McKenzie: Puljujarvi has requested a trade [Part 2]

[MessierII]

Source? That doesn’t sound like something McDavid would do.

That was pretty widely thrown out on Gregors show as well as Stauffers. I think it was pretty well common knowledge for those close to the team.

 

[CraigsList]

Slightly off topic, but all this time I've thought Puljujarvi was born in Finland. Great to find out his birthplace 3 years later

 

[SupremeTeam16]

I find it highly unlikely that he'll pan out in Edmonton. They can't develop him properly and he doesn't want to play there.

It's not about doing him any favors, it's about getting rid of a problem and hopefully making the team better. A 3rd rounder would do a lot more usage than a player who's already left the organization in his mind.

And whats the harm of retaining his rights and letting him go to Europe? He's away from the team and there is a good chance that either the Oilers can get him back over in a year or two or he plays well and increases his value, conversely his value can't drop much more, statistically the difference between a 3rd and a 4/5th is negligible.

Personally I think there's a good chance Jesse signs his qualifying offer and re joins the Oilers. Him and his agent played themselves, overestimated his value around the league and thought a trade would be easier to facilitate and the team would oblige. But Holland called their bluff now it's mid July and he's got no NHL deal and no deal in Europe yet. They may well decide that signing the qualifying offer is their best path forward, eat up another year of team control and get closer to arb rights. There's plenty of opportunity on the wings in Edmonton and Holland won't risk losing him on waivers so he will be on the NHL roster. If he signs a one year deal and has a decent season it could probably elevate his value enough where a trade would be palatable for the Oilers.

 

[TheNumber4]

What would be the point in keeping a player that is clearly not developing into anything worthwhile in the organization? Just for the sake of it?

To set the precedent that you don't get to ditch out on the Oilers cause you feel like it. If we let Jesse do it, it's open season for any player or draftee not really feelin Edmonton. A 3rd OVERALL PICK was used to acquire this guy, i'd rather keep him and bury him than take some measly 3rd round pick or less.

 

[Claypool]

To set the precedent that you don't get to ditch out on the Oilers cause you feel like it. If we let Jesse do it, it's open season for any player or draftee not really feelin Edmonton. A 3rd OVERALL PICK was used to acquire this guy, i'd rather keep him and bury him than take some measly 3rd round pick or less.

Having a bunch of miserable prospects isn't going to help, either.

 

[TheNumber4]

Having a bunch of miserable prospects isn't going to help, either.

Doesn't hurt that much. But letting an entitled high draft pick push management around so that they can cater to him instead of having players cater the organization can hurt a whole bunch.

 

[jaloviina]

I think pulju will be great player. sometimes we lose perspective with all the young kids being already stars coming to the league heck selänne was 22 in his rookie season. and maybe for pulju best option is europe to let him develope. who knows. everyone sees the potential and that yet he hasnt filled that. all the best for the kid and oilers.

 

[torniojaws]

Slightly off topic, but all this time I've thought Puljujarvi was born in Finland. Great to find out his birthplace 3 years later

Well, it's kind of just a technicality. When he popped out, it was in Sweden. It's quite common for Finns to work in Sweden, especially back then in the 90s, when Sweden was more prosperous and had far more jobs available. Even before the European Union free movement of workforce thing, you could freely work in other Nordic countries if you were also a citizen of a Nordic country.

But he never really lived there, as they moved to Finland when he was 4 years old, and his parents are both Finnish. He does have dual citizenship though, so technically he could play for the Swedish national team But according to him, he has no family in Sweden and he doesn't speak Swedish, and he has no interest to play for the Swedish national team.

 

[howkie]

To set the precedent that you don't get to ditch out on the Oilers cause you feel like it. If we let Jesse do it, it's open season for any player or draftee not really feelin Edmonton. A 3rd OVERALL PICK was used to acquire this guy, i'd rather keep him and bury him than take some measly 3rd round pick or less.

Then you cant be mad if future prospects refuse to sign with the Oilers

 

[torniojaws]

Then you cant be mad if future prospects refuse to sign with the Oilers

Isn't there a huge monetary penalty for that? I think the last it happened was with Eric Lindros.

Edit:
Seems it only affects the player in lost ELC money until he hits UFA, which seems to be 4 years after being drafted, if not signed.

The latest appears to be Mike Reilly, who refused to sign with Columbus:
Mike Reilly informs Blue Jackets he won't sign, hits free agency

So I guess the main reason why it doesn't happen all the time is because it's a huge risk for the player himself. If he gets injured, or slumps, he might miss out on the NHL permanently.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

Isn't there a huge monetary penalty for that? I think the last it happened was with Eric Lindros.

Edit:
Seems it only affects the player in lost ELC money until he hits UFA, which seems to be 4 years after being drafted, if not signed.

The latest appears to be Mike Reilly, who refused to sign with Columbus:
Mike Reilly informs Blue Jackets he won't sign, hits free agency

So I guess the main reason why it doesn't happen all the time is because it's a huge risk for the player himself. If he gets injured, or slumps, he might miss out on the NHL permanently.

You are mistaken, that loophole only exist for NCAA players and they must play out 4 seasons of college hockey in order to be able to become UFA.

Once drafted by a team they own you for 7 years.

 

[torniojaws]

Once drafted by a team they own you for 7 years.

What if the non-NCAA player were to join an NCAA team after refusing to sign?

 

[Pizza!Pizza!]

What if the non-NCAA player were to join an NCAA team after refusing to sign?

I have it on good authority that if you type "Google" into Google you'll break the internet.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

What if the non-NCAA player were to join an NCAA team after refusing to sign?

Well then they'd only forego 4 years of NHL earnings in favour of a likely stunted development. Cause even if you go the NCAA UFA route you still have to sign a 3 year ELC with potential earnings maximum of 3.775M.

So instead of signing your ELC at 18-19 and getting to your second deal at 21-22 now you are signing your ELC at 22-23 and getting to your second deal at 25-26. And while college hockey has gotten better over the years it's still not an ideal development strategy to play in the same league with lesser competition for 4 years when you could be pro and playing in the AHL at the same age, where to competition is stronger and closer to NHL level and you are also earning a pay check.

 

[Lempo]

But Holland called their bluff now it's mid July and he's got no NHL deal and no deal in Europe yet. They may well decide that signing the qualifying offer is their best path forward, eat up another year of team control and get closer to arb rights. There's plenty of opportunity on the wings in Edmonton and Holland won't risk losing him on waivers so he will be on the NHL roster. If he signs a one year deal and has a decent season it could probably elevate his value enough where a trade would be palatable for the Oilers.

If he signs the QO, he will be eligible for Arbitration in the next off-season. He will at that time have the 4 professional seasons required of a player signing his ELC at the age of 18-20 (age at Sept 15 in that calendar year).

He probably signs today.

 

[Lempo]

Does anyone btw know Jesse's UFA status situation?

He (like everyone) needs 7 Accrued Seasons to reach UFA before 27.

"Accrued Season" means any League Year during which a Player was on a Club's Active Roster for 40 (30 if the Player is a goalie) or more Regular Season Games, provided that, for the purposes of calculating an Accrued Season under this Agreement, games missed due to a hockey-related injury incurred while on a Club's Active Roster shall count as games played for purposes of calculating an Accrued Season but only during the League Year in which the injury was incurred and a maximum of one additional season.

"Active Roster" shall be determined as follows: Commencing on the day prior to the start of the Regular Season, and concluding with each respective Club's last NHL Game in a League Year, Active Roster shall include all Players on a Club's Reserve List who are signed to an approved and registered SPC, subject to the provisions of Article 11, and who are not on the Injured Reserve List, Injured Non-Roster, designated Non-Roster, or Loaned. A Player who is on a Conditioning Loan is included on a Club's Active Roster. During Training Camp, a Player shall be deemed to be on the Club's Active Roster only if he had been on the Club's Active Roster after the Trade Deadline in the preceding season on other than an emergency recall basis.

He had 28 played NHL games in 2016-17, which I assume means he dressed up for those games. Did he on top of that spend 12+ games in the pressbox eating popcorn, which apparently would mean he counts to have been in the Active Roster for those games, and would now be at 3 Accrued Seasons and would reach UFA status after 4 more?

 

[agent082]

Did he on top of that spend 12+ games in the pressbox eating popcorn, which apparently would mean he counts to have been in the Active Roster for those games, and would now be at 3 Accrued Seasons and would reach UFA status after 4 more?

Yes.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

Id take a flier on him in Buffalo now that we traded Nylander. Sheary with retention straight up or with some random late round pick added?

 

[Go Wings]

To set the precedent that you don't get to ditch out on the Oilers cause you feel like it. If we let Jesse do it, it's open season for any player or draftee not really feelin Edmonton. A 3rd OVERALL PICK was used to acquire this guy, i'd rather keep him and bury him than take some measly 3rd round pick or less.

4th overall pick not 3rd.

 

[Seachd]

It's not about doing him any favors, it's about getting rid of a problem and hopefully making the team better. A 3rd rounder would do a lot more usage than a player who's already left the organization in his mind.

What exactly is the problem? So far, they’re down a player who wasn’t contributing. That’s not hurting the team.

 

[Seachd]

The only path to success is to do something radically different than until now, and I can't see any interest in Edmonton for that.

You don’t see Edmonton having any interest in Puljujarvi coming back and playing a lot better than he has?

 

[torniojaws]

I bet Edmonton wants to see what he can do after the hip surgery. Without it, I bet Holland would have already got rid of him. But if the surgery can fix his movement issues (if they indeed were due to the hip), then they might find use or more trade value in him.

 

[AslanRH]

You are mistaken, that loophole only exist for NCAA players and they must play out 4 seasons of college hockey in order to be able to become UFA.

Once drafted by a team they own you for 7 years.

Actually for most players it is 4 years.
Many NA junior players can choose to re-enter the draft after 2 years if they don't sign and then would owe 2 to a team if they were drafted again.

Well then they'd only forego 4 years of NHL earnings in favour of a likely stunted development. Cause even if you go the NCAA UFA route you still have to sign a 3 year ELC with potential earnings maximum of 3.775M.

It depends on signing age could be a 1 year (Schuldt) or 2 year (Vesey, Kerfoot) ELC

 

[russ99]

You don’t see Edmonton having any interest in Puljujarvi coming back and playing a lot better than he has?

Minimal, unless there's a good savings in cap, not the $1.5-1.75M he and his agent would want.

He's a very flawed player at the NHL level, would he sulk and go public again with 4th line duty and occasionaly pressboxing again? Since that's how they'd likely use him until he shows he can put up NHL quality shifts and play within the 5 man structure, which will be even more important under Tippett.

The only way he gets better at the NHL level is if a coach takes him aside, works with him and he puts in a ton of time in away from games, and the amount of entitlement we're seeing from him and his agent seem to preclude this. Can't blame him entirely on this, seems Chiarelli enabled this behavior.

The best thing IMO is for him to go to Europe, play against men and develop his game, put up some scoring and get more interest in a trade next offseason, and the Oilers use the cap space for someone NHL capable.

 

[russ99]

I bet Edmonton wants to see what he can do after the hip surgery. Without it, I bet Holland would have already got rid of him. But if the surgery can fix his movement issues (if they indeed were due to the hip), then they might find use or more trade value in him.

The movement issues are way below his hockey sense and language gap issues.