Salary Cap: Salary Cap Summer | The grind it out phase | Moar 3C Talk!

[Speaking Moistly]

I'm saying it's my understanding that JR isn't interested in some of the bottom feeding names being bandied about here as the next big thing.

My 'gut'-- and it's pure gut-- says it would be Bozak, but the Leafs have to move someone to center if they do that. Eh, we'll see . . . I'll just be shocked if it's one of the garbage names who pop up every few pages in these threads.

I think Bozak having one year left really hurts the chances of the Pension acquiring him. Jr isn't going to want to be doing this again next year or have to deal with a new cap hit.

My gut. One of the Vegas guys is the backup option that he could get today for a pick and lower tier prospect.

 

[KIRK]

Bozak would be a nice guy to acquire, but I can't imagine it would be that likely. I think other teams would outbid the Penguins for him and I don't even know how willing Toronto would be to trade him. I think they'll be quite content with having Matthews-Kadri-Bozak as their top-9 centers. I don't think it's an issue of Nylander not being able to play center at the NHL level yet, I think it's an issue of not wanting to hurt your RW depth just in the name of asset management.

If Nylander gets moved to center, the Leafs RWers would be Marner, Brown, Kapanen and Hyman. That's a really solid young group, but Marner and Brown are at risk of regressing from what they did last year and it's no guarantee that either Kapanen or Hyman end up much of anything.

It's a little more subtle than that. I think they'd move Bozak as part of a deal for an top four defenseman, but not in a 'when all else fails' salary dump. It's risk/reward. Not worth the risk of Nylander to C unless there's a perceived greater reward. Failing that, I see them moving a winger to get under the cap.

I think Bozak having one year left really hurts the chances of the Pension acquiring him. Jr isn't going to want to be doing this again next year or have to deal with a new cap hit.

My gut. One of the Vegas guys is the backup option that he could get today for a pick and lower tier prospect.

Another argument against. Look, I was just telling you my gut feeling. I can't quite figure out why Toronto does it, of course, which is why I kind of defaulted to 'we'll see'.

The MAIN POINT that I was making is that JR is NOT dumpster diving. Half of these garbage names that people have floated here . . . not happening. JR wants Bonino or better impact, not worse than Sutter.

EDIT: I could see you being right about the backup option. Hell, if Cullen weren't coming back, I'd try for two of them.

 

[The Old Master]

I'm guessing you're talking about Reinhart, but I can basically guarantee that wouldn't work

wrong gussee. "AA"

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think Bozak having one year left really hurts the chances of the Pension acquiring him. Jr isn't going to want to be doing this again next year or have to deal with a new cap hit.

My gut. One of the Vegas guys is the backup option that he could get today for a pick and lower tier prospect.

Yeah thinking about it more and more, I think Karlsson may be the guy the Penguins end up with. Quick 2-way playmaking center, I think he'd fit well here.

wrong gussee. "AA"

I feel like he'd be pretty pricey to get from the Wings and I wouldn't move Sheary for him, but if the Penguins could get him, he'd be a great option.

 

[KIRK]

Yeah thinking about it more and more, I think Karlsson may be the guy the Penguins end up with. Quick 2-way playmaking center, I think he'd fit well here.

I wish JR had gotten Karlsson already. Always a place for a guy like that at such a reasonable cap hit.

Yeah, I really can see Vegas being the fallback option for JR right now.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

wrong gussee. "AA"

Mike Ribeiro?

 

[Speaking Moistly]

It's a little more subtle than that. I think they'd move Bozak as part of a deal for an top four defenseman, but not in a 'when all else fails' salary dump. It's risk/reward. Not worth the risk of Nylander to C unless there's a perceived greater reward. Failing that, I see them moving a winger to get under the cap.



Another argument against. Look, I was just telling you my gut feeling. I can't quite figure out why Toronto does it, of course, which is why I kind of defaulted to 'we'll see'.

The MAIN POINT that I was making is that JR is NOT dumpster diving. Half of these garbage names that people have floated here . . . not happening. JR wants Bonino or better impact, not worse than Sutter.

EDIT: I could see you being right about the backup option. Hell, if Cullen weren't coming back, I'd try for two of them.

JR isn't really a dumpster diving GM here so, yeah, I doubt he willingly does it. Maybe if he aims for the moon and everything's falls through he panics,

Toronto would have two reasons to trade him, imo. Asset management or trying to improve their D. I don't see them asset managing for the same reason we won't with Hornqvist and the Pens can't really help their D unless one of ours takes like five steps forward and makes Cole expendable. Then they'd just flip pending UFAs.

 

[Lindys Lazy Eye]

You need a 3C?

We need defense.

I think there is a trade to be made.

So how about something along the lines of John Quenneville + a 2019 3rd for Maatta?

32 assists in the A last year, and 15 goals. Perfect bottom 6 production at a cost effective price.

Plus, if you need to take a defenseman back, you can have Stanley Cup icon, Ben Lovejoy at no extra cost.

 

[Empoleon8771]

You need a 3C?

We need defense.

I think there is a trade to be made.

So how about something along the lines of John Quenneville + a 2019 3rd for Maatta?

32 assists in the A last year, and 15 goals.

Plus, if you need to take a defenseman back, you can have Stanley Cup icon, Ben Lovejoy at no extra price.

Do you really think this is fair? Like seriously

 

[Lindys Lazy Eye]

Do you really think this is fair? Like seriously

Okay fine.

Henrique + Quenneville for Mattaa. Better?

 

[Empoleon8771]

Okay fine.

Henrique + Quenneville for Mattaa. Better?

I was just gonna say Henrique for Maatta straight up would be fair

The Penguins aren't in a position where they can trade a defensemen easily, so I wouldn't do that trade. I do think it's fair value though, the Penguins would just need to get a replacement defenseman for Maatta (not Lovejoy). I'd probably want to do something like Henrique and Moore for Maatta and another piece if we're talking about that kind of deal.

 

[Pick87your71Poison]

Whoa that was a big jump from a 3rd rd pick to Henrique.

I still wouldn't want to do it because I don't think it makes sense for us to move a top 4 dman without bringing one back unless it's value we just can't pass up. I don't think this qualifies as that, but it's reasonable just from a value standpoint.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Okay fine.

Henrique + Quenneville for Mattaa. Better?

No.

I'd rather this...


Henrique + Moore for Maatta + Kuhnhackl.

Edit:

Guentzel, Crosby, Sheary
Hagelin, Malkin, Kessel
Rust, Henrique, Hornqvist
Wilson, Rowney/Cullen*, Reaves/Archibald

Dumoulin, Letang
Moore, Schultz
Cole, Hunwick

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I was just gonna say Henrique for Maatta straight up would be fair

The Penguins aren't in a position where they can trade a defensemen easily, so I wouldn't do that trade. I do think it's fair value though, the Penguins would just need to get a replacement defenseman for Maatta (not Lovejoy). I'd probably want to do something like Henrique and Moore for Maatta and another piece if we're talking about that kind of deal.

I didn't see your post until just now, yeah I want John Moore too, I mentioned him last at the deadline as a target, I really like his game, he skates well, jumps up on the play, is fairly solid in his own end, he fits the Sullivan "system" very well and he's capable of playing RD as well.

 

[The Old Master]

I feel like he'd be pretty pricey to get from the Wings and I wouldn't move Sheary for him, but if the Penguins could get him, he'd be a great option.

I think sheary is high. but with aa's upside its worth it.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I think sheary is high. but with aa's upside its worth it.

AA also mostly plays wing for the Red Wings. So if you trade Sheary for AA, you're essentially doing it to get bigger and slightly faster with less proven production but similar future production on wing, which still leaves a gap at 3C.

Athanasiou could be a good Center, but so far in his NHL career, he's been a much better winger. So moving him to C, might not be what people expect out of him.

 

[Riptide]

No they wouldn't, Sheary getting 60 points on the top line helps more than Duchene maybe cracking 50 and RNH not even cracking 45 on the 3rd line.

All depends on who the replacements are. You only have half the equation.

It's not Sheary>RNH, it's whether Sheary+#3c is better than MD/RNH+winger (Shearys replacement).

What if Sprong/ZAR come in and put up 50+ points? Or that the other '#3c' the JR wants is someone who's only good for 20 pts?

 

[TimmyD]

I really think that JR is working on Duchene. I wouldn't mind seeing him take a run at Eric Staal though

 

[Honour Over Glory]

All depends on who the replacements are. You only have half the equation.

It's not Sheary>RNH, it's whether Sheary+#3c is better than MD/RNH+winger (Shearys replacement).

What if Sprong/ZAR come in and put up 50+ points? Or that the other '#3c' the JR wants is someone who's only good for 20 pts?

I like Sheary, but if he's the guy a team wants so we can get a 3C that is 2C caliber, I would maybe play with that risk. This isn't the Pens team that would pick up Boychuk, Bourque, and trash like that for wingers because they had none, we have some interesting kids in WBS - ZAR, Johnson, Sprong, etc, that can make things interesting.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

I really think that JR is working on Duchene. I wouldn't mind seeing him take a run at Eric Staal though

Wild protected Staal, they are both happy with each other, I don't think the Pens have a shot with that unless it's a gross over payment. As for Duchene, I still think it would take Maatta + Sheary to get it done, creating some rather large holes.

 

[Riptide]

How is it bat **** crazy? Sheary on the top line does more to help the Penguins win than Duchene on the 3rd line, unless Duchene can put up close to as many points on the 3rd line as Sheary can score on the top line.

Your other flaw is that youre measuring what 'helps the team more' by total points, which is a flawed method to start with.

The bottom line is this. Pittsburgh needs 3 scoring lines to have the best chance possible to 3peat. Now there's several ways to do that. My favorite is Guentzel on lw2 and Kessel on rw3 with Sheary on lw1. Given the caliber of who were likely to get as our #3c I think that's the best way to maximize everyone's skillsets.

But if your going to stack the top 6, it's not all that hard to see the benefit of having a skilled #2c playing as our #3c. Nor is it all that hard to see MD/RHN having a greater impact on the ice on the 3rd line then Sheary - either in the top 6 or on the 3rd line in an attempt to spread out the offense.

 

[Riptide]

Just a hunch, I think a 61 game sample size is a lot more logical to lean on than a 22 game cold streak. Just a hunch though.

While I tend to agree, two playoffs in a row is a little alarming. Add in that we saw Guentzel take his spot, him get HS'd and him moved around the lineup, and I think it's much more likely that he's not going to produce anywhere near. 87PPG next season. Although for the sake of my two fantasy keeper pools, I hope I'm wrong.

 

[Riptide]

I think he's just waiting out GMs to get the right price for whatever he's after and I doubt it's a big name. He'll get someone good for the cap who will be here's for awhile.

More than likely. I honestly can't see us going anywhere near the big names (MD, RNH, Bozak, etc). I think we'll see someone like Lindberg or Karlsson or Sheahan. Maybe not those guys specifically but someone more like that then MD, etc.

 

[Saints11]

I wish JR had gotten Karlsson already. Always a place for a guy like that at such a reasonable cap hit.

Yeah, I really can see Vegas being the fallback option for JR right now.

Happy to see you back, your input and insight are very welcome.

 

[TimmyD]

Wild protected Staal, they are both happy with each other, I don't think the Pens have a shot with that unless it's a gross over payment. As for Duchene, I still think it would take Maatta + Sheary to get it done, creating some rather large holes.

I wouldn't say an offensive lineup like this has holes

Guentzel Sid Hornqvist
Hagelin Malkin Kessel
Rust Duchene Sprong
Wilson Rowney/Cullen Reaves