Rumor: Zetterberg’s contract to Tampa

[Bench]

Stamkos and 1st if we are throwing out unrealistic options.

Stamkos still has positive value. He's still a 30-40 goal scorer signed to $8.5 until 2024. When you compare his deal to some of the newer ones like Jamie Benn... gimmie Stamkos all day long.

If I'm Tampa, I'd rather move draft picks than give up on Stammer during their best cap window.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Stamkos and 1st if we are throwing out unrealistic options.

Stamkos for top 1 protected pick from Detroit. Solves all of Tampa's cap woes. They get a potentially #2 or 3 overall pick. Red Wings get a legit superstar 1C.

If the Wings win the lottery, they keep it, but get 2 or 3, goes to Tampa. I'd trade Lucas Raymond today for Steven Stamkos at 8.5M.

Meh, f*** it. Unprotected 2021 1st straight up. If we win the lottery, I still like Stamkos better than whatever guy is there.

 

[Bench]

Stamkos for top 1 protected pick from Detroit. Solves all of Tampa's cap woes. They get a potentially #2 or 3 overall pick. Red Wings get a legit superstar 1C.

If the Wings win the lottery, they keep it, but get 2 or 3, goes to Tampa. I'd trade Lucas Raymond today for Steven Stamkos at 8.5M.

Meh, f*** it. Unprotected 2021 1st straight up. If we win the lottery, I still like Stamkos better than whatever guy is there.

You're going to get soooooo blasted for trading for a guy that's over 30 and likely going to die of old age in the next couple years.

The key to acceptable team building is only adding impact players all at once when all your prospects perfectly peak at the same time.

 

[Gniwder]

Oh I'm sure Stamkos, who was scoring at a measly 42 goal pace last year, and at the ancient age of *checks notes* uhh... 30... is ready to just sit the season out after watching his team lift the Cup without him.

Barring any other LTIR money, Stamkos would have to sit about about 2/3 of the season. Just in time to get ready for the playoffs. There's no salary cap or roster limits post season.

The whole point is that he would do it TO WIN ANOTHER CUP, not to sit out.

... and as far as Ezekial's point.... how do you prove that an muscle tear is healed? You can't. If he agrees to sit out, the league can't prove he's not injured, especially considering groin tears have ended a few careers.

 

[Bench]

... and as far as Ezekial's point.... how do you prove that an muscle tear is healed? You can't.

Imaging of hip and thigh muscle injury: a pictorial review | Insights into Imaging | Full Text

MRI is a more elaborate imaging technique that is considered the reference standard for muscle injuries. It allows for an excellent depiction of the most relevant findings in muscle injuries [6] and has a high sensitivity in identifying acute and chronic soft tissue alteration [16].

 

[MBH]

Stamkos for top 1 protected pick from Detroit. Solves all of Tampa's cap woes. They get a potentially #2 or 3 overall pick. Red Wings get a legit superstar 1C.

If the Wings win the lottery, they keep it, but get 2 or 3, goes to Tampa. I'd trade Lucas Raymond today for Steven Stamkos at 8.5M.

Meh, f*** it. Unprotected 2021 1st straight up. If we win the lottery, I still like Stamkos better than whatever guy is there.

Wrong move for this franchise at this point.
Even if Stamkos were healthy, I wouldn't do it.
Feels like a Rangers/Leafs kind of move.

 

[jkutswings]

Imaging of hip and thigh muscle injury: a pictorial review | Insights into Imaging | Full Text

You can't use your high-falootin camera to tell me I'm not hurt! I gots cap money to save...err, I mean I'm in pain and agony here! Ohhh, the totally legitimate and immune from all challenge or litigation agony!

 

[Gniwder]

Imaging of hip and thigh muscle injury: a pictorial review | Insights into Imaging | Full Text

Didn't a groin injury end Weiss' career? How about Brooks Laich? MRI didn't help either player. There are issues that don't show up on MRI.

There are lots of other cases with NHL players.

 

[kliq]

Didn't a groin injury end Weiss' career? How about Brooks Laich? MRI didn't help either player. There are issues that don't show up on MRI.

There are lots of other cases with NHL players.

Wasn’t Weiss’s injury hernia related? If so, I’m pretty sure those never fully heal. I’m no expert though. I think the exact type of injury is a huge factor in all this, and I’m not sure exactly what Stamkos had and what the risk of reoccurrence is.

Regardless, I wouldn’t do it given where we are as a franchise and where he is as a player.

 

[TheOtherOne]

You're going to get soooooo blasted for trading for a guy that's over 30 and likely going to die of old age in the next couple years.

The key to acceptable team building is only adding impact players all at once when all your prospects perfectly peak at the same time.

Okay hear me out.

From Det: Everyone not named Moritz
To Det: The top 20 players in the world who were born in the same year as Moritz

Which team adds/subtracts?

 

[jkutswings]

Okay hear me out.

From Det: Everyone not named Moritz
To Det: The top 20 players in the world who were born in the same year as Moritz

Which team adds/subtracts?

Hey! I'm the heart and soul of this team! You're not dealing me anywhere!

Oh wait. You said Moritz. Carry on then.

 

[Gniwder]

Wasn’t Weiss’s injury hernia related? If so, I’m pretty sure those never fully heal. I’m no expert though. I think the exact type of injury is a huge factor in all this, and I’m not sure exactly what Stamkos had and what the risk of reoccurrence is.

Regardless, I wouldn’t do it given where we are as a franchise and where he is as a player.

Listed as a groin injury, not hernia. Typically a hernia is listed as such, since it's a protrusion of an organ through the abdominal wall. It was Draper that had a sports hernia (2010).
(I knew a guy so fat, he had a hernia and didn't even realize it, lol.)

Brooks Laich had tightness in the muscle after surgery and never made a full recovery. Basically skated like Abby after the surgery, traded to Toronto as a salary dump (2nd rd pick included). Made way for Ovy to be Captain.

It's just presumptuous to say he had surgery, so he has to be ready to play the season. I'm almost certain he'll start the season on LTIR (10 games and 24 days), or otherwise Brise would have made a deal by now. I can't say how he's going to resolve his cap issue, because I agree sitting Stamkos out for 2/3 of a season is a bit much.

If Cernak and Cirelli agree to $2.25M bridge contracts, Stmakos would only have to sit out half the season, and that would be workable. Then they can deal with Seattle, that actually needs guys like TJ, Killorn, etc. I've looked at the mock draft, and not many scorers are available.

 

[Oddbob]

Barring any other LTIR money, Stamkos would have to sit about about 2/3 of the season. Just in time to get ready for the playoffs. There's no salary cap or roster limits post season.

The whole point is that he would do it TO WIN ANOTHER CUP, not to sit out.

... and as far as Ezekial's point.... how do you prove that an muscle tear is healed? You can't. If he agrees to sit out, the league can't prove he's not injured, especially considering groin tears have ended a few careers.

No high compete athlete is agreeing to sit out, when they are healthy enough to play. If he is hurt that is one thing, he isn't sitting out if he is healthy as is currently presumed by Lightning fans.

 

[Gniwder]

No high compete athlete is agreeing to sit out, when they are healthy enough to play. If he is hurt that is one thing, he isn't sitting out if he is healthy as is currently presumed by Lightning fans.

Looking into this further, it's his SECOND surgery. His first surgery was in March and he reaggravated the injury:

"Stamkos underwent core muscle surgery March 2, which had an initial recovery timeline of six to eight weeks. He rejoined his teammates for voluntary training sessions in July, but then suffered several setbacks that have kept him out of the lineup."

So 4 months after the initial surgery, he reaggravated it. His second surgery was in October, so 4 months would be the beginning of Feb. Seems appropriate. Plus he could practice with the team while wearing a no contact jersey.

Should be easy to talk him into it, it decreases the likelihood of reinjury during the regular season, so he can actually play in the post season and earn the Cup by playing more than 3 minutes. Granted his G/60 in the Cup Final is over 20.

Edit: Seriously, who's going to argue cap circumvention when he's already had complications from his initial surgery?

 

[Oddbob]

Looking into this further, it's his SECOND surgery. His first surgery was in March and he reaggravated the injury:

"Stamkos underwent core muscle surgery March 2, which had an initial recovery timeline of six to eight weeks. He rejoined his teammates for voluntary training sessions in July, but then suffered several setbacks that have kept him out of the lineup."

So 4 months after the initial surgery, he reaggravated it. His second surgery was in October, so 4 months would be the beginning of Feb. Seems appropriate. Plus he could practice with the team while wearing a no contact jersey.

Should be easy to talk him into it, it decreases the likelihood of reinjury during the regular season, so he can actually play in the post season and earn the Cup by playing more than 3 minutes. Granted his G/60 in the Cup Final is over 20.

Edit: Seriously, who's going to argue cap circumvention when he's already had complications from his initial surgery?

Yes, but that is all negated by the fact that NHL players want to actually play when they can. They aren't getting talked into sitting if they are healthy enough to play. Imagine telling Steve Yzerman when he was playing, you know what Steve, we really need the cap right now, can you please sit out 40 games so we can work out the cap!

 

[Gniwder]

Yes, but that is all negated by the fact that NHL players want to actually play when they can. They aren't getting talked into sitting if they are healthy enough to play. Imagine telling Steve Yzerman when he was playing, you know what Steve, we really need the cap right now, can you please sit out 40 games so we can work out the cap!

Stevie missed a bunch of games due to injury, especially 2002 season (played 16 games).

Keep in mind Stamkos actually has a serious injury that he's already reaggravated. Doesn't seem like a stretch to sit him out half the season. I would imagine he'd rather play in the postseason than regular season.

His situation already sounds like Laich's injury, had multiple surgeries, never healed right. One of the complications with muscle repair is tightness, which can impact skating. Laich never got over it.

Plus, I'm not even sure where the 6 - 8 week recovery time is coming from. I tore a muscle, it took me a full year to recover 100%. 6-8 weeks sounds like when the pain recedes, not when you gain 100% muscle function.

I'm willing to bet Brise already has a prognosis on his recovery, and that's why he hasn't made any deals yet.

 

[Oddbob]

Stevie missed a bunch of games due to injury, especially 2002 season (played 16 games).

Keep in mind Stamkos actually has a serious injury that he's already reaggravated. Doesn't seem like a stretch to sit him out half the season. I would imagine he'd rather play in the postseason than regular season.

His situation already sounds like Laich's injury, had multiple surgeries, never healed right. One of the complications with muscle repair is tightness, which can impact skating. Laich never got over it.

Plus, I'm not even sure where the 6 - 8 week recovery time is coming from. I tore a muscle, it took me a full year to recover 100%. 6-8 weeks sounds like when the pain recedes, not when you gain 100% muscle function.

I'm willing to bet Brise already has a prognosis on his recovery, and that's why he hasn't made any deals yet.

You keep going to that he already re-aggravated his injury. None of that matters if he is currently healthy. Same as Steve in 2002, if he was healthy he would have played, and so will Stamkos. Most NHL players aren't sitting out to help their team be cap compliant. Again, if he is hurt that is one thing, if not it is absurd to think they would sit in this scenario.

 

[Gniwder]

You keep going to that he already re-aggravated his injury. None of that matters if he is currently healthy. Same as Steve in 2002, if he was healthy he would have played, and so will Stamkos. Most NHL players aren't sitting out to help their team be cap compliant. Again, if he is hurt that is one thing, if not it is absurd to think they would sit in this scenario.

Healthy is not a yes or no question buddy, it's a scale. There's no way he's 100% healthy yet.

He's still got a few more playing years left, I don't see why he would risk it unless he's 100% healthy. The team will make the playoffs with or without him.

Like I said, my injury history and also having been a Caps fan when Laich's injury ended his career, I'd advise caution regardless of the cap. My injury was less serious than his (did not require surgery), but it took me one full year before I was top speed. I was running at about 80% speed in about 4 months, I don't think 80% is good enough for pro hockey.

 

[kliq]

Listed as a groin injury, not hernia. Typically a hernia is listed as such, since it's a protrusion of an organ through the abdominal wall. It was Draper that had a sports hernia (2010).
(I knew a guy so fat, he had a hernia and didn't even realize it, lol.)

Brooks Laich had tightness in the muscle after surgery and never made a full recovery. Basically skated like Abby after the surgery, traded to Toronto as a salary dump (2nd rd pick included). Made way for Ovy to be Captain.

It's just presumptuous to say he had surgery, so he has to be ready to play the season. I'm almost certain he'll start the season on LTIR (10 games and 24 days), or otherwise Brise would have made a deal by now. I can't say how he's going to resolve his cap issue, because I agree sitting Stamkos out for 2/3 of a season is a bit much.

If Cernak and Cirelli agree to $2.25M bridge contracts, Stmakos would only have to sit out half the season, and that would be workable. Then they can deal with Seattle, that actually needs guys like TJ, Killorn, etc. I've looked at the mock draft, and not many scorers are available.

No Weiss had a hernia, maybe it was one of many issues, but he did and that was the injury that messed his career up:
Red Wings' Stephen Weiss to have sports hernia surgery

I dont disagree with your Stamkos take in the sense that he may not be ready and that LTIR could be an option, I'm just saying his issue is a bit different then the others.

 

[Gniwder]

No Weiss had a hernia, maybe it was one of many issues, but he did and that was the injury that messed his career up:
Red Wings' Stephen Weiss to have sports hernia surgery

I dont disagree with your Stamkos take in the sense that he may not be ready and that LTIR could be an option, I'm just saying his issue is a bit different then the others.

Might of been both since he missed games in 2014 as well. If it was the hernia again, they would have done a second operation. Hernia means your guts are hanging outside your abs.... they have to do surgery.

 

[kliq]

Might of been both since he missed games in 2014 as well. If it was the hernia again, they would have done a second operation. Hernia means your guts are hanging outside your abs.... they have to do surgery.

Ya, Wiess was a mess physically. Got to feel bad for the guy.

 

[Oddbob]

Healthy is not a yes or no question buddy, it's a scale. There's no way he's 100% healthy yet.

He's still got a few more playing years left, I don't see why he would risk it unless he's 100% healthy. The team will make the playoffs with or without him.

Like I said, my injury history and also having been a Caps fan when Laich's injury ended his career, I'd advise caution regardless of the cap. My injury was less serious than his (did not require surgery), but it took me one full year before I was top speed. I was running at about 80% speed in about 4 months, I don't think 80% is good enough for pro hockey.

The argument isn't whether he is or isn't healthy, it is you implying that if healthy he would be talked into taking more time off, which I highly highly doubt would ever happen. All I'm saying is IF healthy he will be playing.

 

[Gniwder]

The argument isn't whether he is or isn't healthy, it is you implying that if healthy he would be talked into taking more time off, which I highly highly doubt would ever happen. All I'm saying is IF healthy he will be playing.

What I'm getting at is "healthy" is a vague term.

So what's your criteria? 100%? Then you're probably looking at a full year. Muscle surgery doesn't fully repair in 6 - 8 weeks.

 

[Marky9er]

Then they can deal with Seattle, that actually needs guys like TJ, Killorn, etc. I've looked at the mock draft, and not many scorers are available.

I was thinking Johnson may end up in Seattle, whether or not he makes a stop in Detroit. He's from Washington State and could be the (marketable) leader of the team. It would be an interesting opportunity for him, and a reason to waive if Yzerman will facilitate the "gap year" neccessary by taking futures. Inaugural Captain of a franchise, that's a pretty rare opportunity.

 

[Retire91]

Its the offseason so I am not discouraging any topics, but Stamkos? Really? And for Raymond? This is the type of move I would anticipate from Holland's perpetual mediocrity regime.

Dude is over 30 and eats 8.5 cap, and if healthy will win us just enough games to screw our draft position but not be a competitor, and walks as UFA in 2023-24. There is absolutely zero chance I would trade Raymond for that. Not giving up Raymond's potential over a likely 10-20 year career and ELC and RFA protection.