Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part LXXIX - Clever Title

[RGY]

NHL Rumor Mill – February 12, 2021 | Spectors Hockey

I am still interested in Bennett. Deal DeAngelo separately elsewhere

 

[Barnaby]

It’s funny, there was a perception that Lindgren was a borderline prospect and Hajek was a better one.

I never saw it that way based on their draft positions and progress to that point, and I can’t say I ever heard anyone in the organization express that view either.

It feels like it’s one of those narratives that started somewhere and no one really knows how it started or why.

I think the perception was that Nash had deteriorated and was a rental and the Rangers did well, but McDonough was the big prize. Him being dealt was supposed to bring back a lot more than Nash. Obviously, it hasn’t quite worked out that way. Hajek was supposed to be a top 4, Howden was supposed to be a middle 6, one or hopefully two first rounders all judged by how good and important McDonough had been. Of course, comparing Hajek to Lindgren based on who they were dealt for was silly, but I think that’s where the view stemmed from.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Roslovic looks good eh, lots of people dumping on me for wanting to buy low on him last year.
As for Bennett, i like him but he doesn't solve our future issues, i still believe we need to be hunting a recently drafted center to possibly replace Zib if he leaves or Strome when he does. Bennett isnt good enough to be relied on if both of those guys leave. To me, if Arizona would move Hayden or Edmonton Lavoie thats the type of player im looking for.

 

[Barnaby]

I've seen numerous situations where Lindgren has been Fox-like patient with the puck.

In addition to playing a stiff game, he's developing a very smart and complimentary style to a Fox or what may end up being a great partner for Nils when he comes over.

If you're looking for a partner for a rookie that will actually help in the kids development, I think you look no further than Ryan L.

Regarding center options, anyone worth acquiring is gonna cost.

So, a package containing the following:

a top 5 protected 1st in 21 or 22

One of Nils or Robertson

Buch

A sweetener of Gauthier or Lemieux

Thats a hell of a package, and one I may only consider for a Draisaitl, Barkov or an Eichel and Leon is and will be cheaper over the next 5 years.

Other than those three players, I see no one else worth parting with a significant package for.

Rather load up on the wings than waste resources in assets and or money on lesser players.

All due respect, I don’t think that package gets you anywhere near any of those players, especially Drai. That’s not a package for a franchise center.

You don’t land a young top 5 franchise center whose locked up long term for a good winger who needs a contract, a lottery protected likely mid 1st rounder, a B prospect, and a very replaceable 4th line winger. I mean, you mentioned Gauthier as a sweetener for Drai or Eichel. Does Gauthier move the needle at all in that type of deal?

If we traded Zib for that we’d lose our minds. Eichel, Drai, and Barkov are easily more valuable at this point when you figure in talent, age, injuries, and contract. You don’t make a trade for one of those guys without it hurting badly.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

I think the perception was that Nash had deteriorated and was a rental and the Rangers did well, but McDonough was the big prize. Him being dealt was supposed to bring back a lot more than Nash. Obviously, it hasn’t quite worked out that way. Hajek was supposed to be a top 4, Howden was supposed to be a middle 6, one or hopefully two first rounders all judged by how good and important McDonough had been. Of course, comparing Hajek to Lindgren based on who they were dealt for was silly, but I think that’s where the view stemmed from.

Its hard to judge the trade before all the pieces develop. Hajek has taken a giant leap ahead imo this year. Howden was not considered middle six, he was a potential 3rd line guy, thats still to be determined, and Lundkvist hasnt even played yet, what happens if he looks like Fox or better? Its way too early to be judging this.

 

[Barnaby]

yea I mean where are they gonna get a 2nd line C ? I look at rosters and it’s not easy to find one that may appear available

ideally Chytil would take the spot but he’s hurt

other option is good prospects for a good C prospect

Half the teams in the NHL need a top 6 center. It sounds good in theory, but they are tough to find. I expect the NYR to strike at some point in the next two years.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Half the teams in the NHL need a top 6 center. It sounds good in theory, but they are tough to find. I expect the NYR to strike at some point in the next two years.

In this regard it has to be our scouts looking at young players and predicting well, i don't think we can move a bunch of assets and add another 10 mill player, it should be a young cost controlled center and he should be acquired while we have zib, strome and chytil to insulate them.

 

[Barnaby]

Anyone else feel like Bennett has quickly become the most wildly overrated player on HF? The guys being scratched and has 1 point this year. Sure, I’d take him for a price, but he’s more likely to become a 4th line wing than a 3C. I can’t believe people are talking about a deal around Bennett and Buchnevich. Not a bad player, but he doesn’t deserve to be yearned for by every team in the sport.

 

[MarkMessyay11]

Anyone else feel like Bennett has quickly become the most wildly overrated player on HF? The guys being scratched and has 1 point this year. Sure, I’d take him for a price, but he’s more likely to become a 4th line wing than a 3C. I can’t believe people are talking about a deal around Bennett and Buchnevich. Not a bad player, but he doesn’t deserve to be yearned for by every team in the sport.

I think his appeal around here is the sandpaper and grit style game he plays. We don't have enough of that at the forward position.

Anyone expecting him to slot in at 2C and miraculously become a 50-60 point player is setting themselves up for huge disappointment. Honestly, anyone expecting him to come in and miraculously be a center on any line is setting themselves up for disappointment. He's primarily played wing since 2017-18.

 

[Lion Hound]

It’s funny, there was a perception that Lindgren was a borderline prospect and Hajek was a better one.

I never saw it that way based on their draft positions and progress to that point, and I can’t say I ever heard anyone in the organization express that view either.

It feels like it’s one of those narratives that started somewhere and no one really knows how it started or why.

Those Lindgren vs Hajek threads were great back in the day. I forgot who was posting about the Wolfpack but he was crushing Lindgren. I think he even mentioned he would never be an effective NHL player or something.

I was always camp Lindgren. Factors were all the World Jr footage, and i was bitter about the McDonagh trade and super happy with the Nash deal. With that said, I want to see both make it.

 

[Lion Hound]

NHL Rumor Mill – February 12, 2021 | Spectors Hockey

Howden

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Anyone else feel like Bennett has quickly become the most wildly overrated player on HF? The guys being scratched and has 1 point this year. Sure, I’d take him for a price, but he’s more likely to become a 4th line wing than a 3C. I can’t believe people are talking about a deal around Bennett and Buchnevich. Not a bad player, but he doesn’t deserve to be yearned for by every team in the sport.

The fact he's still a flame after all this shows his value isnt as high as it is here.

 

[Barnaby]

Its hard to judge the trade before all the pieces develop. Hajek has taken a giant leap ahead imo this year. Howden was not considered middle six, he was a potential 3rd line guy, thats still to be determined, and Lundkvist hasnt even played yet, what happens if he looks like Fox or better? Its way too early to be judging this.

That wasn’t my point. I’m not looking to rehash the the McDonough trade. The 3rd line is middle six.

My point was in regards to why Lindgren and Hajek were viewed as prospects on different tiers. I get the impression that Hajek was seen as one of the big pieces coming back for our star player and captain who was viewed as the biggest asset we had to move. Because of that, I think, Hajek had higher expectations.

In the Nash trade, we selling a rental whose game had declined. I think most of us were just happy to land the 1st rounder and the “tacked on” prospect was just icing on the cake.

 

[Vitto79]

Howden

Howden for Bennett? Still salary difference so maybe throw in Smith at half price too

 

[Barnaby]

In this regard it has to be our scouts looking at young players and predicting well, i don't think we can move a bunch of assets and add another 10 mill player, it should be a young cost controlled center and he should be acquired while we have zib, strome and chytil to insulate them.

Im not against acquiring a young cost controlled center that we project as a top 6 center. However, I can’t think of many recent examples of those guys being dealt in recent years for even high end players like a McDonough or Karlsson. I don’t see a scenario where we trade 2 or 3 lesser pieces for that player. I don’t think a Lundkvist nets you the higher end center you probably want.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

I like Bennett, would be ok/happy adding him for DeAngelo who is basically worth nothing to the NYR at this point.

But on a stand alone basis he is at 3rd round pick / Howden /Gauthier level value.

 

[Edge]

Those Lindgren vs Hajek threads were great back in the day. I forgot who was posting about the Wolfpack but he was crushing Lindgren. I think he even mentioned he would never be an effective NHL player or something.

I was always camp Lindgren. Factors were all the World Jr footage, and i was bitter about the McDonagh trade and super happy with the Nash deal. With that said, I want to see both make it.

Their journeys really weren't all that different.

Both defense-first types, without a ton of frills or love on the stats sheets, and both 2016 second round picks. Born days apart, Hajek went 37th, and Lindgren went 49th.

Both turned pro pretty quickly and played their first AHL seasons together.

But there was always this perception by fans that Hajek was the higher upside guy, and really there wasn't anything that painted vastly different picture between players other than it seemed more eyes were focused on the Tampa deal.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

I was pretty sure Hajek would become a rock solid middle pairing guy and it’s a bummer it hasn’t worked out to this point

I think there’s a chance he still can get there but I think it’ll be with another team

 

[Shesterkybomb]

That wasn’t my point. I’m not looking to rehash the the McDonough trade. The 3rd line is middle six.

My point was in regards to why Lindgren and Hajek were viewed as prospects on different tiers. I get the impression that Hajek was seen as one of the big pieces coming back for our star player and captain who was viewed as the biggest asset we had to move. Because of that, I think, Hajek had higher expectations.

In the Nash trade, we selling a rental whose game had declined. I think most of us were just happy to land the 1st rounder and the “tacked on” prospect was just icing on the cake.

Middle 6 means potential to be a 2c, i don't think anyone thought he was gonna be that. With regards to Lindgren he deserves a ton of credit for working on his skating, the difference is night and day, he's been a great compliment to Fox.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Their journeys really weren't all that different.

Both defense-first types, without a ton of frills or love on the stats sheets, and both 2016 second round picks. Born days apart, Hajek went 37th, and Lindgren went 49th.

Both turned pro pretty quickly and played their first AHL seasons together.

But there was always this perception by fans that Hajek was the higher upside guy, and really there wasn't anything that painted vastly different picture between players other than it seemed more eyes were focused on the Tampa deal.

I believe it was a skating comparison, Lindgren really worked hard to get his skating to an NHL level, good on him.

 

[Profet]

Their journeys really weren't all that different.

Both defense-first types, without a ton of frills or love on the stats sheets, and both 2016 second round picks. Born days apart, Hajek went 37th, and Lindgren went 49th.

Both turned pro pretty quickly and played their first AHL seasons together.

But there was always this perception by fans that Hajek was the higher upside guy, and really there wasn't anything that painted vastly different picture between players other than it seemed more eyes were focused on the Tampa deal.

That's the key. Perceived value.

Nash was an aging forward who we sent to Boston to playout the year. The key to everyone here was the first round pick. Lindgren was perceived as a throw in. The expectations there were very very low.

Hajek went in a deal involving the team's undisputed number one defenseman, and Captain, who had plenty of good years left. Along with a young former first round pick. The first round pick in there was a huge part of that trade, but trading two NHL assets like McDonagh and Miller meant that something more needed to be in that deal. The hopes were hung on Howden and Hajek to make up the difference.

 

[kovazub94]

He's a scapegoat because he's a bad player and if we want to win anything, he can't be the 2C here

Did I miss him signing long-term deal? Is there a better option he's blocking from getting a spot right now?

 

[DutchShamrock]

It’s not even logical. Maybe he’s just listing every big market team?? Assets alone that it would cost to get him could be used on a younger viable core center. Just another popcorn fart headline.

Dreger named the team of his off-season training partner and the click baity rumor generator that lazy journalists use.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Dreger named the team of his off-season training partner and the click baity rumor generator that lazy journalists use.

Dreger used to be fairly reliable but he seems to have gotten away from that.

 

[Barnaby]

Middle 6 means potential to be a 2c, i don't think anyone thought he was gonna be that. With regards to Lindgren he deserves a ton of credit for working on his skating, the difference is night and day, he's been a great compliment to Fox.

I guess it’s semantics. To me, middle six is 2nd or 3rd line. The question was whether his offense would develop.

To me, top 4 defenseman is probably a 2nd pair guy. I wouldn’t look at a Chris Pronger and say he’s been a top 4 defenseman although technically that’s accurate. I’d say he was a top pair guy.

Either way, the trade will ultimately almost definitely work out better for TB which is what it is unless Lundkvist becomes a star. Again, not looking to rehash it. I think we all know the ups and downs of that deal and it’s been beaten to death.