Speculation: Roster Speculation Part V: Looking to Trade 1sts for Rentals ONLY

[SundherDome]

He worked well with ROR not so much Jack.

Not sure at this point though how much is his diminished game post concussion and how much is his centers. A big reason KO clicked so well with ROR was due to him being a highly skilled center who could also grind/cycle. Which is why I think Okposo’s has played well with Larsson. It’s a return for him to that grind and cycle game. But Larsson obviously is not nearly as talented as ROR.

Agreed, I noted a little while ago that Okposo cannot be the person driving zone entry. With Larsson and Girgs they dump and retrieve which allows Okposo to cycle. I think ideally, in a world of depth, Okposo, Larsson and Oloffson would be a great third line. Kyle shoots in, Larsson retrieves, Kyle cycles until Oloffson is in a spot to get a release off.

 

[Team Cozens]

Would you trade him at 50% retained? I would most definitely take $3M back on our cap for the next four seasons.

I can't imagine many teams would even be willing to do that, as they can see what we see, a guy barely holding on to the NHL at this point. He'd have to go to a team that is not so concerned about Cap Space.

I would retain up to 25% in a heart beat. I would also add the SJ first to make it happen.
The Devils is the team I keep looking at with their $14 million cap space now and $32 million cap space next year.
Botts has a great relationship with Ray Shero from their Pens days.
I'm terrible with value but....

Okposo
Beaulieu
Nylander / Sheary?
Fitzgerald
SJ 1st

for

Marcus Johansson
Ben Lovejoy

 

[Icicle]

I wonder if Minnesota would be interested in Scandella again. Scandella + for Coyle might be a good deal. We get a center and Beaulieu gets to play.

Might get them to bite on McCabe+Sobotka for Coyle

They need a RD while Dumba is out, and McCabe plays that side often enough, and has value to counter the Sobotka loss.

 

[debaser66]

I’d be interested in Brayden Schenn. Not sure what it would take, but that could work.
(Full disclosure...I did no cap homework etc...random thought)

They just fleeced us of our center depth for nothing that helps this season you think they redo it?

 

[Team Cozens]

Would anyone trade Girgensons or Larsson straight up for Brassard?

Penguins have 100k in cap space, we cannot dump Sobotka as a plus on to them unless we retain 50% or take a cheap player back.

Even if we managed to dump Sobotka on to them, I'm not sure losing one of two effective RFA players for a rental is worth it.

Of course, if some magical deal around Sobotka 50% + late picks/uneventful prospects occurs, I'd be all for it, but with Girgensons or Larsson.

Yes, and the Pens save $2.4 Cap Space as benefit to them....

 

[joshjull]

@Mitts888

I think the only way we can trade Okposo’s contract is if we take on a similar crappy deal and hope that player works out better. I just don’t see teams looking to add him at 6mil per for another 4 yrs without either unloading a similar length crappy deal or maybe 2 crappy shorter term deals.

Obviously I hope I’m wrong in this.

 

[Team Cozens]

@Mitts888

I think the only way we can trade Okposo’s contract is if we take on a similar crappy deal and hope that player works out better. I just don’t see teams looking to add him at 6mil per for another 4 yrs without either unloading a similar length crappy deal or maybe 2 crappy shorter term deals.

Obviously I hope I’m wrong in this.

Sadly, I agree. just trying to find any possible scenario with a crappy contract coming back.
Ideally we take a terrible contract with 2/3 years left on it. I haven't looked at the buyout calculator
to see what Botts might have in mind as well.

 

[OkimLom]

I simply disagree. You're basing things off of pre-head injury Okposo. His hands and feet have lost a step or two, and he doesn't make plays quick enough in this league. Too many pucks die on his stick.

I'm sorry, I don't even see a $3M winger at this point. He's simply a shell of a player that he once was. It's amazing how several big contracts to the bigger, slower UFAs have completely come back to bite teams.

And that's magnified when he's playing with centers that isn't strong offensively. I don't see that much of a difference in his decision making or foot speed pre injury and post injury. He never was a guy that was quick, he always was slow at getting his wrist shot off. I think why people are now "realizing" a possible regression, is because he's being played in different roles that showcase these slower moments much more often. He should not be playing up high in the Umbrella on the PP2 and tasked as one of the decision makers on the line. He should be a slot guy or a guy down low around the crease (like he was used under Bylsma on the PP).

Don't get me wrong, I don't think we should be paying $6 million for a bottom 6 player, but we have no centers on this team that have shown consistently to be able to work with Okposo and his shortcomings, not to mention he's not a good fit on this team stylistically (quite honestly he wasn't a fit when he arrived when Tim went from heavy puck possession mindset to quicker dump and chase mindset). We have too many aging vets on the team that are in our bottom 6. I didn't really like the contract when it happened, but I saw him have some qualities that fit with a guy like ROR or Reinhart, which showed on the ice with ROR. So I wasn't too mad with Okposo. Now that we don't have that type of center, or even the quality of that guy anymore, he's pretty much useless on this roster.

 

[joshjull]

Sadly, I agree. just trying to find any possible scenario with a crappy contract coming back.
Ideally we take a terrible contract with 2/3 years left on it. I haven't looked at the buyout calculator
to see what Botts might have in mind as well.

It would save more cap space if we traded him with 50% retained than buying him out.

If bought out June 2019 it would be 4mil, 4mil, 5mil, 3mil then 4yrs of 1mil.

June 2020 would be 4mil, 5mil, 3mil then 3yrs of 1mil each.

Numbers from capgeek

Compared to 3mil per for 4 years (or however many years remain when traded) with 50% retained


Trading him with 50% retained may be the way to go after looking at those numbers

 

[Reddawg]

Trading him with 50% retained may be the way to go after looking at those numbers

Still assumes that anyone wants him to do what he does for $3 million a year.

I honestly think our best chance is paying Seattle a hefty price to take him.

 

[joshjull]

Still assumes that anyone wants him to do what he does for $3 million a year.

I agree it would still be a tough sell but much easier than at 6mil. Plus sweeteners could be added where we move picks and/or prospects with him for minimal return. As opposed to taking on crappy contracts to move his crappy contract.

 

[joshjull]

Still assumes that anyone wants him to do what he does for $3 million a year.

I honestly think our best chance is paying Seattle a hefty price to take him.

Why does Seattle take him? Vegas didn’t take on any older players on long term crappy deals like Okposo’s. Don’t get me wrong, I’d love to see something like this work out. I just don’t see why Seattle would bother unless it’s an crazy payment on our end to get them to.

 

[Reddawg]

I agree it would still be a tough sell but much easier than at 6mil. Plus sweeteners could be added where we move picks and/or prospects with him for minimal return. As opposed to taking on crappy contracts to move his crappy contract.

That's why I think he'll go to Seattle, they will need to take on cap space to get above the floor while simultaneously stockpiling picks and prospects. Okposo checks a lot of boxes in an expansion draft. Thankfully he just has a NTC, not a NMC.

 

[joshjull]

That's why I think he'll go to Seattle, they will need to take on cap space to get above the floor while simultaneously stockpiling picks and prospects. Okposo checks a lot of boxes in an expansion draft. Thankfully he just has a NTC, not a NMC.

I’d don’t see Okposo being their expansion draft pick which would be the only way around the NTC. Especially when they will have far better and younger options available from us. I don’t see the incentive for them.

 

[Reddawg]

Why does Seattle take him? Vegas didn’t take on any older players on long term crappy deals like Okposo’s. Don’t get me wrong, I’d love to see something like this work out. I just don’t see why Seattle would bother unless it’s an crazy payment on our end to get them to.

They took Clarkson in a trade for a couple good picks, as they had the available cap space to just let him sit there. I can't see any reason why Seattle wouldn't be interested in adding good picks in exchange for a player that actually still plays and can help them out.

 

[Reddawg]

I’d don’t see Okposo being their expansion draft pick which would be the only way around the NTC. Especially when they will have far better and younger options available from us. I don’t see the incentive for them.

To my eyes, the main pieces we'll have to expose in the expansion auction are Guhle, Smith and Asplund...I don't really consider any of them to be far better, though they're definitely younger and team-controlled. You can trade assets for expansion consderation.

 

[CatsforReinhart]

Would anyone trade Girgensons or Larsson straight up for Brassard?

Penguins have 100k in cap space, we cannot dump Sobotka as a plus on to them unless we retain 50% or take a cheap player back.

Even if we managed to dump Sobotka on to them, I'm not sure losing one of two effective RFA players for a rental is worth it.

Of course, if some magical deal around Sobotka 50% + late picks/uneventful prospects occurs, I'd be all for it, but with Girgensons or Larsson.

Scandella + 3rd for Brassard would be what I would offer, even then would be skeptical since Brassard is an UFA. Not sure if we would want to resign him. Think Schenn or Duchene would be my target.

 

[sabrebuild]

They took Clarkson in a trade for a couple good picks, as they had the available cap space to just let him sit there. I can't see any reason why Seattle wouldn't be interested in adding good picks in exchange for a player that actually still plays and can help them out.

I think one of those picks was a first. Ouch.

 

[Reddawg]

I think one of those picks was a first. Ouch.

It was, they got the #24 overall pick from Columbus and then flipped it to Winnipeg to move up to #13 and take Nick Suzuki.

 

[Icicle]

Scandella + 3rd for Brassard would be what I would offer, even then would be skeptical since Brassard is an UFA. Not sure if we would want to resign him. Think Schenn or Duchene would be my target.

Doesn't work with the Pegnuin's cap

 

[CatsforReinhart]

Doesn't work with the Pegnuin's cap

Sure take salary back...deals can be worked out.

 

[joshjull]

They took Clarkson in a trade for a couple good picks, as they had the available cap space to just let him sit there. I can't see any reason why Seattle wouldn't be interested in adding good picks in exchange for a player that actually still plays and can help them out.

But that’s a trade which would require Okposo to waive his NTC. Plus Clarkson was a given to be on the LTIR every year once the season started. Thus allowing Vegas to have that cap space during the season. Okposo would not provide that.

 

[CatsforReinhart]

Seattle is not going to take Okposo with out a sweetner. Our hope should be the CBA gets renegotiated next year and there is a compliance buyout phase.

 

[Uberpecker]

Would anyone trade Girgensons or Larsson straight up for Brassard?

Penguins have 100k in cap space, we cannot dump Sobotka as a plus on to them unless we retain 50% or take a cheap player back.

Even if we managed to dump Sobotka on to them, I'm not sure losing one of two effective RFA players for a rental is worth it.

Of course, if some magical deal around Sobotka 50% + late picks/uneventful prospects occurs, I'd be all for it, but with Girgensons or Larsson.

Not excited about breaking up our only other functioning line for Brassard, Scandella straight up is about as much as I would give up for him. Struggling 2nd pairing d for struggling 2c. Plus Scandella is younger, cheaper and has term. Pens could do worse.
That being said, Pens fans seem to expect the moon for him, some posters on their board were seriously suggesting Brassard for Panarin one-for-one.

 

[Der Jaeger]

Trocheck is back. Wonder if that makes McCann available. He's skating on their 4th line.