OT: Let's talk about movies and TV - Part XXVIIII

[angusyoung]

On the Tonight Show itself, how was it, how far is the public from the set and Johnny? is it hard to see? Do they force the public to clap? lol Is it long?

It's not that big and you can see fine from anywhere. Yes they did, I posted about this above. They had signs to prompt you to react,clap etc. Is it long? depends who you ask

 

[LaP]

Same for Game of Thrones. They ruined it except in their case, it was out of greed.

More like out of there's no book to follow anymore

 

[Kriss E]

Same for Game of Thrones. They ruined it except in their case, it was out of greed.

I don't think it was out of greed. They definitely milked the series but there's no reason to have taken those decisions. Greed isn't the reason those writes decided to make Bran the leader at the end...Jon Snow walks freely after his killing..Like nothing made sense at the end. It's such a bad ending it still pisses me off.
Let's not forget the episode they decided to film in dark because they thought it would give a night experience to viewers but all it did was force people to raise their lighting setting and make the image shitty.

This wasn't greed, just bad decisions.

 

[peate]

I don't think it was out of greed. They definitely milked the series but there's no reason to have taken those decisions. Greed isn't the reason those writes decided to make Bran the leader at the end...Jon Snow walks freely after his killing..Like nothing made sense at the end. It's such a bad ending it still pisses me off.
Let's not forget the episode they decided to film in dark because they thought it would give a night experience to viewers but all it did was force people to raise their lighting setting and make the image shitty.

This wasn't greed, just bad decisions.

At least a few got their revenge, Sansa especially.

 

[Kimota]

At least a few got their revenge, Sansa especially.

Game of Thrones was never about revenge but OK.

 

[Non Player Canadiens]

Game of Thrones was never about revenge but OK.

huh? revenge was a major theme in the series and books. off the top of my head (and I'm not even a superfan):

- Arya getting revenge against the Freys (the Manderlys do the human pie thing in the books)
- hell, Arya's list of names prayer is a good example of being driven by revenge
- Oberyn wanting (but not getting) revenge against the Mountain and Tywin
- Varys getting revenge against the wizard who maimed him
- the Hound getting revenge against his brother
- when Sansa got revenge against Ramsay, as peate mentioned
- Brienne seeking to avenge Renly after his death
- when Cersei blew up the Notre Dame of King's Landing after having been humiliated

 

[Runner77]

More like out of there's no book to follow anymore

They had no book for several years but the show’s writers spent time with the author and established the story for each character.

In the end, the writers are to blame:

“They took the plot points handed to them by Martin and simply rushed the endgame, sacrificing character development and plot complexity for CGI spectacle.

We got pretty laughable battle tactics and poor lighting (along with several other gaffes like the infamous Starbucks cup).”

 

[Runner77]

I don't think it was out of greed. They definitely milked the series but there's no reason to have taken those decisions. Greed isn't the reason those writes decided to make Bran the leader at the end...Jon Snow walks freely after his killing..Like nothing made sense at the end. It's such a bad ending it still pisses me off.
Let's not forget the episode they decided to film in dark because they thought it would give a night experience to viewers but all it did was force people to raise their lighting setting and make the image shitty.

This wasn't greed, just bad decisions.

It was greed to me because the writers were more concerned about another major project that had come their way so they lost interest and botched the ending in their rush to get rid of it.

Whatever, all those incredible seasons tainted, could have been avoided.

 

[Runner77]

At 8.5/10 it's near all-time best for me. So 8/10 is a very good score. There is always something that could be better or that made no sense. For this season the lack of security system or security patrol for drug dealers is concerning, the family drama is forced or plain bathshit crazy and a character made a full 180 degree for no reason. That season was good but not perfect either.

Well, if you are applying that level of scrutiny, you’ll find that any production takes creative licence. I think if we get past minor flaws, and look at the overall quality, we get a different appreciation. Guess it all depends on what one chooses to focus upon.

 

[Kimota]

huh? revenge was a major theme in the series and books. off the top of my head (and I'm not even a superfan):

- Arya getting revenge against the Freys (the Manderlys do the human pie thing in the books)
- hell, Arya's list of names prayer is a good example of being driven by revenge
- Oberyn wanting (but not getting) revenge against the Mountain and Tywin
- Varys getting revenge against the wizard who maimed him
- the Hound getting revenge against his brother
- when Sansa got revenge against Ramsay, as peate mentioned
- Brienne seeking to avenge Renly after his death
- when Cersei blew up the Notre Dame of King's Landing after having been humiliated

No I mean characters can have revenge on their mind. But characters succeeding at getting revenge is not what GoT is about or mainly what the books A Song of Ice and Fire are all about. This is not what GRRM wrote. It's never about getting what you want. That is why ultimately the show failed in later seasons. It's not about the typical hero journey, these are not super-hero stories, this is not Marvel. There's always a price to pay at everything you do. Arya and Sansa succeeding at getting revenge I'm a 100% sure will never happen in the books. All D & D were interested in later seasons was trying to make the characters "cool" or "badass" and mutliplying the one liners like it's Marvel movies. Missing the point completely.

Hell everybody wants to kill Jeoffrey, everybody hates him but after he dies in the books, nobody knows who kills him and it will probably always be that way. It is left in the air. It is frustrating but it's realistic. GRRM basically wanted to do something like the JFK assassination like nobody will ever know. That is what makes it so compelling. It's medieval stories but it's also realistic. And it's never about getting what you want cause life is not like that.

 

[Tim Wallach]

At 8.5/10 it's near all-time best for me. So 8/10 is a very good score. There is always something that could be better or that made no sense. For this season the lack of security system or security patrol for drug dealers is concerning, the family drama is forced or plain bathshit crazy and a character made a full 180 degree for no reason. That season was good but not perfect either.

You grade like my first year English prof.

First words out of his mouth on day 1: "There is no such thing as being perfect at English. So the top grade in my class will be 80, because I don't believe it's possible to be better than 20% from perfect."

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Loved Ozark. I would still rate Yellowstone as a higher quality series.

 

[Non Player Canadiens]

No I mean characters can have revenge on their mind. But characters succeeding at getting revenge is not what GoT is about or mainly what the books A Song of Ice and Fire are all about. This is not what GRRM wrote. It's never about getting what you want. That is why ultimately the show failed in later seasons. It's not about the typical hero journey, these are not super-hero stories, this is not Marvel. There's always a price to pay at everything you do. Arya and Sansa succeeding at getting revenge I'm a 100% sure will never happen in the books. All D & D were interested in later seasons was trying to make the characters "cool" or "badass" and mutliplying the one liners like it's Marvel movies. Missing the point completely.

Hell everybody wants to kill Jeoffrey, everybody hates him but after he dies in the books, nobody knows who kills him and it will probably always be that way. It is left in the air. It is frustrating but it's realistic. GRRM basically wanted to do something like the JFK assassination like nobody will ever know. That is what makes it so compelling. It's medieval stories but it's also realistic. And it's never about getting what you want cause life is not like that.

ohhh gotcha, fair. i agree, GRRM loves subverting traditional fantasy expectations and that's what makes it good. nice post

haha there's something so tragic about Oberyn deserving that vengeance but it doesn't quite go that way for him does it ...

 

[Kimota]

ohhh gotcha, fair. i agree, GRRM loves subverting traditional fantasy expectations and that's what makes it good. nice post

haha there's something so tragic about Oberyn deserving that vengeance but it doesn't quite go that way for him does it ...

Much appreciated!

Yea what happened to Oberyn made us all die a little in our souls. WE WILL NEVER FORGET! lol

 

[Tim Wallach]

Loved Ozark. I would still rate Yellowstone as a higher quality series.

I love both but will reserve judgment until Ozark ends as I thought Yellowstone’s fourth season was just mediocre.

Too many labouring side stories that didn’t really go anywhere and Jamie/Beth having the same scene over and over. Still very good but if the first three seasons were 9/10, it was a 7.5 for me.

 

[Runner77]

I love both but will reserve judgment until Ozark ends as I thought Yellowstone’s fourth season was just mediocre.

Too many labouring side stories that didn’t really go anywhere and Jamie/Beth having the same scene over and over. Still very good but if the first three seasons were 9/10, it was a 7.5 for me.

I loved Yellowstone but it irked me for the same reasons you mentioned. How many times does Beth have to visit Jamie's office to deliver the same message? Also, what happened to a high ranking official like Jamie not having anyone to screen incoming visitors? After all of those visits, his personal secretary never recognizes Beth? Reminds me of those store clerks I interact with who have the memory of a goldfish -- if I go back to them 5 minutes after I interacted with them, they greet me as if they've never seen me before.

 

[peate]

I'm really liking 1883, nice, dark and spellbinding. Sam Elliott is masterful and I must say, Faith isn't a bad actress either, nor is her husband, country star Tim McGraw; his role reminds me a bit of Rip on Yellowstone.

I happen to check out The Gilded age;(Downton Abby in New-York). Hard to believe both were set in the same decade.

 

[Tim Wallach]

I loved Yellowstone but it irked me for the same reasons you mentioned. How many times does Beth have to visit Jamie's office to deliver the same message? Also, what happened to a high ranking official like Jamie not having anyone to screen incoming visitors? After all of those visits, his personal secretary never recognizes Beth? Reminds me of those store clerks I interact with who have the memory of a goldfish -- if I go back to them 5 minutes after I interacted with them, they greet me as if they've never seen me before.

Lol, right? I’m glad it wasn’t just me.

 

[Runner77]

Lol, right? I’m glad it wasn’t just me.

You gotta love how 4 seasons’ worth of corpses are piling up without investigation or prosecution in a series set in this day and age.

I had no idea that owning an obscene amount of acreage gives people licence to snuff out lives as an afterthought.

 

[Tim Wallach]

You gotta love how 4 seasons’ worth of corpses are piling up without investigation or prosecution in a series set in this day and age.

I had no idea that owning an obscene amount of acreage gives people licence to snuff out lives as an afterthought.

That’s the other thing. Buy one cop and everyone has a licence to kill. Zero investigation. They definitely push the boundaries of reality on that.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

That’s the other thing. Buy one cop and everyone has a licence to kill. Zero investigation. They definitely push the boundaries of reality on that.

I love both but will reserve judgment until Ozark ends as I thought Yellowstone’s fourth season was just mediocre.

Too many labouring side stories that didn’t really go anywhere and Jamie/Beth having the same scene over and over. Still very good but if the first three seasons were 9/10, it was a 7.5 for me.

All valid criticisms. I still enjoyed season 4 very much.
I love Ozark too, but I thought they suspended reality a bit too much. I love that it’s intense from the beginning and keeps building up more and more tension, but I find sometimes it’s just too much. Overall, it’s one of my favs for sure, I just prefer Yellowstone a bit more.

interestingly some of your criticism in a later post were the same as my criticism with Ozark. I think both suspend reality a bit much, but I try to put that aside and assume this is taking place, just not tied into the story line presented to us.

 

[Tim Wallach]

interestingly some of your criticism in a later post were the same as my criticism with Ozark. I think both suspend reality a bit much, but I try to put that aside and assume this is taking place, just not tied into the story line presented to us.

This is absolutely true. I absolutely love Ozark, but when you boil it right down, it relies extremely heavily on the "is someone getting shot any second" shadow hanging over every other scene. But it's done so well. I think where Ozark has the other shows beat is on casting. Just about every single character is perfectly cast and believably executes their role.

 

[Deebs]

All valid criticisms. I still enjoyed season 4 very much.
I love Ozark too, but I thought they suspended reality a bit too much. I love that it’s intense from the beginning and keeps building up more and more tension, but I find sometimes it’s just too much. Overall, it’s one of my favs for sure, I just prefer Yellowstone a bit more.

interestingly some of your criticism in a later post were the same as my criticism with Ozark. I think both suspend reality a bit much, but I try to put that aside and assume this is taking place, just not tied into the story line presented to us.

I enjoy Yellowstone and everything, but it's not even in the same stratosphere as Ozark in terms of writing, acting, storytelling, etc...

But that's the beauty of tv, everybody likes different things

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I enjoy Yellowstone and everything, but it's not even in the same stratosphere as Ozark in terms of writing, acting, storytelling, etc...

But that's the beauty of tv, everybody likes different things

I disagree here. I think acting is pretty much excellent for both shows. The writing I think is pretty equal as well, I prefer the story line in Yellowstone tbh. That’s what sets it apart for me. I find ozark relies a bit too much on shock and awe. Just my opinion. I love both and I don’t like making a case against ozark, but I just don’t think it’s in the same ballpark as Yellowstone overall.

 

[Deebs]

I disagree here. I think acting is pretty much excellent for both shows. The writing I think is pretty equal as well, I prefer the story line in Yellowstone tbh. That’s what sets it apart for me. I find ozark relies a bit too much on shock and awe. Just my opinion. I love both and I don’t like making a case against ozark, but I just don’t think it’s in the same ballpark as Yellowstone overall.

I think the main characters in Yellowstone are very good but the ranch hands really bring it down significantly. The supporting cast in Ozark has a distinct advantage.