Proposal: Rumours and Proposals Thread: Seriously Chia. We need wingers

[joestevens29]

As a $1.9m bottom pair defenseman for another season, he absolutely would.

The only way a team would value what he brings over the salary commitment is if they're able to send similar money back.

I think whoever was interested in him out of College could look at him as well. Especially a non-playoff team that is looking for a project.

 

[North]

The only nonsense in this exchange is the argument you think is happening.

I've stated very clearly multiple times that the prospect in question has minimal value. The only trade proposal I've mentioned in this exchange is the one I mentioned in the previous post that you completely ignored. The most valuable piece coming back in that deal would be Jordan Eberle. Is he going to play in Bakersfield?

I’m ignoring your proposal because even if Eberle is retained he is a UFA to be. That affects his value. You have two degraded assets coming in. That’s why you don’t trade Puljujarvi in this deal.

 

[StevenF1919]

As a $1.9m bottom pair defenseman for another season, he absolutely would.

The only way a team would value what he brings over the salary commitment is if they're able to send similar money back.

I'm not saying we should waive him. But he would clear waivers.

A young RHD who has very good numbers on the third pairing and has in the recent past shown well on the second pairing would not clear waivers.

 

[belair]

I’m ignoring your proposal because even if Eberle is retained he is a UFA to be. That affects his value. You have two degraded assets coming in. That’s why you don’t trade Puljujarvi in this deal.

Jordan Eberle retained as a rental would bring back at minimum a second round pick and a decent prospect. That is more valuable than anything we're bringing to the table there--including Jesse Puljujarvi, which is the only asset you could even argue has significant value from our end.

The fact you're calling their assets 'degraded' is all I need to know that you're not good at valuating these players.

This has gone as far as it needs to go.

 

[Little Fury]

Arizona is a team in shambles. Make too many moves based on stats and keep spinning their tires. They also moved Domi far too quickly, although Galchenyuk isn't horrid for them.

Very similar issue to what we do with young players. Play them with little insulation. Although at least we have three really good centers.

Examples?

 

[Cam98]

Jordan Eberle retained as a rental would bring back at minimum a second round pick and a decent prospect. That is more valuable than anything we're bringing to the table there--including Jesse Puljujarvi, which is the only asset you could even argue has significant value from our end.

The fact you're calling their assets 'degraded' is all I need to know that you're not good at valuating these players.

This has gone as far as it needs to go.

Yes this has gone as far as it needs to go because Puljujarvi > Dal Colle

get off your high horse if you think both are the same.

 

[t0nedeff]

You don't get it.

No, I do you look at his stat sheet and pretend like your eyes don't work when he is actually on the ice. The guy is Steve Staios bad with his constant knee jerk rims around the boards when no one is around him that get picked off or his inability to skate that is on par with Gryba who by all accounts will never be a regular in an NHL line up again. You bitch about lack of offensive depth in the line up whining about playings not contributing on the scoreboard guess what I want out of a number 6 at the very least? capable defending and he doesn't do that. Hell the guys only goal this year was a shot that missed the net and than bounced in off the goalies skate.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

(from Dec 14, 2018)

I liked Dal Colle in junior it seemed like he had the skills to be a good goal scorer, but obviously has been a disappointment for pretty much all of his career post junior with the exception of this season. I haven't watched him much since turning pro to have anything resembling an informed opinion, but it seems like Lou thinks highly of him from an interview I could find online so I don't think we'd nab him at a bargain price and really that's what I'd be looking to pay if we were going to acquire him.

 

[North]

Jordan Eberle retained as a rental would bring back at minimum a second round pick and a decent prospect. That is more valuable than anything we're bringing to the table there--including Jesse Puljujarvi, which is the only asset you could even argue has significant value from our end.

The fact you're calling their assets 'degraded' is all I need to know that you're not good at valuating these players.

This has gone as far as it needs to go.

Jordan Eberle will be lucky if he hits 40 points this year. He is going to be a UFA. Michael Dal Colle is 2 year’s older than Puljujarvi who you keep criticizing and Dal Colle hasn’t shown anything in the NHL.

The fact you can’t see these two Isles pieces are degraded in value is concerning.

Eberle won’t bring back a second and a decent prospect as a UFA to be.

GMs are a lot more frugal about what they are willing to pay for struggling assets at the deadline.

I do find it funny that you’ve repeatedly said this has gone on too long but then keep responding. Just ignore me if you don’t want to discuss it anymore.

 

[belair]

A young RHD who has very good numbers on the third pairing and has in the recent past shown well on the second pairing would not clear waivers.

Those numbers belong to Connor McDavid. But even then, bottom pairing defensemen are not something teams are falling over themselves to commit salary to--except us, apparently. Nobody is grabbing $2m of our cap commitment next year for Matthew Benning. He'd clear, without question.

 

[belair]

Yes this has gone as far as it needs to go because Puljujarvi > Dal Colle

get off your high horse if you think both are the same.

I haven't said both are the same. I've said they're in the same situation. If you can't tell the difference between the two, I really can't help you.

 

[North]

I haven't said both are the same. I've said they're in the same situation. If you can't tell the difference between the two, I really can't help you.

They are not for reasons that have already been outlined.

 

[lakai17]

Preds put former oil draft pick Svoboda on waivers today.

 

[Cloned]

There has been more effort exerted in the debates in this thread than the Oilers exert in most games this year.

 

[belair]

Jordan Eberle will be lucky if he hits 40 points this year. He is going to be a UFA. Michael Dal Colle is 2 year’s older than Puljujarvi who you keep criticizing and Dal Colle hasn’t shown anything in the NHL.

The fact you can’t see these two Isles pieces are degraded in value is concerning.

Eberle won’t bring back a second and a decent prospect as a UFA to be.

GMs are a lot more frugal about what they are willing to pay for struggling assets at the deadline.

We'll see in a few weeks, now, won't we?

The going rate for rentals, that's pretty much accurate for what they'll be able to pull in a seller's market for a player with Eberle's track record as a consistent 50 point player.

 

[CupofOil]

I haven't said both are the same. I've said they're in the same situation. If you can't tell the difference between the two, I really can't help you.

How are they in the same situation outside of waiver status?
One is 2 years older and is just starting to gain traction in the AHL in his draft+5 season while the other is 20 and is in his draft+3 season. If Pulju is still struggling in 2 years then he and Dal Colle will be in the same situation.

I'm not saying that Pulju has a ton of value but Dal Colle is dangerously close to being waiver fodder. This recent hot streak in the AHL was his last gasp effort to stay in that organization.

As for Eberle, I agree with you that somebody will pony up a 2nd+ at minimum for him. Too much scoring pedigree to not have some value at the deadline especially with retention.

 

[Shathar]

 

[belair]

They are not for reasons that have already been outlined.

Man are you going to be disappointed in a couple of weeks if he does get traded. If he doesn't, we may end up even more disappointed when they choose to pull the plug.

 

[Cloned]

We'll see in a few weeks, now, won't we?

I read this in a “Billy Zane in Titanic” accent and it sounds 100x more condescending.

 

[Stoneman89]

He gets results.

Boychuk was drafted in 2002. Pulock is an exception and even then, he didn't spend 4 years in the AHL. The rest of those guys are all bottom pairing dmen. Chances are, if your guy is still in the AHL in his draft + 5 year he's a Colton Teubert, not a Ryan Pulock.

Go look around the league. Almost every defenceman under 30 who is worth a damn was in the NHL in their draft + 5 year.

Worse dmen than Benning get traded for low round picks or bottom 6 forwards every year. I wouldn't bank on Benning improving too much but there's value in a RHD who can have success on the bottom pairing. Guys like him are a dime a dozen but they aren't worthless.

I know what results he gets. Usually scrambling around in his own end after giving the puck away. Too weak to be able to break up a cycle. Aren't you one of the ones that's always bashing Chris Russell because he doesn't meet your fancy stats criteria? Going to guess you probably think he's better than Russell.

 

[North]

We'll see in a few weeks, now, won't we?

The going rate for rentals, that's pretty much accurate for what they'll be able to pull in a seller's market for a player with Eberle's track record as a consistent 50 point player.

You’re dreaming if you think Eberle brings that back.

 

[CupofOil]

You’re dreaming if you think Eberle brings that back.

I'll take that bet. You don't think a guy with Eberle's scoring pedigree will return a 2nd+?

 

[North]

Man are you going to be disappointed in a couple of weeks if he does get traded. If he doesn't, we may end up even more disappointed when they choose to pull the plug.

I think you may be in for a surprised. I have a feeling you’ll be wiping some egg off your face.

 

[North]

I'll take that bet. You don't think a guy with Eberle's scoring pedigree will return a 2nd+?

Not a second plus a decent prospect.

 

[Cloned]

I think the Isles would probably take something like Hebig + low pick for Eberle.