Observations XXVII

[101st_fan]

A few observations from the actual professional observer here:
A week to completely change structures and approaches is a very short term to expect results. The team is displaying change in the defensive zone and initial breakouts. The change in offensive approach is much less consistently seen. Player discipline is the one area where I'm waiting to see change ... penalties, coverages, all aspects.

We've played three games since Hynes actually had time to meet with individual players and conduct his first practice. Our goalies haven't allowed more than three goals in a game since that practice ... haven't allowed more than two ES goals in a game. The glaring downside is 0 for 6 (10:41) on the PP.

We're 2-1-0 since Hynes was able to hold a practice. If the team can take care of business against Anaheim and Buffalo things like the post season remain within grasp.

A new "observations" thread complete with a poll here trying to justify its existence ... well .... not really feeling that one.

 

[FossilFndr]

wasn't the point, just trying to see if anyone was interested in a different approach, I should have just started a different thread instead of

 

[Armourboy]

Been here since the old Preds board shut down, this thing isn't ant different than it was when I first got here, unless there is some stuff on ignore I'm not seeing.

Usually every other year we get these " good old days " posts, and frankly the only real difference I've seen is 303 has backed away.

 

[Predsanddead24]

Been here since the old Preds board shut down, this thing isn't ant different than it was when I first got here, unless there is some stuff on ignore I'm not seeing.

Usually every other year we get these " good old days " posts, and frankly the only real difference I've seen is 303 has backed away.

Once again I wasn't around so maybe there is some perspective I'm lacking, but reading the old observations threads they if anything seem to have more off topic musings than the current Observation threads have. Here's Observation III for example. If you change the names of players and the stats I really don't see how it's any different. I do find it a very fun exercise to go back and see people's expectation and thoughts on players and prospects knowing how some of those scenarios ended up.

 

[GoldOnGold]

Once again I wasn't around so maybe there is some perspective I'm lacking, but reading the old observations threads they if anything seem to have more off topic musings than the current Observation threads have. Here's Observation III for example. If you change the names of players and the stats I really don't see how it's any different. I do find it a very fun exercise to go back and see people's expectation and thoughts on players and prospects knowing how some of those scenarios ended up.

I have found it interesting to just go back to the oldest page of threads on the board and see what people were saying in 2012. Colin Wilson is going to be a beast, Jonathan Blum, Michael Latta, etc.

 

[Adz]

I would like an Observations thread that is this one (about the play, about the players, interactions in game, coaching, etc.) and also another sticky'd thread designed for general observations (or complaints or praise or whatever.) That thread would be about the team experience but centering on the peripheral parts -- arena discussion (what is good, what isn't), anthem rendition, bands, ticketing, etc. They're observations, but they aren't observations about a specific play or an interpretation of a rule or something of that nature. I think if you have a designated place to comment on the game ops or other Preds related musings then you keep it off the serious hockey talk thread.

 

[PredsV82]

Hey Poile, remember how you said the blame of Lavy getting fired was on the players??

Guess what, it's still the players.

Blow this f***er up and tank for some high draft picks.

 

[TitansVolsPreds615]

Utterly embarrassing. I think I've gone to my last game for a while. The fans continue to get no return on their time and money. These guys with the exception of a few have zero heart.

 

[originalpredfan]

We seriously need to be in the market for a goalie. Saros is not the answer. Every team in the NHL drools over the juicy rebounds he produces. I also have to laugh at my personal concern over who we would protect in the expansion draft. Right now I can only think of 4 or 5 I would protect period. I personally wonder if we have three forwards who are truly first liners.

 

[drwpreds]

We seriously need to be in the market for a goalie. Saros is not the answer. Every team in the NHL drools over the juicy rebounds he produces. I also have to laugh at my personal concern over who we would protect in the expansion draft. Right now I can only think of 4 or 5 I would protect period. I personally wonder if we have three forwards who are truly first liners.

I know its probably not going to happen, but I want to see what Ingram can do....

 

[Pred303]

hockey is in reality a very simple game, possibly the simplest team game there is in many ways from a "system" standpoint. basically, players are playing the exact same systems they were taught in peewee hockey in all 4 aspects of the game. offense. defense. PP. PK. It's not rocket science. when things go wrong we like to blame coaches because it's the easy answer in our minds. coaches primary role at this level is honestly simply to motivate and get the right players on ice in the right circumstances. the rest is up to the players you have and their desire and confidence. lavy didn't just forget overnight how to win hockey games after back to back division chas and 637 NHL wins.

coaches coach. but players play. our players suck. we have about 5 players playing consistently well. rinne and hamhuis are simply too old. fabbro, trenin, Blackwell are probably too young. a few are at best "role" players, that need big name players to be big name players that they can compliment .when bonino is your best forward night after night, well you are in major trouble. a few of our defensemen aren't capable of being a top ten team d-man. most of the rest are simply passengers. it's defeating when you don't get really good goaltending for the entire team, but that doesn't really explain it. Forsberg, johansen, Duchene, granlund, turris, ekholm, arvy. a huge list of guys playing far below the expectations or capabilities.

we have no home ice advantage because we are almost always behind. night after night. add in that 75% of the people in the building now are have now come on board in the last 2-3 years. It's hard to be for a team that doesn't give you everything they have every night out. This is probably the worst "best' lineup I have ever seen for us. well no doubt it is. I don't even blame poile, on paper heading into this year this was a top 3 type team. I'm thru going to see this group. Give me legwand, Johnson, walker, erat and orzagh over this group of mental weaklings.

 

[hido]

Godawful. When the loudest cheers are for Titans videos and Pekka's goal replay, well you get the drift. Here's your X's and O's: Team can't land passes, they shoot directly at the goalie's logo, got almost doubled up on faceoffs, missed easy goals against a horrible goaltender, Saros gives up looooooong rebounds and the whole team basically looked like they are ready for their glorious vacations next week. At least people started booing. If I have to sit through this for the rest of the season, which I do since I, unfortunately, have tickets, then let's see some young, hungry guys. Hopefully, this post does not age gracefully but I think it will. Ugh.

 

[NoNecksCurse]

i also came off the wrong way by my post in the GDT about calling it right on this core for the past 2-3 years or going back 3 hockey seasons or however you want to call it.

my point was im glad to see everyone coming around and honestly this needed to happen. we aren't winning a cup with this core. im over blaming the coach and i am over wasting money.

do we keep poile? retool versus rebuild?

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

i also came off the wrong way by my post in the GDT about calling it right on this core for the past 2-3 years or going back 3 hockey seasons or however you want to call it.

my point was im glad to see everyone coming around and honestly this needed to happen. we aren't winning a cup with this core. im over blaming the coach and i am over wasting money.

do we keep poile? retool versus rebuild?

I think we have too much locked up in recent, long contracts to go rebuild, but Poile needs to think about some of the core players of this group and make a few decisions about who he really wants to build around. They obviously all don't fit together and the "simple" answer of ditching just Turris, Granlund, and Smith isn't going to fix what's really wrong with this group.

It also sadly seems more apparent Saros is not going to be a consistently good #1. We need a new answer in goal by next season if we're still in "win now" mode.

 

[PredsV82]

We seriously need to be in the market for a goalie. Saros is not the answer. Every team in the NHL drools over the juicy rebounds he produces. I also have to laugh at my personal concern over who we would protect in the expansion draft. Right now I can only think of 4 or 5 I would protect period. I personally wonder if we have three forwards who are truly first liners.

Nobody is going to trade us a top tier goalie. We need to see what Ingram has got.

 

[drwpreds]

Preds are now 4-11 in last 15 games in Bridgestone

FOUR AND ELEVEN

I absolutely hate watching us in Bridgestone-

 

[Armourboy]

Yeah Poile needs to be working on some moves during the All star break.

Now I do think some of Lavi's systems installed were just bad ( especially the PK) but at this point the players are only half trying outside of a couple.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Poile needs to feel a little desperate again to make a couple of key trades. He has been very bold on the trade front when he felt it was needed. Like back when we had no centers and he made those deals for Johansen, and then Turris. He also made the call on Weber/Subban. He's not averse to making a big move or pay a high price when he feels it is really necessary.

To me it just seems like this team needs to find some heart and soul. Doesn't have to be a superstar. A Fisher would be nice. But those types of players... I don't expect it will be easy. But I don't think trading Seth Jones was easy either. The team needs to find a new backbone, some will to win.

I don't follow the rest of the league all that closely anymore, so I don't know if I have many good ideas on how to accomplish this, though. I can definitely imagine it being risky. Maybe you try signing a Kyle Clifford or Radko Gudas as UFAs in the summer. Maybe you have to trade for an awkward contract on a veteran player - somebody who has been looked at as a salary dump like a Ladd or Backes. Maybe there is a younger player who for whatever reason hasn't been able to progress in his original organization and who needs a fresh start but could bring some hunger here like a Bennett. I don't know. It might be a case where you give up a seemingly better player or take on a seemingly worse contract. Which will carry risk. But I see that as the next focus for Poile. He has to find his way to figure out the chemistry and psychology of this team.

 

[Roman Yoshi]

You'd never get him, but Boone Jenner is the guy that comes to mind.

Honestly Granlund, Bonino, Johansen all need to be delt. Smith if he won't sign for less than $5M. Hopefully you get close to ready prospects or good picks you can use to move up in the draft and get real talent.

Roll with

Forsberg Duchene Jarnkrok
Grimaldi Sissons Arvy
Trenin Turris Blackwell
Salomaki someone Watson

The rest of the year and see what happens. I'd keep Bonino, but his value is never going to be higher than it is now.

 

[101st_fan]

This team is becoming a case study in high performing individuals becoming average to mediocre. Turris, Johansen, Duchene, and Granlund all falling off significantly. Grimaldi mentioned what we've commented on ... the team just deflating if they get down a goal or two. Hynes spoke of the need to develop mental toughness and how nobody will just hand you confidence, it must be built.

The problem now is how to fix the space between players' ear holes in a rapid manner. The playing with heart and confidence aspect is what this team lacks and what is so noticeable between now and both the early years and immediately post fire sale seasons. This roster is far to talented for the performances they've put up.

 

[hockey diva]

We will see a 1/2 full arena with more visiting fans soon. No one is going want to see this bunch of overpaid underachievers.

“Was there ever much hope...? No, just a fool’s hope”

 

[FossilFndr]

Usually come from Kingsport area for a few games each year. Glad I was there for the Capitols game in mid October because there is nothing encouraging me to make another trip this season.

 

[Legionnaire11]

You know, every time outsiders talk about our players, namely Subban, Johansen, Turris, Duchene as "cancer" we rush to defend them and explain why it's not the case. I don't really buy into the locker room cancer thing, but can players be a detriment to the team even if they're not outright a bad egg?

Anyway i'm reading a book about team building, (Terry Crisp actually contributed to it and signed my copy!), and they talk about this very thing. They say that there really aren't any locker room cancers in the sense that fans and media describe them, but that each room has three groups. There are the leaders, the naysayers and the fence sitters. The fence sitters will follow whichever other group is stronger, if you have a solid leadership group, then you can deal with a handful of naysayers and be successful. So maybe Poile has added one or two too many guys with question marks and not enough strong leaders to counter them.

Clearly, this is something we as fans will never know, but the identity of the team is very obviously not what it once was.

 

[predhead1]

I agree with most of the comments above, but what irritates me above all else is how frustratingly easy it is for teams to defend our PP - it's like every opponent knows our system better than our players. I have never seen a team whose PP is subjected to so much pressure as teams have done to the Preds for the past 2 1/2 years. It's like they expect the Preds to panic and cough up an easy scoring chance (see last night) whenever we are on the PP. This is in part on the players, but when other teams have clearly been able to diagnose and very actively (and successfully) defend against our PP, to me that is mostly attributable to coaching. I don't see Hynes or anyone else being able to fix that during the remainder of the season.

 

[Roman Yoshi]

Did I just see they sent Trenin down?

Is that a joke?