkos' "physicality" right now? It has a little something to do with his lack of scoring...

Henrik Sedin is not Eric Lindros or Mario Lemieux. There's a reason why scoring powerforwards are so coveted.

And again. I agree that the Sedins would need to be/were rightly criticized for not doing their jobs, primarily scoring. So I'd expect them to nut up, take a punch, draw a powerplay and score on it. I would expect Derek Dorsett to do all that ******** of "setting the tone" and having a "physical presence" because that's his role, not Daniel Sedin's.



Well we've had different definitions of gutless for the better part of a decade, so it's not going to change now. I respect the **** out of how nonchalant the Sedins are when getting hit with punches from goons. Much more than I respect the Toews' of the world who throw hissy fits at the slightest contact, face wash a guy with their glove and skate away to let someone else deal with it.

Toews has 2 Cups, and on his way to a possible 3rd. He also has a Conn Smythe. The Sedins have......?

 

[y2kcanucks]

In every other circumstance on earth, attacking someone who you know won't fight back is recognized as gutless and pathetic.

But not in hockey, according you. Because, as ever, you have it totally backwards.

Hockey is a physical sport. Our "leaders" cower at the sight of physicality. It's also a main reason we lost the Calgary series, and a main reason why we've been everyone's ***** in the first round of every recent playoff series. At the sight of physical play, our best players cower and wilt.

 

[vancityluongo]

Continue to defend themselves, but at the same time they still deserve criticism for their play.

I seem to recall the play you're talking about though. Daniel was in the goal with Bolland and took his gloves off and started throwing punches. It legitimately looked like he had lost his cool. I personally didn't mind it, but I could see how people would interpret it as him losing his cool.

What I'm more talking about are the plays where Marchand stands there punching him in the face. Or when Wideman crosschecks him repeatedly. Or when Thornton puts his glove in Henrik's face. Or when Eager takes blatant runs at him. And yeah, if Bolland is going to be chippy like that then spear him, right in the gut.

I think the player I want is Corey Perry.

Corey Perry is up there with the Sedins for being able to keep his cool. I don't think I've seen the guy retailiate ever. He's just such an absolute **** disturber that he usually initiates before anyone has a chance to cross check him first.

I also like how "spear him in the gut" shows toughness. That's a disgusting, cheap, GUTLESS play.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Continue to defend themselves, but at the same time they still deserve criticism for their play.

I seem to recall the play you're talking about though. Daniel was in the goal with Bolland and took his gloves off and started throwing punches. It legitimately looked like he had lost his cool. I personally didn't mind it, but I could see how people would interpret it as him losing his cool.

What I'm more talking about are the plays where Marchand stands there punching him in the face. Or when Wideman crosschecks him repeatedly. Or when Thornton puts his glove in Henrik's face. Or when Eager takes blatant runs at him. And yeah, if Bolland is going to be chippy like that then spear him, right in the gut.

I think the player I want is Corey Perry.

Corey Perry is a ****-disturbing dick. I don't think the Sedins could ever be that, but some push-back would be nice. Daniel should've decked Marchand, no doubt. Henrik did the right thing with Thornton, the refs were idiots about it though. Should've got 2 for unsportsmanlike. We punished SJ for Eager.

The play re: Bolland is where Bolland and Daniel line up for a faceoff and he runs his stick down the back of Daniel's calf, scraping it. Daniel then goes Super Saiyan on Bolland and 2 for roughing. My problem is why don't the 2 refs that are just sitting there supposedly with their thumbs up their arses not notice this? It's bush league.

 

[vancityluongo]

Toews has 2 Cups, and on his way to a possible 3rd. He also has a Conn Smythe. The Sedins have......?

Art Ross x 2, Hart, Lindsay, President's Trophy x 2. Almost like you aren't even paying attention!

Joe Thornton then. And you really think if Daniel facewashes or spears Keith/Marchand that the Canucks would have a cup or two?

 

[vancityluongo]

Hockey is a physical sport. Our "leaders" cower at the sight of physicality. It's also a main reason we lost the Calgary series, and a main reason why we've been everyone's ***** in the first round of every recent playoff series. At the sight of physical play, our best players cower and wilt.

Sean Monahan, Johnny Gaudreau and Jiri Hudler sure are towering pillars of physical dominance.

 

[y2kcanucks]

And this is exactly why the Canucks had a reputation for being whiny. Rather than settling it on the ice we question why the refs don't do anything.