Zadina probably starting out in GR

[The Zetterberg Era]

Going from junior hockey to the AHL is a big jump. I'm pretty sure he's the youngest player in the league. Would you feel better if Zadina was back in Halifax scoring 50 goals?

No, and I don't feel bad about what he is doing now to be clear. Just that top 10 talents should enjoy a lot of joy at yes even the AHL level. They possess unique qualities and Zadina does. He doesn't take the same amount of time to settle the puck even right now as other guys, because his hands are better, his hockey brain is better. He needs trust that though and he needs to put on the work boots. He isn't competing hard enough in the corners and other areas. But that is fine, he is there to learn and I think he learns better at the AHL level than the CHL. I have said that repeatedly.

But I need more to want him near the Wings. Good news is I still believe we see that this year. But we don't have to pretend he looks great in the interim. He has had a tough opening stretch on a bad team to start the year.

By the way I will go ahead and knock this out a year in advance. This should be Veleno's last year in the Q. If he can't play for the Wings because of his four years he best be assigned to GR for next season regardless. Zadina is in the correct league, I hope he can play better in this month before being farmed out for the WJC in mid-December. I think he also realistically needs another tick in his skating which does concern me, but I think is still possible. I just worry a lot since XO when I say that now and his skating is better than that, but star level I think he needs at least another step agree with @Frk It there big time.

 

[Frk It]

No, and I don't feel bad about what he is doing now to be clear. Just that top 10 talents should enjoy a lot of joy at yes even the AHL level. They possess unique qualities and Zadina does. He doesn't take the same amount of time to settle the puck even right now as other guys, because his hands are better, his hockey brain is better. He needs trust that though and he needs to put on the work boots. He isn't competing hard enough in the corners and other areas. But that is fine, he is there to learn and I think he learns better at the AHL level than the CHL. I have said that repeatedly.

But I need more to want him near the Wings. Good news is I still believe we see that this year. But we don't have to pretend he looks great in the interim. He has had a tough opening stretch on a bad team to start the year.

By the way I will go ahead and knock this out a year in advance. This should be Veleno's last year in the Q. If he can't play for the Wings because of his four years he best be assigned to GR for next season regardless. Zadina is in the correct league, I hope he can play better in this month before being farmed out for the WJC in mid-December. I think he also realistically needs another tick in his skating which does concern me, but I think is still possible. I just worry a lot since XO when I say that now and his skating is better than that, but star level I think he needs at least another step agree with @Frk It there big time.

Agree with all of this, and if Cholowski taught us anything it’s that a +1 season with some adversity doesn’t have to define you.

It can show you exactly where you need work and then it’s on you to come back and make those things a non-issue.

I do expect him to start doing better though, and if not then some criticism is warranted

 

[TatarTangle]

I think it is also fair to point out some of us had these concerns before he was ever our pick. I root for our guys, but don't try to pretend with me that my opinion on Dobson or Hughes would be hindsight for instance. My exact statement when we drafted Zadina to my shame in front of family was ****. I thought for sure Quinn Hughes was our pick especially when McGuire and Bobby Mac basically said as much while Wings brass was walking up. Just what I said when the pick was made. I hope to be wrong, I am a fan of Zadina and what I hope he can bring. But it isn't cherry picking, I like Dobson and Hughes more than Zadina before the Wings walked to the podium and said as much around here a lot.

He is a goal scorer. the real question is he a mid 20's, 30's or 40's goal scorer? The Wings scouts believe he is a 40 goal scorer. I disagree, but man I hope he is. He has a lot of ability, hopefully he knocks his development out of the park.

Not trying to be confrontational but you really aren't able to be objective with Zadina because inevitably you drag Hughes into any discussion and speak in absolutes that Hughes will be better.

I get that you are super high on Hughes, I just don't get what that has to do with Zadina.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Not trying to be confrontational but you really aren't able to be objective with Zadina because inevitably you drag Hughes into any discussion and speak in absolutes that Hughes will be better.

I get that you are super high on Hughes, I just don't get what that has to do with Zadina.

Well that response was to somebody saying I would do that as hindsight. As pointed out I have done that all along so.... But yeah I can be exhausting with Hughes my bad, I am sure a few of our U of M posters have to take glee in my having to like Glendening, Larkin and Hughes as much as I do.

I get that critique, I am a big believer in the two Hughes brothers we know and probably will be in the third, I am sucker for prospects that skate like the Hughes boys no doubt. But I do a lot of discussing what concerns me with Zadina's game and also what I enjoy about it. Sorry if that clouds some of the posting. I am human, passing on Quinn hurt for me no doubt. But Zadina is our guy now and hopefully he is filling the net with goals 40 times a year.

There are no absolutes Hughes or Zadina could bust spectacularly, Zadina has tons of talent and I hope he achieves that. He has a ton to his game and his ability to invite and beat pressure is fascinating to watch. It is what most of the elite NHL players do well, he just has to figure it out at the pro level and the couple of natural developments hopefully in terms of skating and other stuff to make sure it happens. But he has an elite shot and he is a rink rat guy in terms of makeup, there is a ton to like and I don't view him in just this start to the AHL.

I wanted Necas over Rasmussen and Ras helped me get over that in a hurry. I think Zadina will soon, guy is going to be a player of significance in my opinion. But we have run Tatar and Nyquist for being high 20's scorers and Franzen before, what becomes of Zadina if that is all he becomes is a part of what I am getting at.

 

[RedWingzz]

Not surprised to see no points and that he's a - again.

Anytime now buddy....

 

[Filppula]

Not surprised to see no points and that he's a - again.

Anytime now buddy....

He’s struggling. It’s frustrating for all concerned. But it’s also still really early, let’s give it more time, and by that I mean at least the halfway point of the season.

 

[ShanahanMan]

Well......at least we got Veleno?

 

[Snuggs]

The leading goal scorer in the AHL last season only had 33. There were only six 30+ goal scorers in the entire league last season. It's a tough league to score in. For Zadina, I think a good number to shoot for this season is 20 goals.

Well also most of the time when you're a young prospect and you are clearly doing well in the AHL they call you up not really giving the most talented players shots at 30, 40,50 goals in the AHL. Most 30 goal scorers are older prospects who can't make in the NHL.

Lol its not that the league is that hard. If Zadina starts going on a goal streak how confident would you be he gets to finish the season in the AHL?

 

[Snuggs]

Going from junior hockey to the AHL is a big jump. I'm pretty sure he's the youngest player in the league. Would you feel better if Zadina was back in Halifax scoring 50 goals?

Comments like this are just heads in the Dirt... Rasmussen/Cholowski are jumping to the NHL from Jr's. so idk. Elias Petterson is taking the league by storm at 19 1 year removed from the top Swedish league. 8 games or whatever of North American hockey total...

An as far as developing him yeah I would feel better if he was in Halifax working on his craft successfully vs struggling in the AHL getting man handled. Most of his problem isn't really talent it seems physical(Strength/speed/timing). A 19 year old can bulk up in JR's and keep his confidence vs whats happening to him at the moment.

But it's early. We'll know more about our boy come January/Feb. I hope he turns things around quickly. Like tomorrow.

 

[Ezekial]

Comments like this are just heads in the Dirt... Rasmussen/Cholowski are jumping to the NHL from Jr's. so idk. Elias Petterson is taking the league by storm at 19 1 year removed from the top Swedish league. 8 games or whatever of North American hockey total...

An as far as developing him yeah I would feel better if he was in Halifax working on his craft successfully vs struggling in the AHL getting man handled. Most of his problem isn't really talent it seems physical(Strength/speed/timing). A 19 year old can bulk up in JR's and keep his confidence vs whats happening to him at the moment.

But it's early. We'll know more about our boy come January/Feb. I hope he turns things around quickly. Like tomorrow.

Cholowski is 20 and will be 21 in 4 months. Rasmussen's size is imposing and he's trying to find his way in the NHL, but by most accounts he should be in the AHL right now. Pettersson played in a better league than jrs (and the AHL) last year and dominated it.

 

[Claypool]

Comments like this are just heads in the Dirt...

He's played 9 games. Chill.

 

[Snuggs]

Cholowski is 20 and will be 21 in 4 months. Rasmussen's size is imposing and he's trying to find his way in the NHL, but by most accounts he should be in the AHL right now. Pettersson played in a better league than jrs (and the AHL) last year and dominated it.

I was having an arguement with Claypool that players can make the jump from JR's to the NHL and not struggle it's putting your head in the dirt to think different.

I understand those guys are older, or bigger and different type players at the moment but they still made the jump from JR's to the NHL without really struggling too bad. I don't think Rasmussen looks lost on the Red Wings.

An Idk I mentioned Petterrson cause I thought people could compare and contrast whats happening with him and Zadina. An see how the transition to the NHL from SHL could be harder with the better players/smaller rink compared to Zadina who's jumping from JR's to AHL.

 

[Snuggs]

He's played 9 games. Chill.

True that, judgement isn't made just saying the resume isn't there yet, and definately not what I was sold leading to the draft/draft night.

 

[Ezekial]

I was having an arguement with Claypool that players can make the jump from JR's to the NHL and not struggle it's putting your head in the dirt to think different.

I understand those guys are older, or bigger and different type players at the moment but they still made the jump from JR's to the NHL without really struggling too bad. I don't think Rasmussen looks lost on the Red Wings.

I don't think he looks lost either, and I've been very adamant that him playing in the NHL is really good for him, there's only one poster I've seen consistently say he looks lost. But when it comes to Zadina, him "struggling" in the short term could be good for him in the long term(much like Rasmussen, and we've already seen some results on ice with him). He's got a great skill set, just has to learn how to translate it to the pro game.

 

[ChrisReevesLegs]

I like how the expectations for Zadina have shifted from "he could join Detroit immediately and contribute" to "he's struggling in the minors, but that's ok"

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Cholowski is 20 and will be 21 in 4 months. Rasmussen's size is imposing and he's trying to find his way in the NHL, but by most accounts he should be in the AHL right now. Pettersson played in a better league than jrs (and the AHL) last year and dominated it.

I don't believe the SHL is a better league than the AHL. Especially not for training and learning to be a NHL player, but still I would say the talent level is better in the AHL.

I don't think Rasmussen should be in the AHL, he has been fine learning in the NHL and is playing well enough to justify staying up. Even if we had the option to send him there, I am comfortable with seeing what he is doing at the AHL and prefer him living with Larkin and learning in the NHL.

 

[Ezekial]

I don't believe the SHL is a better league than the AHL. Especially not for training and learning to be a NHL player, but still I would say the talent level is better in the AHL.

I don't think Rasmussen should be in the AHL, he has been fine learning in the NHL and is playing well enough to justify staying up. Even if we had the option to send him there, I am comfortable with seeing what he is doing at the AHL and prefer him living with Larkin and learning in the NHL.

I see no reason to disagree with any of this. I think the SHL has more talent but the A full well could be the better development league.
I think the whole Rasmussen living with Larkin thing is huge, I think it's incredible for him. With the amount of steps I've seen from him the past 5 games I'm a lot more comfortable with him being up, although as you probably know, I was never in favor of him being sent down.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I see no reason to disagree with any of this. I think the SHL has more talent but the A full well could be the better development league.
I think the whole Rasmussen living with Larkin thing is huge, I think it's incredible for him. With the amount of steps I've seen from him the past 5 games I'm a lot more comfortable with him being up, although as you probably know, I was never in favor of him being sent down.

I don't think that it has the same kind of talent level. With virtually any team in the AHL you're watching four to five NHL players at some point either end of the arc or beginning. Around 80% of NHL players spend some time in the AHL. The SHL just doesn't boast that kind of talent in my opinion. Sure plenty of very talented hockey players come through the SHL. But on a night to night basis for me the AHL is easily the third best league in the world. And in my opinion they are a heck of a lot closer to the KHL than the KHL is to the NHL level.

 

[Lil Bert]

A lot of people say that the AHL is the second hardest hockey league in the world.

Zadina's 18.

GR is a bad offensive team.

Give him a break lol, he's not a bust yet. 4g 4a in 13 games. The dudes been over a point per game at almost every level. Don't get down on him just yet.

If there's a point for actual concern it's with Jonatan Berggren. He made the jump from the superelite to the SHL where he has 3 assists in 15 games this season and 0pts in 10 games last season. He looked like a great prospect coming into this year but it doesn't seem like he can make the jump. Maybe they're a bad team but his production in the higher levels is LOW.

 

[TCNorthstars]

A lot of people say that the AHL is the second hardest hockey league in the world.

Zadina's 18.

GR is a bad offensive team.

Give him a break lol, he's not a bust yet. 4g 4a in 13 games. The dudes been over a point per game at almost every level. Don't get down on him just yet.

If there's a point for actual concern it's with Jonatan Berggren. He made the jump from the superelite to the SHL where he has 3 assists in 15 games this season and 0pts in 10 games last season. He looked like a great prospect coming into this year but it doesn't seem like he can make the jump. Maybe they're a bad team but his production in the higher levels is LOW.

Berggren doesn't seem to get a lot of ice time. And he is still pretty young. I wouldn't be too concerned about a young 2nd round pick at this point.

 

[Reddwit]

A lot of people say that the AHL is the second hardest hockey league in the world.

Zadina's 18.

GR is a bad offensive team.

Give him a break lol, he's not a bust yet. 4g 4a in 13 games. The dudes been over a point per game at almost every level. Don't get down on him just yet.

If there's a point for actual concern it's with Jonatan Berggren. He made the jump from the superelite to the SHL where he has 3 assists in 15 games this season and 0pts in 10 games last season. He looked like a great prospect coming into this year but it doesn't seem like he can make the jump. Maybe they're a bad team but his production in the higher levels is LOW.

Way too soon to be worrying about the SHL production of a 5'10" kid who turned 18 just 4 months ago.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I like how the expectations for Zadina have shifted from "he could join Detroit immediately and contribute" to "he's struggling in the minors, but that's ok"

If the Wings only cared about bringing Zadina up to sell some tickets, I'm sure that he could unleash his shot and be okay offensively at the big level. But the Wings actually tend to try to care about bringing their players along and not tossing them knowingly into a sink or swim situation where the swim possibility in the short term is not very good.

And I love that 8 points in 13 games is struggling. I love that somehow Zadina is complete garbage because he's scoring over half a point a game. If he was 13 games in and had like 2 points? Okay, that would be worrisome. He's got 8 points on a team that is not an offensive juggernaut.

 

[izlez]

And I love that 8 points in 13 games is struggling. I love that somehow Zadina is complete garbage because he's scoring over half a point a game. If he was 13 games in and had like 2 points? Okay, that would be worrisome. He's got 8 points on a team that is not an offensive juggernaut.

I'd love for more input from people that are Griffins fans and watch the games, but from watching the (terrible) highlights, his points are rather uninspiring.

Off the top of my head:
He's got a goal where the puck fell on his stick with an empty net. He missed it wide, but bounced it in off the goalie.
He's got 2 assists where all you see is a teammate skating through the neutral zone and over the blue line, shooting and scoring, with Zadina out of frame.
He's got a goal in the last 2 minutes of a game where GR had already scored 2 empty net goals.
His last assist was a very standard PP play where he received a pass on the half wall and made a simple pass to the D.

Again, these highlights provide hardly any more context than just stat-watching, but from what we can see in them none of these plays really scream "skilled player that is driving play and creating plays"