Player Discussion Jesse Puljujarvi '18-19 Season Part II

[Bryanbryoil]

I like Yamo's effort but think that maybe he'd fit better on a "junkyard dog" line with Caggiula. Bump Jesse to the Drai line and drop Yamo to the 3rd line.

 

[780il]

I like Yamo's effort but think that maybe he'd fit better on a "junkyard dog" line with Caggiula. Bump Jesse to the Drai line and drop Yamo to the 3rd line.

This is what I was thinking as well:

First Line
Lucic - Drai - Pulju
Cag/Rieder - Strome - Yamo
Khaira - Brodz - Rieder/Cags

 

[GameChanger]

I just noticed that out of players with over 20 faceoffs taken Strome is the very last in all of NHL (26.1%). As for players with over 10 faceoffs only one is behind. Quite amazingly Khaira's number is even lower (in his own league too), but he's taken just 9 faceoffs.

Again, not saying this explains everything, but it has a huge impact on how the 3rd line's shifts go.

Face-off stats- 2018-19 regular season - 2018 - Puckbase

E: That is after two games, but obviously it's 28% now so practically the same.

 

[Risingwind]

When talking about Jesse, he says: ”...he’s still learning in some other moments where he’s got caught doing some things that effect the team at the other end or maybe the teammates coming onto the ice. We’ve talked and talked and talked to him about it and he’ll have to just keep working on it.”

What do you all think this specifically refers to?

When I watch the Oilers play, I keep an eye out for what Jesse does on the ice. In the NYR game, especially in the 3rd, I witnessed multiple times that he was

• Defensively aware, covering for D that overplayed
• First one back to make a line change, while Rieder and Yamo more or less double shifted on Jesse’s spot when Strome and Caggiula had already come onto the ice (coach’s orders maybe?)
• Creating offense, and if Caggiula finished that feed from Jesse where he was 1-on-1 with Lundqvist would we now be singing praises of how the bottom 6 has woken up?

These points have appeared regularly in his game in my opinion. I don’t quite understand what McLellan means with his comment.

Against NYR, he got 11:19 TOI, which is in line with Caggiula and Yamamoto, surprisingly. The 3rd line was sheltered and they also were more or less the team’s top 3 in fancy stats for this game. I hope they won’t be relegated back to 4th line duty after 1 game.

Edit: Ok, looking at the shift chart shows that he also overstayed his visit a couple times, which on those occasions meant that he was on ice with 97 and 93. I guess that could be what Todd was so bitchy about.

 

[HockeyHistorian]

When talking about Jesse, he says: ”...he’s still learning in some other moments where he’s got caught doing some things that effect the team at the other end or maybe the teammates coming onto the ice. We’ve talked and talked and talked to him about it and he’ll have to just keep working on it.”

What do you all think this specifically refers to?

When I watch the Oilers play, I keep an eye out for what Jesse does on the ice. In the NYR game, especially in the 3rd, I witnessed multiple times that he was

• Defensively aware, covering for D that overplayed
• First one back to make a line change, while Rieder and Yamo more or less double shifted on Jesse’s spot when Strome and Caggiula had already come onto the ice (coach’s orders maybe?)
• Creating offense, and if Caggiula finished that feed from Jesse where he was 1-on-1 with Lundqvist would we now be singing praises of how the bottom 6 has waken up?

These points have appeared regularly in his game in my opinion. I don’t quite understand what McLellan means with his comment.

Against NYR, he got 11:19 TOI, which is in line with Caggiula and Yamamoto, surprisingly. The 3rd line was sheltered and they also were more or less the team’s top 3 in fancy stats for this game. I hope they won’t be relegated back to 4th line duty after 1 game.

Edit: Ok, looking at the shift chart shows that he also overstayed his visit a couple times, which on those occasions meant that he was on ice with 97 and 93. I guess that could be what Todd was so *****y about.

I vaguely recall one badly timed line change which left one guy open and resulted in a scoring chance, perhaps he was referring to that. Other bad plays I remember from the game were one or two times he lost the puck at the opposing blue line and one time where he practically gave the puck to the other team by giving a soft, bad pass. I think that's pretty much the extent of the bad in his game yesterday.

 

[PulYou]

When talking about Jesse, he says: ”...he’s still learning in some other moments where he’s got caught doing some things that effect the team at the other end or maybe the teammates coming onto the ice. We’ve talked and talked and talked to him about it and he’ll have to just keep working on it.”

What do you all think this specifically refers to?

When I watch the Oilers play, I keep an eye out for what Jesse does on the ice. In the NYR game, especially in the 3rd, I witnessed multiple times that he was

• Defensively aware, covering for D that overplayed
• First one back to make a line change, while Rieder and Yamo more or less double shifted on Jesse’s spot when Strome and Caggiula had already come onto the ice (coach’s orders maybe?)
• Creating offense, and if Caggiula finished that feed from Jesse where he was 1-on-1 with Lundqvist would we now be singing praises of how the bottom 6 has waken up?

These points have appeared regularly in his game in my opinion. I don’t quite understand what McLellan means with his comment.

Against NYR, he got 11:19 TOI, which is in line with Caggiula and Yamamoto, surprisingly. The 3rd line was sheltered and they also were more or less the team’s top 3 in fancy stats for this game. I hope they won’t be relegated back to 4th line duty after 1 game.

Edit: Ok, looking at the shift chart shows that he also overstayed his visit a couple times, which on those occasions meant that he was on ice with 97 and 93. I guess that could be what Todd was so *****y about.

Kurt Leavins about Pulju at
Edmonton Journal:

"An awful 1st Period, including a failure to get the puck deep on a soft play at the Rangers line, the result of which was a Rangers puck behind Cam Talbot for the 1-0."

At the time the buck was in the net, Pulju was already on the bench. There was one similar occation against the Bruins if I recall correctly. It only not resulted on goal. Of course player should be responsible when changing on fly.

I don't recall though that Pulju has done this hapitually earlier(?)and to me this is sign, that he plays some what nervously, because I do think deep down he is a responsible player.

When McLellan said Jesse was told about this over and over again, to me this is how coach makes a player not trusting himself. Thank You Todd I already suspected this much...

 

[PulYou]

 

[PulYou]

And this is the story written by Tuominen.

Jesse Puljujärvi Edmontonista: "Kiva paikka, eikä mikään New York"

Jesse is saying he likes it in Edmonton, it is "a nice place" (no New York). His personal aims are to be playing in a good line, gain more TOI and more responsibilities. He was also stating about his current role in a third line. It is their duty to forecheck and strip pucks.

Another words, it is a grinding role for him as I pretty much suspected. McLellan is on his way for third year to turning Pulju into a grinder "he must bully his way out there" as he said in Sweden.

Also Pulju didn't say nothing about wanting to stay in that role (and keep playing with Strome), quite the contrary. He wants to have more TOI, more responsibilities and a place in a good line.

My take - they are pretty much wasting each others time. Pulju's developement in hindered and to Oiler's, this is just poor asset management. If they don't want to benefit from Pulju's offensive talent, once again, trade him or get rid of McLellan.

 

[Risingwind]

Re: Bad line changes

I see, I missed those mistakes. I was driving while listening to the 1st period broadcast. I’m going to start keeping an eye on this in the future to see if Todd is onto something or not.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

I'm disappointed the Jesse I seen in pre-season hasn't carried over to the regular season, he just doesn't look as confident, I blame Todd for that to some extent, but overstaying on shifts (when you aren't a superstar level player like a McDavid or Ovechkin) & turnovers directly inside the offensive or defensive blueline are going to get you a talking to from just about every coach. Even if the average body of work is good enough to possibly get you ice-time over another guy, coaches generally have pet peeves and repeatedly doing the same things wrong or giving the coach the impression you aren't listening to instruction is going to get you in the doghouse and likely shrink your ice-time.

While the average fan just wants to stack as much skill as possible in the top 6, skill alone generally only nets you a cup of coffee look. Players who get pro-longed spots or extended looks are players who are consistently doing what the coach asks of them (e.g. Caggiula/Letestu) or players who bully their way higher up the line-up through actual production (Khaira got a push after a hot streak of points last year). If Jesse wants more he's either got to make the adjustments the coaches are asking of him or produce enough that his warts get overlooked.

 

[GameChanger]

The way he lost the puck was unnecessary, but those things happen once in while if you want to become a linedriver. After all a whole line was behind the play when the Rangers scored, so it wasn't like the worst possible place to try that, although an unnecessary one like I said. It was just unfortunate in that situation the defending was what it was. And Todd wouldn't be Todd if he wouldn't bring this up without mentioning the positives in Jesse's game, as there were several of them too.

If they want Pulju to fullfill his potential I'm afraid they have to accept mistakes here and there. There hasn't been many anyway. As I said I followed Laine very carefully in his first year and the mistakes he made were often in a whole different league compared to Jesse yesterday, but the whole point of view was different in the Jets and it's paid off for quite a while already. As Jesse's leash has been short he's lacking behind in that sense and by the look and sound of it the leash isn't much longer now, either.

 

[BL92]

Just trade Pulju to an organization that actually respects him. I don't see how the Oilers are going to turn into a cup contending franchise with player management that's as bad as this.

 

[Staghorn]

Imagine this team if the Oil had taken Matthew Tkachuk instead of Pulju.... Sure hindsight is 20/20, but at the time I LOVED Tkachuk's game, drive, winner attitude, edge. Tkachuk had just come off a massive Memorial Cup. I just think this team would have a different edge if he was on it. I watch Pulju and all I see is a baby deer skittering around on the ice, fumbling pucks and lacking sense. I worry he will never have IT.

 

[Staghorn]

Just trade Pulju to an organization that actually respects him. I don't see how the Oilers are going to turn into a cup contending franchise with player management that's as bad as this.

Maybe Pulju needs to step up and show he belongs... Cause right now he belongs in Bakersfield. Who would want him for anything solid or equitable in return?

 

[McShogun99]

Yamamoto still needs a year or 2 in the AHL. Let him put on a bit more weight and gain some confidence. Put JP on the second line with Draisaitl.

 

[Todd from Leduc]

Imagine this team if the Oil had taken Matthew Tkachuk instead of Pulju.... Sure hindsight is 20/20, but at the time I LOVED Tkachuk's game, drive, winner attitude, edge. Tkachuk had just come off a massive Memorial Cup. I just think this team would have a different edge if he was on it. I watch Pulju and all I see is a baby deer skittering around on the ice, fumbling pucks and lacking sense. I worry he will never have IT.

Pooljuice was the consensus pick and I still think he’s going to eclipse Tkachuk as he finds his game.

 

[GameChanger]

Imagine this team if the Oil had taken Matthew Tkachuk instead of Pulju.... Sure hindsight is 20/20, but at the time I LOVED Tkachuk's game, drive, winner attitude, edge. Tkachuk had just come off a massive Memorial Cup. I just think this team would have a different edge if he was on it. I watch Pulju and all I see is a baby deer skittering around on the ice, fumbling pucks and lacking sense. I worry he will never have IT.

And imagine if the Flames had taken Puljujarvi, in which case he would very possibly and IMO likely already be an elite player in the league.

The thing is some teams realize how to handle players that do well in the top6+PP but aren't ready to shine in the bottom6 and some just don't. It seems nowadays the trend is most teams belong to the first group, it's just some stubborn old-school coaches that live in the past. It's too easy a solution to think that we had bad luck with this pick, just like we've had bad luck almost every other time, too.

 

[PulYou]

When talking about Jesse, he says: ”...he’s still learning in some other moments where he’s got caught doing some things that effect the team at the other end or maybe the teammates coming onto the ice. We’ve talked and talked and talked to him about it and he’ll have to just keep working on it.”

What do you all think this specifically refers to?

When I watch the Oilers play, I keep an eye out for what Jesse does on the ice. In the NYR game, especially in the 3rd, I witnessed multiple times that he was

• Defensively aware, covering for D that overplayed
• First one back to make a line change, while Rieder and Yamo more or less double shifted on Jesse’s spot when Strome and Caggiula had already come onto the ice (coach’s orders maybe?)
• Creating offense, and if Caggiula finished that feed from Jesse where he was 1-on-1 with Lundqvist would we now be singing praises of how the bottom 6 has woken up?

These points have appeared regularly in his game in my opinion. I don’t quite understand what McLellan means with his comment.

Against NYR, he got 11:19 TOI, which is in line with Caggiula and Yamamoto, surprisingly. The 3rd line was sheltered and they also were more or less the team’s top 3 in fancy stats for this game. I hope they won’t be relegated back to 4th line duty after 1 game.

Edit: Ok, looking at the shift chart shows that he also overstayed his visit a couple times, which on those occasions meant that he was on ice with 97 and 93. I guess that could be what Todd was so *****y about.

And here some more interpreting on McLellans "blow-up" from Lowetide on his blog today:

"I’m parsing words here, but it seems to me that quote, compared to previous ones on the same subject, expresses frustration in a more pronounced way. Perhaps I’m missing this completely, but the coach said ‘talked and talked and talked’ and there’s an edge in the way he said it. Where I come from (same place as McLellan), the end of the sentence is usually “and dammit I’m done talking” but the coach measured his words carefully. There does seem to be a little more freedom in his words there, not exactly MacT discussing Dustin Penner but it caught me when listening.

By the way: There are only two reasons for a coach to be more open than previous avails about a specific player."

And it gets more interesting from Lowetide:

"The win helps, the pressure remains. I am convinced keeping the young talent is the right thing to do, but there are a lot of “Catch-22” bullet points on this roster currently.

Jesse Puljujarvi is a central figure in an internal organizational battle right now. He has talent, they believe in him, but JP is banished to the bottom-six forwards. Is that a coaching decision? Do the centers on the skill lines have trouble playing with the young Finn?"

Don't mean to be condescending, but I was not surprised when reading this. Interpreted that much when suddenly after "the twitter meltdown" McLellan and some members of the media were "handpicking" Pulju's "warts". To me this seemed like some kind of counterattack from the meltdown. And the stakes could be big, I am guessing no less than McLellan's post.

There's some tinfoil hat for You.

Lowetide finishes: "Katz may have a different approach. This feels like something has to give, perhaps it will."

And the source (good read may I add):

Lowetide.ca | Wilton Felder’s I Want You Back

 

[GameChanger]

Yamamoto still needs a year or 2 in the AHL. Let him put on a bit more weight and gain some confidence. Put JP on the second line with Draisaitl.

I remember watching the both players pretty carefully at the WJC-20 and Puljujarvi was definitely better, not just points-wise. Basically all the scouts thought so too. Puljujarvi actually looked better when they played against each other in their first NHL season, but the two players have faced very different usage. Two things that bother me the most are:

1. He's scored good enough points and done between pretty good and excellent in the top6. So why has McLellan dropped him almost every time it seemed Pulju got it going. I mean what's the point, does he really believe that's the best way for the player or the team. I honestly think that's a big joke, but not a good one.

2. How is it possible that Puljujarvi, who was a PP specialist as the shooter/CQ'ing role, hasn't been used in that position and it's over two years now? Can anyone seriously say the team has done everything well when they simply don't even try to use the player according to his strengths.

Saying those aloud doesn't mean Puljujarvi hasn't got things to develop, but I seriously think the points I mentioned are obvious and need to get corrected first before we can really evaluate Pulju or compare him with other prospects with that kind of usage. It'd be a hole different issue if he'd struggled in the top6 or if we didn't know that they haven't even tried his best tool PP yet.

 

[BL92]

Maybe Pulju needs to step up and show he belongs... Cause right now he belongs in Bakersfield. Who would want him for anything solid or equitable in return?

Bullshit. He hasn't gotten any decent chances and yet he somehow needs to step up whilst McLellan is breathing down his neck and giving him tons of shit for minor mistakes? He's going to waste.

 

[GameChanger]

Just trade Pulju to an organization that actually respects him. I don't see how the Oilers are going to turn into a cup contending franchise with player management that's as bad as this.

I'd hate it if it gets to that, but my patience is running out too. As for the Oilers it's really time to take a deep look in the mirror. Study the other top prospects of the same age and their usage and then look at how they've dealt with Jesse. Is the pattern similar? Or is it pretty much the opposite? Which seems to bring the best results? I guess they're too happy to celebrate their good work to have time for minor things like this one, though.

There isn't much the fans can do, but at least there's been some pressure and valid questions written here. The organization can't seriously think that they just made the wrong pick or they were unlucky. By all meters Puljujarvi was seen as one of the top forward prospects during the past years. It's not possible all the soucts and the stats were totally wrong as it wasn't just one tournament we're talking about.

If a team choses a whole different path to "develop" him and they fail they can't blame anyone else but themselves. And no, that doesn't mean the player doesn't play a part in his own development, but I'm sure you know what I'm talking about.

 

[McOvechking]

From what I saw last night, Puljujarvi is excellent on the forecheck and pressuring the defense into making bad plays. He strips the puck as the defense starts their breakout - something not very many other players on the Oilers can do.

But once he has the puck on his stick, he consistently turns it over. I'd like to see Puljujarvi making calmer, better decisions with the puck. His coaches and linemates need to work with him to decide where to play the puck once he gets it, and how to make better passes. That is his glaring weakness.

I'd also like to see JP generate more scoring chances for himself. Find the open ice and get shots on net. It should be his M.O. to generate at least 2 good scoring chances per game, and start trying to get enough shot attempts on goal that he can pick his spots.

So much potential with JP, but he's not being coached well.

 

[ToeMcDrag83]

I really hate Todd McLellan.

 

[McJadeddog]

I really hate Todd McLellan.

We all do man, we ALL do.

Honestly, is there a single person left who thinks he should keep his job?

 

[Delicious Pancakes]

When talking about Jesse, he says: ”...he’s still learning in some other moments where he’s got caught doing some things that effect the team at the other end or maybe the teammates coming onto the ice. We’ve talked and talked and talked to him about it and he’ll have to just keep working on it.”

What do you all think this specifically refers to?

When I watch the Oilers play, I keep an eye out for what Jesse does on the ice. In the NYR game, especially in the 3rd, I witnessed multiple times that he was

• Defensively aware, covering for D that overplayed
• First one back to make a line change, while Rieder and Yamo more or less double shifted on Jesse’s spot when Strome and Caggiula had already come onto the ice (coach’s orders maybe?)
• Creating offense, and if Caggiula finished that feed from Jesse where he was 1-on-1 with Lundqvist would we now be singing praises of how the bottom 6 has woken up?

These points have appeared regularly in his game in my opinion. I don’t quite understand what McLellan means with his comment.

Against NYR, he got 11:19 TOI, which is in line with Caggiula and Yamamoto, surprisingly. The 3rd line was sheltered and they also were more or less the team’s top 3 in fancy stats for this game. I hope they won’t be relegated back to 4th line duty after 1 game.

Edit: Ok, looking at the shift chart shows that he also overstayed his visit a couple times, which on those occasions meant that he was on ice with 97 and 93. I guess that could be what Todd was so *****y about.

Just before the goal against yesterday that made it 1-0 Jesse was carrying the puck through the neutral zone and had an opportunity to dump the puck in but tried to make an extra move at the opposing blue line to enter the offensive zone with possession, however he was stripped of the puck and the Rangers took possession. At this point McDavid and Lucic were already on the ice with him and as the Rangers moved the puck up ice he took the opportunity to change at which point Draisaitl came out. After spinning off of a Nurse hit Zibanejad passed it from the right side half boards all the way over to Staal on the left side half boards who had time to move in and find an open Zibanejad who nobody was covering on the back door.

The video of the play starts at 1:40



Coaches hate it when a puck is turned over at the opposing blue line and it ends up in the back of their own team's net. Usually when that happens though it's because it leads to an odd man rush against. In this case all 4 other Oilers got back to the defensive zone and Nurse and Lucic were caught watching Staal with the puck and not taking a man. Given the way the play unfolded Zibanejad was Lucic's man and Nurse and McDavid's defensive play/positioning leading up to the goal weren't great.

So did Jesse make a mistake and turn the puck over? Yes he turned the puck over and in the scheme of the team's game plan it could probably be called a mistake. However from a possession point of view the Oilers suffer from a lack of controlled entries into the offensive zone so nobody would've had a problem if he hadn't lost the puck. Also, you want your skilled players trying to make plays, Pulju isn't going to get better at the NHL level if he's not trying to make skilled plays.

Was Jesse the reason the Oilers got scored on? Not really, the Oilers were in good position to defend in the defensive zone and Nurse lost a puck battle, McDavid looped out of position, and Lucic didn't take his man who scored the goal. His turnover happened 14 seconds before the goal was scored and is maybe reason #6 why the Rangers scored in so much as they gained possession of the puck. If Jesse had dumped the puck in and the Rangers gained possession that way and then scored there's not much difference.

Turnovers at the blue line are just one of those things that lots of people in the hockey world still hate despite what analytics say about keeping possession for controlled entries. You can't only carry or pass the puck into the zone, but neither should you only dump the puck in because as was evidenced in the Boston and New Jersey games the opposition picks up on it and then you're basically just giving the puck back to the other team.