Speculation: Power Speculation: Hextall/Burke's first move in PIT?

ponder719

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Jul 2, 2013
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I hope the first move Hextall makes is looking to get out of Matheson's contract for a shorter term cap dump. This isn't even really a criticism of Matheson's play, because he's been hurt for all but like 2.5 games for the Penguins this year, but that contract flat out sucks. Especially now that POJ is showing he's clearly NHL ready. I genuinely have no clue what JR was thinking with acquiring that contract when they already had Dumoulin, Pettersson, Riikola and POJ on LD.

I'd move Matheson's contract for basically any shorter term cap dump if the opportunity arose. The Leafs were able to do that with trading basically Brown and Zaitsev for Ceci, so I wonder if the Penguins could do that with McCann and Matheson for someone like that.

Wild guess as to what he'll do, but looking at Hartnell for Umberger as the base, my first instinct was Matheson for Loui Eriksson. Take on the extra $1.125 (or whatever it is, I don't feel like doing math) for the next two years to clear the remaining 4 years of that deal. (No idea if Vancouver considers that, but that's what came to mind first.)
 

Empoleon8771

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Wild guess as to what he'll do, but looking at Hartnell for Umberger as the base, my first instinct was Matheson for Loui Eriksson. Take on the extra $1.125 (or whatever it is, I don't feel like doing math) for the next two years to clear the remaining 4 years of that deal. (No idea if Vancouver considers that, but that's what came to mind first.)

I was thinking someone like DeKeyser or Lucic, but yeah Eriksson is definitely a possibility as well.
 

KingsFan7824

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Wild guess as to what he'll do, but looking at Hartnell for Umberger as the base, my first instinct was Matheson for Loui Eriksson. Take on the extra $1.125 (or whatever it is, I don't feel like doing math) for the next two years to clear the remaining 4 years of that deal. (No idea if Vancouver considers that, but that's what came to mind first.)

The problem there is Hartnell helped a team for at least a couple years.

Plus it's not $1.125m extra, it's $23m more that Vancouver would be taking on. Eriksson has just next year left, the Canucks are currently a dumpster fire, and they're going to extend the misery by getting Matheson's contract? That's a deal where the Pens need to start adding.
 
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Muikea Bulju

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Crosby's production is going downhill, so maybe their first move is to get their assets out before complete depreciation

So pump his tires, play him in the offensive zone with Malkin, Guentzel & Letang, let him play 2 minutes every powerplay, never start him in your own zone, and trade him as soon as he gets a few points

The classic pump & dump
 

Fig

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Is it just me or generally aren’t these the 2 opposite ends of the spectrum?

Hextall wants to wait and build and Burke always pushes his chips in?

odd pairing unless I am wrong on hextall

Burke is a fan of retooling vs rebuilding.
Hextall I think likes to go slow and steady and let the youngsters develop.

I think this duo actually complements one another in Pittsburgh if they retool around the most of the core they currently have. Hextall can go slow and steady with prospects and they will develop well around the core. This will qualify as a retool for Burke.

I have a feeling Bennett won't be moved though. All the Flames players are playing well. If anyone is to be criticized, it's Tkachuk and Gio right now. If the Flames and Pens trade, I think it won't be until just before the expansion draft.
 
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Jerkbait

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Dec 12, 2019
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Crosby's production is going downhill, so maybe their first move is to get their assets out before complete depreciation

So pump his tires, play him in the offensive zone with Malkin, Guentzel & Letang, let him play 2 minutes every powerplay, never start him in your own zone, and trade him as soon as he gets a few points

The classic pump & dump
LOL, the greatest player of this generation will retire a penguin. Malkin will have a chcoie and Letang gets traded.
 

Muikea Bulju

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Oct 11, 2018
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LOL, the greatest player of this generation will retire a penguin. Malkin will have a chcoie and Letang gets traded.

Well, then the team goes quietly in to the sunset with him

I don't think he's gonna want to be on a non-playoff / tanking team. So he's probably going to demand that they keep trading away the future for rentals, until he retires

So they are not going to be winning a single thing for a long time. After he retires, they do a full rebuild-tank-firesale-dumpster fire, and 5 years after that they'll make the playoffs again
 

Beauner

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Well, then the team goes quietly in to the sunset with him

I don't think he's gonna want to be on a non-playoff / tanking team. So he's probably going to demand that they keep trading away the future for rentals, until he retires

So they are not going to be winning a single thing for a long time. After he retires, they do a full rebuild-tank-firesale-dumpster fire, and 5 years after that they'll make the playoffs again
Mario played on some crap teams in his final years, and Sid's idol is Yzerman who was also a one-team legend.

Sid's already won everything there is to win. He doesn't need to cup chase. You could be right, but there is absolutely no evidence to suggest you are.
 
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Mick Jagr

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I think one of the first deals will occur with moving out McCann. preferably for Bennett out of Calgary if possible. McCann does not fit anywhere in our line up and has been useless this year.

In a perfect world though the first move would include moving out Jason "Why was I even acquired?" Zucker. He isn't a sniper, he's not a proficient two-way forward, not a playmaker and he's not overly physical... so wtf is he?
 

Bishop7979

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I think rust and mccann are two guys who shouldn't feel safe right now.

Rust is coming off a great season, he's in that middle age group where he has value but isn't a guy who would be considered a long term part of the future. You can get a legit asset for him this season if they go that route.

Mccann is just a meh player. I like him and keep wanting him to put it all together but don't know if he ever will. Maybe he finds it somewhere else and there is a swap to be made for another under performing young guy from another team. Regardless right now a guy like O'Conner can do what the current version of mccann is doing for less money.
 
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Bishop7979

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M.M isn't going anywhere unless he can get some games in and establish that his game can be fixed and he can play like the guy he was pre-suspension. If his game can get rebuilt like the pens have done with other cast off defenders hes a piece that can be moved given his age and the skill that is in there somewhere.

I am fine if they move geno and or letang. With geno I feel like he will turn into a beast for whatever team were to pick him up. I just think he's gotten complacent in pittsburgh. If a team had a younger second line center they were willing to part with as the center piece of the deal id take it. Right now the pens aren't getting the production out of malkin that they are playing for, but I believe whatever team would get him would.

I've honestly been done with Letang for years, I feel like with Marino, poj, Peterson, and dumo as a top 4 the team has a decent enough core that you can add a "pp specialist" on the 3rd pairing to play limited even strength minutes and not miss a beat. I don't know what you can get for him but id move him if the team wasn't getting bent over with the return.
 

Muikea Bulju

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Mario played on some crap teams in his final years, and Sid's idol is Yzerman who was also a one-team legend.

Sid's already won everything there is to win. He doesn't need to cup chase. You could be right, but there is absolutely no evidence to suggest you are.

They have already traded away picks 1,3,4,6 for the 2021 draft - and eveb before this season!

They basically traded away a 1st for Kapanen.

They traded a 3rd for Marleau in 2020

They traded away a 1st for Zucker

A 6th for Marino

They had 5 picks in 2019
4 in 2018
5 in 2020

Their prospect pool was ranked last:
https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-farm-system-rankings/
Second to last:
The EliteProspects Rinkside 2020-21 Off-Season Prospect Pool Rankings: the No. 30-ranked Pittsburgh Penguins - EP Rinkside
3rd to last:
Wheeler’s 2021 NHL prospect pool rankings: No. 29 Pittsburgh Penguins

They have clealy sold their future for the present
 

Beauner

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They have already traded away picks 1,3,4,6 for the 2021 draft - and eveb before this season!

They basically traded away a 1st for Kapanen.

They traded a 3rd for Marleau in 2020

They traded away a 1st for Zucker

A 6th for Marino

They had 5 picks in 2019
4 in 2018
5 in 2020

Their prospect pool was ranked last:
https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-farm-system-rankings/
Second to last:
The EliteProspects Rinkside 2020-21 Off-Season Prospect Pool Rankings: the No. 30-ranked Pittsburgh Penguins - EP Rinkside
3rd to last:
Wheeler’s 2021 NHL prospect pool rankings: No. 29 Pittsburgh Penguins

They have clealy sold their future for the present
edit: yeah I totally misunderstood what you meant by Sid wouldn't wanna be on a rebuilder. I don't disagree with any of that, carry on.
 

Fig

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Let's say that the Flames/Pens actually want to consummate a deal and Bennett does quietly want a trade... Something around Bennett/Kapanen might work. Flames need better RW options than Simon, Leivo etc. on that top line. Many Flames fans really, really liked what they saw last night with Bennett on that line with them. The theory would be that Kapanen could continue a bit of that with Gaudreau and Monahan.

The unfortunate yet fortunate situation for the Pens is that they looted the farm to get those cups. They can sell many assets to try and top up the farm, but IMO what Benning did a few seasons ago is also a good option. Acquire young reclamation projects/change of scenery candidates and aim for a home run swing. Jankowski is already with them. There's lists and lists of excellent option guys like Virtanen, Bennett, Mittelstadt, Thomson etc. that still have decently high ceilings that could be nabbed as part of bigger deals when certain roster players are moved.

The Pens are fricken well positioned IMO for a quick and favorable retool with Hextall and Burke at the helm. IIRC, I don't think contracts, FA and prospects/futures were weaknesses of Hextall in Philly. It was ownership patience and hitching his cart to Hakstol... who honestly speaking did well on paper, but I wonder if there were other issues behind the scenes that ownership wanted addressing coaching wise that Hextrall didn't address.
 

Empoleon8771

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Let's say that the Flames/Pens actually want to consummate a deal and Bennett does quietly want a trade... Something around Bennett/Kapanen might work. Flames need better RW options than Simon, Leivo etc. on that top line. Many Flames fans really, really liked what they saw last night with Bennett on that line with them. The theory would be that Kapanen could continue a bit of that with Gaudreau and Monahan.

The unfortunate yet fortunate situation for the Pens is that they looted the farm to get those cups. They can sell many assets to try and top up the farm, but IMO what Benning did a few seasons ago is also a good option. Acquire young reclamation projects/change of scenery candidates and aim for a home run swing. Jankowski is already with them. There's lists and lists of excellent option guys like Virtanen, Bennett, Mittelstadt, Thomson etc. that still have decently high ceilings that could be nabbed as part of bigger deals when certain roster players are moved.

The Pens are fricken well positioned IMO for a quick and favorable retool with Hextall and Burke at the helm. IIRC, I don't think contracts, FA and prospects/futures were weaknesses of Hextall in Philly. It was ownership patience and hitching his cart to Hakstol... who honestly speaking did well on paper, but I wonder if there were other issues behind the scenes that ownership wanted addressing coaching wise that Hextrall didn't address.

Lol no it wouldn't.

Why do you honestly think the Penguins would do that? Bennett's a sub-30 point grinder who's great in the playoffs, while Kapanen has looked like a legitimate top-6 winger with the Penguins so far. Adding a spare part like Simon (who the Penguins let walk despite being able to sign him for league minimum) or Leivo doesn't move the needle at all.

I'd do McCann for Bennett, which is still a loss in value for the Penguins but it's at least a swap I can see making a positive difference. Kapanen for Bennett isn't even close.
 

Gurglesons

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Dec 18, 2009
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Let's say that the Flames/Pens actually want to consummate a deal and Bennett does quietly want a trade... Something around Bennett/Kapanen might work. Flames need better RW options than Simon, Leivo etc. on that top line. Many Flames fans really, really liked what they saw last night with Bennett on that line with them. The theory would be that Kapanen could continue a bit of that with Gaudreau and Monahan.

The unfortunate yet fortunate situation for the Pens is that they looted the farm to get those cups. They can sell many assets to try and top up the farm, but IMO what Benning did a few seasons ago is also a good option. Acquire young reclamation projects/change of scenery candidates and aim for a home run swing. Jankowski is already with them. There's lists and lists of excellent option guys like Virtanen, Bennett, Mittelstadt, Thomson etc. that still have decently high ceilings that could be nabbed as part of bigger deals when certain roster players are moved.

The Pens are fricken well positioned IMO for a quick and favorable retool with Hextall and Burke at the helm. IIRC, I don't think contracts, FA and prospects/futures were weaknesses of Hextall in Philly. It was ownership patience and hitching his cart to Hakstol... who honestly speaking did well on paper, but I wonder if there were other issues behind the scenes that ownership wanted addressing coaching wise that Hextrall didn't address.

Kapanen is not getting traded for Bennett. He’s put up 6 pts in 8 games and is signed to a low cap deal.
 

KingsFan7824

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I think one of the first deals will occur with moving out McCann. preferably for Bennett out of Calgary if possible. McCann does not fit anywhere in our line up and has been useless this year.

In a perfect world though the first move would include moving out Jason "Why was I even acquired?" Zucker. He isn't a sniper, he's not a proficient two-way forward, not a playmaker and he's not overly physical... so wtf is he?

He's a dog. Definitely a dog.

However, he also wears a hat and drives a car.
 

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