Proposal: Rumours and Proposals Thread: Seriously Chia. We need wingers

[Crude]

Bob seems pretty convinced that the Oilers will be adding at least two forwards. And he thinks that if they are in the playoff picture come the deadline, they could move the first for a forward. Seems a little more than speculative on his part.

Has he said anything that indicates whether Chia is looking at rentals, or players with actual term?

 

[joestevens29]

Bob seems pretty convinced that the Oilers will be adding at least two forwards. And he thinks that if they are in the playoff picture come the deadline, they could move the first for a forward. Seems a little more than speculative on his part.

Seemed to be all speculation repeated from yesterday with Shannon saying he doesn't think the Oilers are giving up their first

 

[belair]

Pot.....meet kettle.

What are you saying here? That I overvalue our players?

 

[Heavy Dee]

Bob seems pretty convinced that the Oilers will be adding at least two forwards. And he thinks that if they are in the playoff picture come the deadline, they could move the first for a forward. Seems a little more than speculative on his part.

We are at 48 contracts And I cannot see anyone taking our trash in exchange and we are too thin to give up anything of value. I guess we are trading our first for Wayne Simmonds.

 

[StevenF1919]

No he is not. A weak terrible player. If not for our pathetic lack of depth, he would have been gonzo ages ago.

He gets results.

Boychuk played 5 and this is after 3 years of Junior

Pulock who everyone seems to want played 3. In fact pretty much all of the Isles d-men outside of Leddy played 3 or more.

Boychuk was drafted in 2002. Pulock is an exception and even then, he didn't spend 4 years in the AHL. The rest of those guys are all bottom pairing dmen. Chances are, if your guy is still in the AHL in his draft + 5 year he's a Colton Teubert, not a Ryan Pulock.

Go look around the league. Almost every defenceman under 30 who is worth a damn was in the NHL in their draft + 5 year.

And he's a right shot that is still young enough that someone would gamble on him improving. I don't know what his value is, but it's certainly not negative. This isn't a Manning-level player who is a left shot, 28 years old, higher paid, more games played with lesser results.

Worse dmen than Benning get traded for low round picks or bottom 6 forwards every year. I wouldn't bank on Benning improving too much but there's value in a RHD who can have success on the bottom pairing. Guys like him are a dime a dozen but they aren't worthless.

 

[soothsayer]

Seemed to be all speculation repeated from yesterday with Shannon saying he doesn't think the Oilers are giving up their first

Bob was putting that out there before he had John Shannon on, though. Afterwards he asked Shannon what he thought, and Shannon said maybe a 2nd, but not the 1st. To which Bob gave a conspicuously emphatic "Really!? Okay." It just seemed to me like Bob's got a line on this one.

 

[joestevens29]

He gets results.

Boychuk was drafted in 2002. Pulock I'd an exception and even then, he didn't spend 4 years in the AHL. The rest of those guys are all bottom pairing dmen. Chances are, if your guy is still in the AHL in his draft + 5 year he's a Colton Teubert, not a Ryan Pulock.

Those guys are playing top 4 on a team 7 points better than the Oilers....

 

[soothsayer]

We are at 48 contracts And I cannot see anyone taking our trash in exchange and we are too thin to give up anything of value. I guess we are trading our first for Wayne Simmonds.

He did mention Benning as a possible trade piece, for what it's worth.

 

[belair]

Seemed to be all speculation repeated from yesterday with Shannon saying he doesn't think the Oilers are giving up their first

Of course they don't. They aren't in a playoff spot. Unless we're getting someone of 1st round value--with an affordable contract-- there's no reason to put that pick on the table.

 

[CupofOil]

His contract is also up this year. And let’s be honest, if we had a GM capable of pulling that off, I’m sure he could evaluate whether or not to extend Simmonds

They can't and shouldn't extend Simmonds and they shouldn't trade for him as it will likely cost a 1st.
No trades for rentals unless it's a really cheap one. Simmonds, Zuccarello, Nyqvist etc. are going to be too costly.

Luckily, Chia is handcuffed due to his own failure so they can't trade for these guys unless they clear a lot of cap space. This is one of those instances where his incompetence is paying off.

 

[StevenF1919]

Those guys are playing top 4 on a team 7 points better than the Oilers....

And? The stars are 7 points ahead of us too and they've got Fedun in the top 4.

 

[North]

This was a response to you saying the value is off on the initial deal. You keep changing the perspective on this and putting words in my mouth. I've literally stated that Dal Colle isn't worth much more than a third round pick.

Go back and read it, man. You are being ****ing dense right now.

I’ve never once changed my view. You’re being purposely obtuse because you’ve decided to twist yourself in a pretzel to justify trading one of our few young assets and Benning for a struggling UFA to be and a player trending into bust territory.

All because you like the guy trending towards bust territory.

You have disregarded the fact that the player you like is two years older, skates poorly, has shown nothing in the NHL all the while highlighting your issues with our 20 year old asset who’s learning in the NHL.

All because you liked a guy in juniors.

Sorry if I can’t take seriously on this one.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

Would anyone do a Pulju for Burakovsky type of deal?
Reason being, we need more secondary scoring ASAP and if either player are going to click into being a dependable 2nd line threat any time soon it'll probably be Burakovsky given that he's older and (presumably) more developed in some areas. He may just click with RNH or Drai on the 2nd line. Maybe he even clicks as McDavid's LWer. Is it worth the gamble?

Burakovsky is a very fast and skilled player, but it just hasn't worked out for him in WSH. Maybe a change of scenery helps both players find their game.

Burakovsky has the knock of being very easy to push off the puck despite his size, Hitch likes players that are a bit heavier on the puck, so I'm not sure he will take a liking to him, that isn't to say we couldn't benefit from him or that he wouldn't be a good fit from a more long term outlook. I also suspect Washington is more interested in competing for another Cup rather than the potential of Pulju and would likely prefer getting someone that actively makes them a better team in the upcoming playoffs.

 

[joestevens29]

Bob was putting that out there before he had John Shannon on, though. Afterwards he asked Shannon what he thought, and Shannon said maybe a 2nd, but not the 1st. To which Bob gave a conspicuously emphatic "Really!? Okay." It just seemed to me like Bob's got a line on this one.

Maybe they are willing to if it results in a special player, just not sure who is out there that they'd unload their 1st for. Unless part of the deal is unloading Sekera as well.

 

[bone]

Schmaltz who was cheaper just went unclaimed. Not sure why Benning all of a sudden holds some sort of value. Guy really has done nothing.

42 games played, 0 goals, 5 points despite likely being given opportunity as a former first rounder vs. a guy who has played 170 NHL games with 10 goals and 44 points who got to the NHL as a free agent. The money is likely a factor, but I'd think he'd have value as an add-in to a trade. Maybe not a lot of value, but not negative.

 

[Little Fury]

Bob seems pretty convinced that the Oilers will be adding at least two forwards. And he thinks that if they are in the playoff picture come the deadline, they could move the first for a forward. Seems a little more than speculative on his part.

That's exactly the wrong approach. They should be selling everything they can at the TDL, playoff spot be damned.

 

[joestevens29]

And? The stars are 7 points ahead of us too and they've got Fedun in the top 4.

Fedun doesn't play for them

Still doesn't matter, there whole top 4 is built around guys that took time to go get into the NHL and you want to right off guys if they play in the AHL after 2 years.

 

[joestevens29]

42 games played, 0 goals, 5 points despite likely being given opportunity as a former first rounder vs. a guy who has played 170 NHL games with 10 goals and 44 points who got to the NHL as a free agent. The money is likely a factor, but I'd think he'd have value as an add-in to a trade.

Seems to be a guy that is more of a contract to even things out.

 

[bone]

Seems to be a guy that is more of a contract to even things out.

Exactly.

 

[KarmaPolice]

Burakovsky has the knock of being very easy to push off the puck despite his size, Hitch likes players that are a bit heavier on the puck, so I'm not sure he will take a liking to him, that isn't to say we couldn't benefit from him or that he wouldn't be a good fit from a more long term outlook. I also suspect Washington is more interested in competing for another Cup rather than the potential of Pulju and would likely prefer getting someone that actively makes them a better team in the upcoming playoffs.

Yeah, they probably wouldn't bite for JP. Not unless they had another trade lined-up for a winger they may have their eye on for another playoff run.

 

[StevenF1919]

Fedun doesn't play for them

Still doesn't matter, there whole top 4 is built around guys that took time to go get into the NHL and you want to right off guys if they play in the AHL after 2 years.

50% of top 4 defencemen drafted out of the CHL are NHL regulars by age 20. 75% of them are NHL regulars by the end of their age 21 season. If a guy isn't playing regularly in the league by the end of his draft + 4 season you can pretty much write him off.

 

[belair]

I’ve never once changed my view. You’re being purposely obtuse because you’ve decided to twist yourself in a pretzel to justify trading one of our few young assets and Benning for a struggling UFA to be and a player trending into bust territory.

All because you like the guy trending towards bust territory.

You have disregarded the fact that the player you like is two years older, skates poorly, has shown nothing in the NHL all the while highlighting your issues with our 20 year old asset who’s learning in the NHL.

All because you liked a guy in juniors.

Sorry if I can’t take seriously on this one.

Nope. I responded half seriously to a guy posting a backhanded chirp towards Chiarelli, stating that something might make sense if we're trying to improve the team today. Trading Matt Benning and clearing the $1.9m owed to him next season for a UFA Jordan Eberle--who I also mentioned would need to be retained--and a swap of poorly trending prospects.

That's the descriptive version of the initial post you responded to, saying that the value was off. The exchange since then has had almost nothing to do about how I liked a prospect in junior.

However, you do seem to take offense to the idea that I still like the prospect in question. So much as to believe that trading a negatively valued asset in Matthew Benning would somehow be 'fair' in exchange for a former top five pick currently posting a PPG in the AHL that can simply be walked away from at season's end.

Please, just stop. Go back and read this from the beginning if you feel inclined to push forward. You missed something very early on.

 

[StevenF1919]

I would legit rather take back a 3rd rounder rather than another garbage Islanders bust. Why do we need to keep fixing their mistakes for them?

 

[joestevens29]

50% of top 4 defencemen drafted out of the CHL are NHL regulars by age 20. 75% of them are NHL regulars by the end of their age 21 season. If a guy isn't playing regularly in the league by the end of his draft + 4 season you can pretty much write him off.

Again this is just wrong as I pointed out one team's whole core took more than draft +4.

Jake Muzzin wasn't a NHL regular until his 7th year. No one on vegas was a regular in draft +4. There are tonnes of guys.

 

[StevenF1919]

Again this is just wrong as I pointed out one team's whole core took more than draft +4.

Jake Muzzin wasn't a NHL regular until his 7th year. No one on vegas was a regular in draft +4. There are tonnes of guys.

I literally just posted the data. This isn't an opinion, it's an objective fact that 75% of top 4 defencemen as of January of last year who were drafted out of the CHL had played at least 41 NHL games by the end of their age 21 season. 50% of those guys played 41 games before they even turned 21.

You can post exceptions all you want but it would be ridiculous to make decisions that run counter to the majority of cases because of a few outliers. More teams need to start cutting these guys loose earlier and getting some value out of them before they become completely worthless tbh.