What could greatly improve this team?

[Tripod]

JUST GET A DAMN GOALIE.

Elliott is bad, Picard is a backup, Neuvirth is fragile, Lyon is ???.
No wonder Hextall is being patient, you could put an allstar team in front of these goalies and miss the playoffs!

But in fairness, we have the goalies that Hextall selected to have. That's on him.

 

[deadhead]

But in fairness, we have the goalies that Hextall selected to have. That's on him.

Hart, Sandstrom and Ustimenko.

I doubt he expected Stolarz to blow out his knee just when he'd be ready to push for PT.
Probably saw him and Lyon as the bridge next year to the young goalies.
But Elliott looks like he's at the end, and Neuvirth???
Pickard could be a solid backup, but not a starter, but I felt the same about Grubauer which is why I prefer Pickard for free.

 

[Tripod]

Hart, Sandstrom and Ustimenko.

I doubt he expected Stolarz to blow out his knee just when he'd be ready to push for PT.
Probably saw him and Lyon as the bridge next year to the young goalies.
But Elliott looks like he's at the end, and Neuvirth???
Pickard could be a solid backup, but not a starter, but I felt the same about Grubauer which is why I prefer Pickard for free.

As I said in the summer, we should not be just sitting and waiting on Hart to be the saviour. It wastes 2-3 years. Get a goalie to help everyone now. It will help the confidence of the young D. If available, I look to sign Varlamov in the summer. Term has to be 3 years of less though.

 

[achdumeingute]

As I said in the summer, we should not be just sitting and waiting on Hart to be the saviour. It wastes 2-3 years. Get a goalie to help everyone now. It will help the confidence of the young D. If available, I look to sign Varlamov in the summer. Term has to be 3 years of less though.

varly is probably looking for more term. Rinne might be there for that term.

 

[achdumeingute]

But in fairness, we have the goalies that Hextall selected to have. That's on him.

hard to really expect better. What worthwhile goalies have moved in the last 2 yrs besides bishop, who I didn't want to sign for that deal.

 

[Tripod]

hard to really expect better. What worthwhile goalies have moved in the last 2 yrs besides bishop, who I didn't want to sign for that deal.

Maybe the Flyers needed to not play Mason when he was hurt and the goalie coach would not have quit. Maybe that would have kept Mason happy, and better. And of course people will point to where Mason is today, but I think if he was still in Philly with proper use, he would still be a solid goalie for us today.

Plus, it's Hextall's job to make the team better. He chose this goalie tandem...that has turned into a threesome. Oh, a 4some with Lyon. And none of them can be relied upon to be an NHL goalie next year. And be either can the next 2 in the depth chart(Hart+Stolie)

If the plan truly is to sit and wait for Hart for another 2-3 years, then they should be looking to move some top guys for top end returns that will be ready then too.

Or...add a legit goalie, a legit Dman, and all the sudden they could be a conteder with a wealth of assets just 1-3 years away to sustain them for a very, very long time.

 

[Jtown]

Maybe the Flyers needed to not play Mason when he was hurt and the goalie coach would not have quit. Maybe that would have kept Mason happy, and better. And of course people will point to where Mason is today, but I think if he was still in Philly with proper use, he would still be a solid goalie for us today.

Plus, it's Hextall's job to make the team better. He chose this goalie tandem...that has turned into a threesome. Oh, a 4some with Lyon. And none of them can be relied upon to be an NHL goalie next year. And be either can the next 2 in the depth chart(Hart+Stolie)

If the plan truly is to sit and wait for Hart for another 2-3 years, then they should be looking to move some top guys for top end returns that will be ready then too.

This is what I and others have been preaching for some time. This rebuild on the fly does not add up if we are meant to be competitive when giroux and voracek are finished. Great we can be like Vancouver and waste two great careers without having anything to show for it, and then let them walk without getting a thing in return.

The moment you have neuvirth and elliott as your starting goalies you can't look the players in the eyes and seriously tell them they are in win now mode. I was praying for carter hart to steal the preseason ( and he did) to force his way into the lineup because this team has no shot with the current group of nhl ready goalies on hand.

Either trade giroux and voracek or get a top 10 goalie here now. What good is having all these assets if we are going to waste the careers of two dominate players.

 

[Tripod]

This is what I and others have been preaching for some time. This rebuild on the fly does not add up if we are meant to be competitive when giroux and voracek are finished. Great we can be like Vancouver and waste two great careers without having anything to show for it, and then let them walk without getting a thing in return.

The moment you have neuvirth and elliott as your starting goalies you can't look the players in the eyes and seriously tell them they are in win now mode. I was praying for carter hart to steal the preseason ( and he did) to force his way into the lineup because this team has no shot with the current group of nhl ready goalies on hand.

Either trade giroux and voracek or get a top 10 goalie here now. What good is having all these assets if we are going to waste the careers of two dominate players.

The thing is, I understand Hextall building thru the draft because our pipeline of prospects was so poor. It was a step that was long overdue and needed to be done.

But this summer was the time to "flick the switch" IMO. We had the cap space for once to actually do something. Adding JVR solidified the LW. No issue with that move.

But giving the kids a legit Dman to lean on thru their young years has been a huge miss. Just think, they have had to "lean on" Andrew MacDonald for gods sake. How sad is that.

 

[Jtown]

The thing is, I understand Hextall building thru the draft because our pipeline of prospects was so poor. It was a step that was long overdue and needed to be done.

But this summer was the time to "flick the switch" IMO. We had the cap space for once to actually do something. Adding JVR solidified the LW. No issue with that move.

But giving the kids a legit Dman to lean on thru their young years has been a huge miss.

you're joking right? Half the boards complaints are about toi for sanheim, myers being in the ahl, amac this amac that. Gudas Sanheim for the time being has the potential to be a worthy 2nd pairing. If your comments are in regards to Provy's play I don't know what to tell you. I don't think anyone wants to admit that some of the shine on our new toy has rusted off.

IN regards to signing a dman in FA, i am not a fan. Very few quality dmen make it to FA and the ones that do are the alzer's and the Shattenkirks of the world. I'd rather do what Tampa Bay did in acquiring mcdonough. Find the dman you like, and then go get them. Problem is , I wouldn't spend a single asset until we can get a legit goalie on this roster.

 

[Tripod]

you're joking right? Half the boards complaints are about toi for sanheim, myers being in the ahl, amac this amac that. Gudas Sanheim for the time being has the potential to be a worthy 2nd pairing. If your comments are in regards to Provy's play I don't know what to tell you. I don't think anyone wants to admit that some of the shine on our new toy has rusted off.

IN regards to signing a dman in FA, i am not a fan. Very few quality dmen make it to FA and the ones that do are the alzer's and the Shattenkirks of the world. I'd rather do what Tampa Bay did in acquiring mcdonough. Find the dman you like, and then go get them. Problem is , I wouldn't spend a single asset until we can get a legit goalie on this roster.

Not kidding.

But yes, the toi is BECAUSE sack of shit AMac is a valued asset by Hakstol for years. And Hextall too. Our kids have had to "learn" from a Dman that was waived to AHL. while in his prime. What could go wrong. The time to add that legit Dman was a year ago but it's still a need today....unless they actually give a guy like Sanheim legit minutes to help develop into that guy by the end of the year.

BuT then we have the Hak issue, and I am not getting into all that.

 

[Jtown]

If i were to make some tweaks to this team this is what i would do.

1st thing i would do is have our top unit play all 2 minutes on the PP. They basically do already , instead of coming off the ice and giving the 2nd unit 30 seconds just give them the whole 2 minutes.

2nd. When Patrick Comes back from his injury I put him on a line with Jake and Giroux just to get him to wake the F up. When you have those two guys on your line you are suppose to produce and hopefully that pressure will elevate his play because we are not going anywhere without a 2nd line.

3rd. Once he wakes up revert to the the lines we had at the seasons end. Giroux Coots konecny, Lindblom Patrick Voracek

4th. Shuffle up the D a bit. Try some new Combos just to see if you can find anything that works. Gudas Sanheim looked pretty good to me. Keep That as a pair if need be.

5th. Trade Simmons. Love the guy , and he is beasting right now but He is not going to be resigned and he is likely going to be Seattle's first captain. Start making calls, see what is out there , maybe bring in a goalie.

There are no quick fixes, we really lack some elite talent at crucial areas.

 

[Jtown]

Not kidding.

But yes, the toi is BECAUSE sack of **** AMac is a valued asset by Hakstol for years. And Hextall too. Our kids have had to "learn" from a Dman that was waived to AHL. while in his prime. What could go wrong. The time to add that legit Dman was a year ago but it's still a need today....unless they actually give a guy like Sanheim legit minutes to help develop into that guy by the end of the year.

BuT then we have the Hak issue, and I am not getting into all that.

I don't think hak thinks he is valuable at all, i think he thinks Amac is the best of a crummy lot to choose from. Amac looks really rusty this year, so though his performance this year is fresh in our minds, let's not kid ourselves and pretend this is how awful he has always been. If we had a player of amac's caliber in 2010 we may have won the cup, because we would have been able to rest pronger and kimmo more. So in that regard that is a valuable asset to have. On the other hand when he is your most expensive dman you have then that is not an ideal situation.

Hextall views Amac as a sunk cost. Simple as that. What you don't want is your sunk cost to cost you more in the future. Dmen have a high value during regular season of the nhl season because they are always in demand due to injury. So lets we have a few dmen go down to injury and we need to pad up the roster a bit , we have a guy like Amac who is believe it or not nhl caliber. That is why you keep a guy like that around. Because we will inevitably lose someone to injury and instead of giving up a 2nd for douglas murray, you already have your version of douglas murray watching from the pressbox.

In 2004, had clarke not completely botched our dman situation we may have won the stanley cup. Instead we had a no name blue line featuring sami kapanen. Dmen have value in this league.

 

[Psuhockey]

If your comments are in regards to Provy's play I don't know what to tell you. I don't think anyone wants to admit that some of the shine on our new toy has rusted off.

This might be one of the dumbest things yet written on these boards. Drew Doughty struggled his 3rd year after breaking out at the olympics and continuing that thru his second season. Hedman was considered a bit of a bust until his 5th year.

Anyone thinking Provorov is overhyped or is going to be a mediocrity because he has struggled the first few weeks of his 3rd season is insane or just trolling.

 

[Jtown]

This might be one of the dumbest things yet written on these boards. Drew Doughty struggled his 3rd year after breaking out at the olympics and continuing that thru his second season. Hedman was considered a bit of a bust until his 5th year.

Anyone thinking Provorov is overhyped or is going to be a mediocrity because he has struggled the first few weeks of his 3rd season is insane or just trolling.

you proved exactly my point.

 

[Tripod]

I don't think hak thinks he is valuable at all, i think he thinks Amac is the best of a crummy lot to choose from. Amac looks really rusty this year, so though his performance this year is fresh in our minds, let's not kid ourselves and pretend this is how awful he has always been. If we had a player of amac's caliber in 2010 we may have won the cup, because we would have been able to rest pronger and kimmo more. So in that regard that is a valuable asset to have. On the other hand when he is your most expensive dman you have then that is not an ideal situation.

Hextall views Amac as a sunk cost. Simple as that. What you don't want is your sunk cost to cost you more in the future. Dmen have a high value during regular season of the nhl season because they are always in demand due to injury. So lets we have a few dmen go down to injury and we need to pad up the roster a bit , we have a guy like Amac who is believe it or not nhl caliber. That is why you keep a guy like that around. Because we will inevitably lose someone to injury and instead of giving up a 2nd for douglas murray, you already have your version of douglas murray watching from the pressbox.

In 2004, had clarke not completely botched our dman situation we may have won the stanley cup. Instead we had a no name blue line featuring sami kapanen. Dmen have value in this league.

When you have a coach that believes AMac is top top 3 Dman AND GIVES HIM TOP 3 minutes, that is a problem.

This year AMac 3rd in TOI
Last year AMac 3rd in TOI
2 years ago AMac 2nd in TOI

And as I said before, it's not just a Hak issue, it's a Hextall issue. He allowed this to happen bu not surrounding the kids with a better Dman to learn from/lean on.

Oh....and you can keep AMac around. Bring him up from the AHL when injuries occur without fear of losing him to waivers. That's using the sunk cost properly.

 

[Jtown]

When you have a coach that believes AMac is top top 3 Dman AND GIVES HIM TOP 3 minutes, that is a problem.

This year AMac 3rd in TOI
Last year AMac 3rd in TOI
2 years ago AMac 2nd in TOI

And as I said before, it's not just a Hak issue, it's a Hextall issue. He allowed this to happen bu not surrounding the kids with a better Dman to learn from/lean on.

I don't think TOI necessarily reflects Hak's thinking. For example Couturier plays more minutes than giroux or voracek. Does anyone think Couturier is better than those 2? I think the "Kids" have done just fine. I don't think they would be any different with or without another capable dman. Sanheim's confidence this year is a prime example.

 

[Psuhockey]

you proved exactly my point.

What that you are a troll or don’t actually watch other teams play hockey?

I am sure if we had a time machine we could get lots of idiots on the Kings and Lightening boards saying to trade Hedman and Doughty because they are overhyped back in their 3rd seasons. I do wonder were you one of the ones on here saying Provorov was having a sophomore slump last year before he led the league in goals by the end of the season? Because there were plenty here saying he was having a sophomore slump.

 

[Tripod]

I don't think TOI necessarily reflects Hak's thinking. For example Couturier plays more minutes than giroux or voracek. Does anyone think Couturier is better than those 2? I think the "Kids" have done just fine. I don't think they would be any different with or without another capable dman. Sanheim's confidence this year is a prime example.

Agree to disagree.

 

[Jtown]

What that you are a troll or don’t actually watch other teams play hockey?

I am sure if we had a time machine we could get lots of idiots on the Kings and Lightening boards saying to trade Hedman and Doughty because they are overhyped back in their 3rd seasons. I do wonder were you one of the ones on here saying Provorov was having a sophomore slump last year before he led the league in goals by the end of the season? Because there were plenty here saying he was having a sophomore slump.

So you are perfectly fine with Provorov's play thus far this year?

 

[Jtown]

Agree to disagree.

hak has limited choices to choose from for the pk. He is forced to use amac , not because he thinks he is elite but he is the best of a bad lot. I don't think we have a single dman on our roster that I think is an elite penalty killer.

 

[Psuhockey]

So you are perfectly fine with Provorov's play thus far this year?

No. He has absolutely struggled but I don’t think it’s cause of concern or out of the ordinary for top defensemen to struggle in their 3rd year. It’ a long process to learn to play defense at the NHL level especially as a #1. Most guys develop the consistency in their 4th year. So in that regards, Provorov is right on schedule.

Which leads me to the biggest complaint I have about Hextalls plan. If you want to build a defense from scratch, get these guys to the NHL as soon as possible to start that learning curve especially if you have no intention to bring in competent vets to help the transition. Prime years of other players are just being wasted now.

 

[Amorgus]

But giving the kids a legit Dman to lean on thru their young years has been a huge miss. Just think, they have had to "lean on" Andrew MacDonald for gods sake. How sad is that.

This and the goalie issue are my two biggest sore spots as well. I wouldn't trust Mac to raise a goldfish let alone help develop a bunch of rookies. They really need a leader for all these kids on D to look up to and learn from when things start falling apart, and not by being the living example of What Not To Do every time he hits the ice. Right now Provorov could REALLY use some guidance and I doubt he's getting much.

 

[hatcher]

This might be one of the dumbest things yet written on these boards. Drew Doughty struggled his 3rd year after breaking out at the olympics and continuing that thru his second season. Hedman was considered a bit of a bust until his 5th year.

Anyone thinking Provorov is overhyped or is going to be a mediocrity because he has struggled the first few weeks of his 3rd season is insane or just trolling.

Never like Provy.

 

[Jtown]

Never like Provy.

lets make a list of who you like. and not just hockey players but of people in general. Family? Pets? Satan?

 

[Curufinwe]

Or...add a legit goalie, a legit Dman, and all the sudden they could be a conteder with a wealth of assets just 1-3 years away to sustain them for a very, very long time.

Can you give some actual names and expected trade prices for the goalie and dman who will turn this Hakstol-coached team into a contender?