Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2019-20 Pt. IX: Bubble Hockey

[SI]

Trade our #1RD and best forward prospect for a guy who's averaged 60 games a year with multiple injury concerns thus far in his career? What could go wrong

If you are trading Pulock, then you go after Laine.

agreed, Boeser is too risky and would not excel on the PP like Laine could.

 

[The Wahligator]

If you are trading Pulock, then you go after Laine.

agreed, Boeser is too risky and would not excel on the PP like Laine could.

Laine is certainly intriguing because you cannot teach a shot and goal scoring instincts like that, he is similar to Bossy and Ovi in that sense (obviously a much lesser version).

Even he is a little risky though imo because of his consistency issues. He would demand at least Pulock or Dobson in a trade, and rumor has it he is looking to get PAID on top of that. If we're giving up an asset like that and also forking over a massive contract, ideally it would be for a player we can count on at ALL times. Is Laine that guy? Only time will tell.

It's undeniable that his ceiling is sky-high, but whether or not he can get there and stay there consistently is the question.

 

[dlawong]

Actually I think the best solution is to trade Pulock plus Wahlstrom to Canucks for Boeser which I think will be win-win. Boeser has even better shots than Laine and he is a competitor and already knows Nelson well. Canucks will bite because Pulock will be the perfect partner Hughes needs and Wahlstrom can potentially replace Boeser down the road. If this is too much for Isles, Canucks has some pretty good prospects in the system and Isles can maybe ask for one of them coming back. Getting Boeser may be the key to entice Barzal to stay with Isles too. Wahlstrom will be the trigger that will pull the trade.

To resign both Barzal and Boeser, you will have to move another contract, thus trade Cizikas to a western team missing a top defensive center capable to fit him under their cap. Maybe the Oilers be interested? He can be the difference helping them to make the postseason and do well in the playoff. Leddy will have to go too to make room for resigning Beau, Toews, and Pelech. Just find a team that needs an LD and has the cap room to add him. Go with the highest bidder for him, but only take picks/prospects coming back. Resign Greene for a year with Aho as the first injury call up a replacement. Dobson into Pulock's spot with BJ and Mayfield taking turns on 4th and 6th spot. Send a college RD or Wilde to AHL to prep for RD call up for injury replacement.

By the way, do not downplay Reinhart that much. Even you go to the Sabres board they actually really like him and would not give him away easily. He was picked #2 overall for a reason and may not yet fully fulfill his elite potential yet.

Now about how to find that sniper for Barzal? You will have to overpay a UFA and may not have room anyway and you do not have high enough draft this year to get one via the draft and the best asset you can potentially move to land one is probably Pulock so do the math. If you can resign Barzal via a short bridge deal you better find that sniper within one year or he will not come back next time. If any team has a sniper already they will either hold on to him or demand a random coming back via a trade - top D, top prospect, and draft pick. Or maybe you will get an older winger with an expansive expiring contract who was a sniper but has lost that consistency due to aging/injury (like Perry and Ladd). The only other option is to keep one of Wahlstrom and Bellows and hope they can turn into a 30 + goal scorers or make a deal like Pulock + for Boeser (both RFA and both team has different top needs).

Of course, the best option for Isles is:
1) trade Leddy and Cizikas for cap space in the fall
2) resign Barzal and Pulock assuming no crazy offer sheet out there to distract either one of them to get it done before next season start
3) do not bring Martin back, get Johnston to play for his spot or another LW prospect
4) trade another asset to hopefully get a prospect who can score goals or a player who did before but has for some reason not yet kept up that lately to help with depth scoring (Comtois or Milano from Anaheim and Mantha from Detroit hopefully maybe trade options without too much going back the other way)
5) Promote one of Bellows, Wahlstrom, or Homestrom for a chance to play with the team on bottom lines first, priority to Bellows if not traded in any package
6) promote Otto to play 4th line center for Isles

Other options are out there as some may have suggested with Parise and so on. I still think Ladd's contract will be really hard to move unless you add a big sweetener with it so there will be a big cost to this. If you can find a way to trade Komarov for the bottom 2020 pick you do it too.

 

[danteipp]

With respect to Laine, I would want to hear Trotz's opinion on him (of course we won't get that unless there is an actual trade), since he has typically known what players he can get to buy into his system and find another gear. Like Brock Nelson.

As for Martin, I would welcome him back on a one-year or even two-year deal at $1.0 to $1.25 million AAV. He can essentially platoon with Johnston next season and then he is easily tradeable or sent to the AHL in the second season, if his game declines or he is forced out of the rotation by the improvement of other players like Bellows, Wahlstrom, etc.

That said, I can (unfortunately) see the Rags overpay for Martin as a replacement for Fast. Gorton isn't exactly an innovative GM if he doesn't fall @SS backwards into a lottery pick, top UFA or a player forcing his way to the Raggies for pennies on the dollar in trade.

I have a feeling that Lou already has plans for managing the salary cap and the RFAs. There are always ways around the cap, even if they run a short roster at times to bank cap space.

Toronto did it this past year by playing games with LTIR/IR and banking money. The only problem is that limits you at the trade deadline unless you get the other team to eat salary and pay a premium in trade comp.

 

[Uncle Duke]

No it’s not. Only reason Parise is discussed is in context of moving Ladd’s contract. It’s an attempt to turn completely dead-weight to something useful... albeit with different risks.

Moreover it’s not a difficult argument to suggest Parise in these playoffs could have been the difference of the Isles playing game seven last night.

But again, I’m not endorsing said trade, just trying to apply perspective.

Everything that has happened in the 2020 playoffs, while 100%valid, are one-offs and were and are an exercise that hopefully will never have to be duplicated.

And discussing Parise is sniffing around at the margins. The Isles needs go deeper than that and while he's still fairly productive, in the end it's another bad contract for an aging winger.

 

[seabass45]

Actually I think the best solution is to trade Pulock plus Wahlstrom to Canucks for Boeser which I think will be win-win. Boeser has even better shots than Laine and he is a competitor and already knows Nelson well. Canucks will bite because Pulock will be the perfect partner Hughes needs and Wahlstrom can potentially replace Boeser down the road. If this is too much for Isles, Canucks has some pretty good prospects in the system and Isles can maybe ask for one of them coming back. Getting Boeser may be the key to entice Barzal to stay with Isles too. Wahlstrom will be the trigger that will pull the trade.

To resign both Barzal and Boeser, you will have to move another contract, thus trade Cizikas to a western team missing a top defensive center capable to fit him under their cap. Maybe the Oilers be interested? He can be the difference helping them to make the postseason and do well in the playoff. Leddy will have to go too to make room for resigning Beau and Pelech. Just find a team that needs an LD and has the cap room to add him. Go with the highest bidder for him, but picks/prospects over players coming back. Resign Greene for a year and move Aho into the bottom left spot. Dobson into Pulock's spot with BJ and Mayfield take turns. Find a cheap RD for one year in UFA to play bottom 6 RD or try out a signed college prospect or Wilde for that spot.

By the way, do not downplay Reinhart that much. Even you go to the Sabres board they actually really like him and would not give him away freely. He was picked #2 overall for a reason and may not yet fully fulfill his potential yet.

We wouldn't need to add to Pulock to get Boeser. I believe @Chapin Landvogt mentioned how we sometimes undervalue top RD's and this would def be a case where that's happening. I do the same with Laine, we might not need to add much more to Pulock to get him, given his current warts (Winnipeg fans prob feel differently).

 

[dlawong]

Trade our #1RD and best forward prospect for a guy who's averaged 60 games a year with multiple injury concerns thus far in his career? What could go wrong

I think Boeser is young enough to overcome those injuries none of that is that series to derail his career. I watched him playoff enough in Vancouver and yes he is the runner up to Barzal in his rookie year for the Calder and his skill is unbelievable as evidenced in the all-star game shooting competition. It was not an accident that he can score like that. Big character guy too. I think Canucks would love to keep him but they need big dollars to keep the big 3 - Petterson and Hughes both are going to be NHL superstars and of course one of the best 2 way NHL 2nd line centers in Bo. When you are #4 on your team then even if you are really good you can be dispensable if the right trade comes back.

If you can do the deal without adding Wahlstrom of course you do that. If I were a Canucks fan, however, I may want a more offensively gifted D coming back though (like one of the top two in Carolina or Dallas) and I am not sure if Pulock enough will trigger the trade as his offensive production will not make up for what is lost by not resigning Boeser. I also said that if Isles is able to resign both Pulock and Barzal and need a sniper just try Wahlstrom with Barzal and see if this works. If resigning both are going to be a problem and they need to give up one, it will be easier to give up Pulock for a sniper for Barzal. It may also not have to be Wahlstrom packaged, it can be Bellows instead. If Boeser is ever available for trade, there will be competing offers for him, I guaranteed and you will not be able to lowball their GM for it.

 

[Sparksrus3]

Are you out of your mind? Seriously. Are you nuts?

I vote yes

 

[SI90]

Laine is the exact type of player you want on Barzals wing and on the PP. one of the top shooters in the world and he’s only 22.

If you’re the islanders you make a serious push for him.


I don’t want to hear about him being inconsistent. Guy still ends the season with a stupid amount of goals. Just 22 years old.

 

[PWJunior]

Laine is the exact type of player you want on Barzals wing and on the PP. one of the top shooters in the world and he’s only 22.

If you’re the islanders you make a serious push for him.


I don’t want to hear about him being inconsistent. Guy still ends the season with a stupid amount of goals. Just 22 years old.

He brings nothing else, nothing. Yes he an elite goal scorer who possesses a lethal shot, but he is also as one dimensional as you'll find in the entire league. If he's not burying it, he's more useless than the p***y version of Eberle.

 

[dlawong]

Hopefully Pulock & Barzal can both be resigned soon as the longer the deals are dragged the likelihood more future cap will have to be tied up.

I know that Canucks are actually actively going after a deal to acquire Dumba as the partner for Hughes and a very good chance that Boeser may be going the other way so Laine may be the more realistic target for Isles and you only do that if you can't resign both Pulock and Barzal for some unexpected obstacles.

The best option if all trades are not good is to be bold & let both Bellows and Wahlstrom playing up in NHL next season and bury some of the bad contracts in AHL for good until more contracts come off the book after next two seasons. Those will be hard and unpopular decisions too but you can always go that route.

 

[SayItAintSoJohnny]

Leafs are not going to go for that deal. Hyman is highly valued and if they were going to dump salary to even up the deal it would be Kerfoot or Johnsson coming the other way.

I would love to land a 1st for
Leddy, but two 2nds is what I expect.

You could be right, but they would not be paying Boychuk anything this season (although a 3.75 cap hit when taking off Hyman). The obvious reason I included Hyman was he is in his contract year and the Leafs most certainly won't be able to afford him

 

[SI90]

He brings nothing else, nothing. Yes he an elite goal scorer who possesses a lethal shot, but he is also as one dimensional as you'll find in the entire league. If he's not burying it, he's more useless than the p***y version of Eberle.

but he scores. This team plays plenty of defense. Laine is a legit 35+ goal scorer and could score 50 and no one would be surprised. We need a player that can score goals. It’s one thing we lack. We need a sniper.

 

[PWJunior]

but he scores. This team plays plenty of defense. Laine is a legit 35+ goal scorer and could score 50 and no one would be surprised. We need a player that can score goals. It’s one thing we lack. We need a sniper.

Everyone knows he scores, but he doesn't contribute otherwise. If he is so amazing, why in hell would Winnipeg ever part with him? He has serious warts, he's going to be expensive to acquire, and he wants to get paid hard. Strike one, strike two, and strike three.

Considering our situation, he's not the right guy. Stop staring at the shiny toy and use your head. You're better than that, that's how winning is done!

 

[PK Cronin]

Ross Johnston is not a long-term everyday starter as Martin has been for nearly a decade. No matter what so many on here believe, Johnston is not a legit NHL hockey player.

Just like a rookie couldn't possibly play in the playoffs, right?

Martin is a veteran who took a long time to get to where he is now (Martin only played early in his career because the team sucked). Johnston can get there too. He showed a lot of discipline in the playoffs and didn't run around doing anything that cost the team. In fact, in his last start he was one of the only forwards getting good opportunities. The hate about Johnston is unwarranted.

 

[GrandmaSlices51631]

Just like a rookie couldn't possibly play in the playoffs, right?

Martin is a veteran who took a long time to get to where he is now (Martin only played early in his career because the team sucked). Johnston can get there too. He showed a lot of discipline in the playoffs and didn't run around doing anything that cost the team. In fact, in his last start he was one of the only forwards getting good opportunities. The hate about Johnston is unwarranted.

Right behind you PK. Just because of Johnston's appearance and fists, he has been written off as a worthless goon. He is a good skater for a big guy, hits like a truck and has showed flashes of offensive ability, even if he's only cashed in a few times. I think he is a great project player and if anyone could turn him into a productive NHL regular, it is Trotz. Johnston is surprising agile for a guy with his build , in 74 NHL games he has 7G 7A for 14 points. Mind you, he hasn't seen NHL ice with any kind of consistency, he's been in and out of the line up and played low minutes.

I really believe that if Johnston got the shot at a regular roster spot, over the course of a full season, he could be a net positive on a checking line while putting up something like 12G 13A. I see a guy who can contribute 25 points and beat the living shit out our opponents with hits and fists if necessary. He's still useful as a 3rd or 4th liner. He certainly brings more than Dal Colle or Kuhnackl. Until we have a legitimate 3rd line LW that has proven otherwise, Johnston is the guy in our system, with pro experience that has the most impact on a game.

 

[PK Cronin]

Right behind you PK. Just because of Johnston's appearance and fists, he has been written off as a worthless goon. He is a good skater for a big guy, hits like a truck and has showed flashes of offensive ability, even if he's only cashed in a few times. I think he is a great project player and if anyone could turn him into a productive NHL regular, it is Trotz. Johnston is surprising agile for a guy with his build , in 74 NHL games he has 7G 7A for 14 points. Mind you, he hasn't seen NHL ice with any kind of consistency, he's been in and out of the line up and played low minutes.

I really believe that if Johnston got the shot at a regular roster spot, over the course of a full season, he could be a net positive on a checking line while putting up something like 12G 13A. I see a guy who can contribute 25 points and beat the living shit out our opponents with hits and fists if necessary. He's still useful as a 3rd or 4th liner. He certainly brings more than Dal Colle or Kuhnackl. Until we have a legitimate 3rd line LW that has proven otherwise, Johnston is the guy in our system, with pro experience that has the most impact on a game.

He needs to replace a guy who has had a career high of 19 points. He can definitely do that.

 

[YearlyLottery]

Just like a rookie couldn't possibly play in the playoffs, right?

Martin is a veteran who took a long time to get to where he is now (Martin only played early in his career because the team sucked). Johnston can get there too. He showed a lot of discipline in the playoffs and didn't run around doing anything that cost the team. In fact, in his last start he was one of the only forwards getting good opportunities. The hate about Johnston is unwarranted.

Growth is a key word when talking about these guys. My biggest gripe with Johnston is that he never showed enough discipline. In the playoffs two guys showed tremendous growth for me in this department. Johnston and Barzal who does not get enough credit for how much he matured in the playoffs.

Throw Johnston on the fourth line. Not the first, not the second, and not the third. Let him play on the fourth line and make mistakes. He will learn. Will he be a better player than Martin? That I am not sure. I do see a bigger player who is a better skater, better fighter, and someone who we do not have to commit to for potentially 3 years for big money since he is signed to a cheap deal. I have a suspicion that Lou saw this coming which is why he signed Johnston to that four year deal.

Anyway, this talk about Martin or Johnston is useless because if this team does not find a way to get another top six forward in here all of this talk will be useless.

 

[PK Cronin]

Growth is a key word when talking about these guys. My biggest gripe with Johnston is that he never showed enough discipline. In the playoffs two guys showed tremendous growth for me in this department. Johnston and Barzal who does not get enough credit for how much he matured in the playoffs.

Throw Johnston on the fourth line. Not the first, not the second, and not the third. Let him play on the fourth line and make mistakes. He will learn. Will he be a better player than Martin? That I am not sure. I do see a bigger player who is a better skater, better fighter, and someone who we do not have to commit to for potentially 3 years for big money since he is signed to a cheap deal. I have a suspicion that Lou saw this coming which is why he signed Johnston to that four year deal.

Anyway, this talk about Martin or Johnston is useless because if this team does not find a way to get another top six forward in here all of this talk will be useless.

I agree on all accounts. I don't think Martin vs Johnston is the difference between winning the cup or not. In fact, we just saw it wasn't.

 

[Duanesutter12]

I love MM and he has played himself into another contract. I hope he stays. I fervently hope he doesn't go to Rags if he leaves. But if he does...they will have overpaid and toughened their own Cap situation. In the end, he'll do what's best for him and his family money-wise.

But we are all getting emotional. Lou will not allow emotion to enter into this. The ID line is nearing its end as it is. Casey a UFA next summer. CC on a big contract for what he does. Can't see LL overcommitting to MM but will try to get him to stay. But someone out there is going to want him, including Rangers

I can see Lou doing a slight overpay but no term. One year at $2M is a nice contract for Martin and nothing that is going to damage our cap situation.

 

[Duanesutter12]

If the negotiation with Barzal does not go well and his agency would like to entertain the offer sheet offers (in the way like the real estate agent open house when they had multiple offers at the same time already to drive up the selling price), I do think trading him would not necessary be a bad thing. I would consider Buffalo's Reinhart who can be a very good 2-way center and Barzal can provide the 1-2 punch the Sabres needs and match up to high offensive teams like Tampa and Toronto in their divisions. Reinhart plus a 2nd round 2020 or 2021 pick and maybe one of Isles D prospect going back the other way. I would also look to see if Domi is available if the Reinhart trade works out as those two players had shown a lot of chemistry in WJC previously and reuniting them can possibly bring the best out of both. You can possibly move Leddy plus Bellows to the Habs for Domi and 4th round pick.

The other option is to see if the Blackhawks will be interested to move Dylan Strome for a none core D as their D can really use an upgrade. Strome can play wing or be Isles back up plan in case Barzal leaves for a large offer sheet. I do not know too much about the Blackhawks' cap situation except that they may have lots of money tied up in Kane, Toews, Keith and they need money to resign one of their goalies. Why interested in Strome? He has a good shot and likely will not demand big money when the time comes to resign him.

The ideal situation is to retain Barzal without having to put Isles's future cap in hell and unable to resign Pulock this fall.

The one asset I will not part is Dobson and reluctantly Wahlstrom and Holmstrom. Their ceiling are too high to be given away this early. Snow traded Nino too early and Nino end up having a pretty good NHL career on two teams. I hope Isles do not repeat this with Wahlstrom.

But did Nino really have a good career on two teams? Solid NHL player but nowhere near the "future power forward" he was drafted to be. In fact, you can make the argument we got the more useful player in that trade.

 

[Duanesutter12]

I don't really care. You want to give Martin a 3-4 year deal? That is how you end up in a Clutterbuck, Boychuk, or Ladd situation and then we can sit here and complain in 2 years because Lou gave a guy a long term deal who had a good playoff run.

Also, Johnston being a better skater than Martin is not debatable. That is a simple fact. Martin has other traits which make me pause that Johnston will be a better replacement year one (he won't), but by years 2 or 3 Johnston is going to learn and be better than what Martin would be giving us.

Johnston is raw but he's got NHL skills. Good skater and actually has a decent hard shot. He has a long way to go before he proves to be a full time contributor but he's got the skills. I remember Tom Wilson's rookie year when this board was up in arms about how useless a hockey player he was and how he was only a goon. Well, he's turned out to be a pretty good player. I realize Ross is older but I think he can be a valuable fourth line grinder with more playing time.

 

[MJF]

Ross Johnston is not a long-term everyday starter as Martin has been for nearly a decade. No matter what so many on here believe, Johnston is not a legit NHL hockey player.

Do you remember the days when Martin and Cizikas were good for one rush and then would spend the rest of the shift pinned in their own end? Yeah Martin wasn't a legit NHL player back then either.

Ross Johnston has a better tool box now than Matt Martin did his first couple of years in the NHL.

 

[MJF]

Johnston is raw but he's got NHL skills. Good skater and actually has a decent hard shot. He has a long way to go before he proves to be a full time contributor but he's got the skills. I remember Tom Wilson's rookie year when this board was up in arms about how useless a hockey player he was and how he was only a goon. Well, he's turned out to be a pretty good player. I realize Ross is older but I think he can be a valuable fourth line grinder with more playing time.

I think with Johnston it may be a case of him getting used to what he can do in the NHL. Sometimes muscle players take a little longer to mature. They have to work harder to hone the rest of their game.

 

[Duanesutter12]

Actually I think the best solution is to trade Pulock plus Wahlstrom to Canucks for Boeser which I think will be win-win. Boeser has even better shots than Laine and he is a competitor and already knows Nelson well. Canucks will bite because Pulock will be the perfect partner Hughes needs and Wahlstrom can potentially replace Boeser down the road. If this is too much for Isles, Canucks has some pretty good prospects in the system and Isles can maybe ask for one of them coming back. Getting Boeser may be the key to entice Barzal to stay with Isles too. Wahlstrom will be the trigger that will pull the trade.

To resign both Barzal and Boeser, you will have to move another contract, thus trade Cizikas to a western team missing a top defensive center capable to fit him under their cap. Maybe the Oilers be interested? He can be the difference helping them to make the postseason and do well in the playoff. Leddy will have to go too to make room for resigning Beau and Pelech. Just find a team that needs an LD and has the cap room to add him. Go with the highest bidder for him, but picks/prospects over players coming back. Resign Greene for a year and move Aho into the bottom left spot. Dobson into Pulock's spot with BJ and Mayfield take turns. Find a cheap RD for one year in UFA to play bottom 6 RD or try out a signed college prospect or Wilde for that spot.

By the way, do not downplay Reinhart that much. Even you go to the Sabres board they actually really like him and would not give him away freely. He was picked #2 overall for a reason and may not yet fully fulfill his potential yet.

I think we underestimate how valuable good defenseman are because we have so many of them. I would argue Pulock for Boeser straight is fair value!