Has Bergevin made us a better team so far this summer? Part 3

[Halakitlikethat]

The future roster looks great at least

Domi-KK-Gallagher
Caulfield-Poehling-Suzuki
Drouin-Danault-Yolo
Teasdale-Oloffson-McCarron

Romanov-Brook
Mete-Weber
Struble/Harris/Norlinder-Juulsen/Fleury

Primeau

And that’s not counting future picks and returns for Petry, Tatar, and Byron...

There’s a good chance that most of these prospects will not become impact nhl players.

 

[Kent Nilsson]

The team was never good. Some of you seem to think there was a base for a contender with nothing in the pipeline and nothing even coming close to a center on the team. Yeah I remember 2012 very well.



We drafted 15 slots higher than half of these boards were expecting because none of you are able to foresee jack ****. Unlike people here, I don't pretend to know what the team will be like, but I know it's a much brighter future than it's been previously. It's always "the team is terrible" with no nuance here.



Yes indeed, that tends to be what happens when you put your eggs in the development basket.

In before the classic reply "we should trade Weber and Price if we're going to do that".

Doesn't need to be that way, but it may not work for sure.

Beaulieu Tinordi Galchenyuk Collberg McCarron DLR Scherbak were garbage, Poehling Caufield Suzuki Brook Romanov will be sooo much better !! WJC MVP and stuff !!!

 

[admiralcadillac]

Your ignoring that the team needs to be better before those picks will be in the nhl because our 2 best players will be 35+ at that point and no longer top contributors so the picks arent really making the team better so much as holding it firm in the same position

That would make sense if Price and Weber were on a steep decline rather than contributing, but they aren't. The hope is young players will improve faster than the vets will decline.

 

[Milhouse40]

You're right...my bad


And now we have more - which SHOULD come in handy when exploring the trade market for an actual need.

Shaw was redundant on this team...they eliminated a redundancy and added assets.

What's the problem?


We don't know...but yet some say they do and that the trade is awful.


There you have it...

Does a team who doesn't have a defined direction make moves to make the team better in the future?

You're making my point for me.

You're ignoring what's right there in front of you, you're acknowledging what he said he was going to do.

But you don't even realize it.

Last year the goal was to make the PO so i guess this year making the PO should also be their goal....thats the results they are looking for, Bergevin said so himself.

I just don't just how this trade help them achieving this.

If the direction was a rebuild then this trade would be fantastic, we got asset for the future and it makes the worst so we should get a better pick but ad you said yourself.....the Habs are not rebuilding.

 

[admiralcadillac]

Last year the goal was to make the PO so i guess this year making the PO should also be their goal....thats the results they are looking for, Bergevin said so himself.

I just don't just how this trade help them achieving this.

If the direction was a rebuild then this trade would be fantastic, we got asset for the future and it makes the worst so we should get a better pick but ad you said yourself.....the Habs are not rebuilding.

Andrew Shaw is not exactly a boon on the cap. His departure offers room for young players.

 

[habsfan891]

That would make sense if Price and Weber were on a steep decline rather than contributing, but they aren't. The hope is young players will improve faster than the vets will decline.

I don't disagree with the hope you stated but imo it's a poor plan to have to rely on Price and Weber when they reach that age the past has shown it's more likely to fail than turn out for the better

 

[Tabarouette]

There’s a good chance that most of these prospects will not become impact nhl players.

go back like 10-15 years and people were doing the exact same lineups and claims with Chipchura, Higgins, Fischer, Kostitsyn and etc

I hate these "look at our future lineup it looks great" so much

 

[admiralcadillac]

I don't disagree with the hope you stated but imo it's a poor plan to have to rely on Price and Weber when they reach that age the past has shown it's more likely to fail than turn out for the better

You don't have to rely solely on them if the team is better. Time will tell if Price will be one of those goalies that's great nearing his forties.

 

[Bring Bak Damphousse]

And that’s not counting future picks and returns for Petry, Tatar, and Byron...

We’d be lucky if 3-4 of those prospects become contributors at some point, and I dont say that as a slight against anyone, it just isnt realistic, that all of our notable prospects exceed expectations.

 

[Runner77]

So I can see that a few posters are taking subliminal shots at other posters for...well, making posts using the muti-quote.

So i'll drop this topic and let it be.

Shout out to those who participated in this discussion with respect.

A bientot!

Nah, you’re reading too much into the multi-quote thing. We’re all using it so much that it’s become caricatural. Was an attempt at humor, not meant as a slight against anyone.

 

[Runner77]

go back like 10-15 years and people were doing the exact same lineups and claims with Chipchura, Higgins, Fischer, Kostitsyn and etc

I hate these "look at our future lineup it looks great" so much

Yeah, same here. They can’t all meet projections or even have an NHL career.

Doesn’t mean we don’t all want them to succeed. With so many prospects in tow, I’m more immediately interested to find out who is deemed redundant or disposable and hopefully can be used in engineering a trade to fill a need.

 

[Habs Halifax]

There’s a good chance that most of these prospects will not become impact nhl players.

How prospects are trending after being drafted is a huge factor. Habs have a very solid group and yeah, there will be bust but I think you are favoring the pessimistic side more than the optimistic side. Might have something to do with how our prospects have done in the past decade +.

Consider this... Draft position, Quantity of picks, and how they have been trending is something our Habs have not seen in a very long time. It's OK to favor the optimistic side in this case IMO. Superstar talent? That's another story.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Yeah, same here. They can’t all meet projections or even have an NHL career.

Doesn’t mean we don’t all want them to succeed. With so many prospects in tow, I’m more immediately interested to find out who is deemed redundant or disposable and hopefully can be used in engineering a trade to fill a need.

Probability is working in our favor due to the depth of our pool. But yeah, I doubt we have superstar talent and several turn into top 6f/top 4d talent with a few busts. Those who want to compare our current group to anything we had in the last decade or two is on a witch hunt.

 

[Kent Nilsson]

go back like 10-15 years and people were doing the exact same lineups and claims with Chipchura, Higgins, Fischer, Kostitsyn and etc

I hate these "look at our future lineup it looks great" so much

I’d be as hyped as MB apologists if we actually had a legit group of young future stars like the Leafs or Canucks. But MB’s contraption looks more like the third version of the same formula 20 years ago.

 

[Runner77]

There’s a good chance that most of these prospects will not become impact nhl players.

That opens the issue of a different aspect of management — on which prospects should they pre-emptively cut bait and when? This is where having sharp development staff can help the Habs get it right or at least get most of them right.

 

[Runner77]

Probability is working in our favor due to the depth of our pool. But yeah, I doubt we have superstar talent and several turn into top 6f/top 4d talent with a few busts. Those who want to compare our current group to anything we had in the last decade or two is on a witch hunt.

I like our chances of weeding out the ones less likely to succeed thanks to having them go through Bouchard — we certainly have not had someone of that caliber for a long time.

Clearly, they can’t all make it and that’s just the way it is with prospects. There is always a bust factor. I can live with it but would also like to see some of our potential busts be sold off before their bustitude fully emerges.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Beaulieu Tinordi Galchenyuk Collberg McCarron DLR Scherbak were garbage, Poehling Caufield Suzuki Brook Romanov will be sooo much better !! WJC MVP and stuff !!!

What's weird is you ignore trends of what the prospect does after being drafted at 18, 19, 20 and group all prospects together with the same hope. Why are you ignoring trends? Nobody is saying we have superstar talent but you are trying to pin it down this way and going on belittle mode. We may not have superstar talent but we sure have lots of guys who could turn into solid top 6F and top 4D guys.

 

[MonkeyBusiness]

go back like 10-15 years and people were doing the exact same lineups and claims with Chipchura, Higgins, Fischer, Kostitsyn and etc

I hate these "look at our future lineup it looks great" so much

go back like 10-15 years and people were doing the exact same lineups and claims with Chipchura, Higgins, Fischer, Kostitsyn and etc

I hate these "look at our future lineup it looks great" so much

You're right, and yet, even as someone who hasn't followed the team too closely the last 2 years I still can't help but get excited about the prospects. Especially when I'm reading the comments on here, I also remember The Minnesota Wild a few years back were going to be incredible with their plethora of young players and that they added two elite vets in Parise, Suter.

Seeing how that turned out always makes you think twice about a rebuild and prospects. There's just so much unknown, but at the same time there's always hope that we could be that one exception where all the stars align and a few of our young players develop into stars and add to what we already have before it's too late.

 

[Kent Nilsson]

What's weird is you ignore trends of what the prospect does after being drafted at 18, 19, 20 and group all prospects together with the same hope. Why are you ignoring trends? Nobody is saying we have superstar talent but you are trying to pin it down this way and going on belittle mode. We may not have superstar talent but we sure have lots of guys who could turn into solid top 6F and top 4D guys.

So basically we have a bunch of replacements for what we already have.

 

[Runner77]

It’s fascinating how he’s equally inept in both languages. Reminds me of Jean Chretien.

Jean Chrétien: A proof is a proof cause a proof is proven.

Marc Bergevin: The proof is in the plodding.

 

[Habs Halifax]

So basically we have a bunch of replacements for what we already have.

It don't work that way and you know it. I think your biggest problem is you want superstar talent or they suck. Truth is in the middle.

 

[Kent Nilsson]

It don't work that way and you know it. I think your biggest problem is you want superstar talent or they suck. Truth is in the middle.

Exactly I want superstar talent and Ive had enough with the middle !

 

[Runner77]

Exactly I want superstar talent and Ive had enough with the middle !

Spoken like Malcolm!

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

That would make sense if Price and Weber were on a steep decline rather than contributing, but they aren't. The hope is young players will improve faster than the vets will decline.

Hope is not a strategy.

We're sitting with aging vets, young kids and a disaster on D. It's a reflection of a GM without a plan.

You don't have to rely solely on them if the team is better. Time will tell if Price will be one of those goalies that's great nearing his forties.

And again... it's more than just luck. We shouldn't sit here hoping for Price to remain a solid goalie. We should be actively supporting him with better players.

Right now we're just wasting his prime.

 

[Runner77]

Hope is not a strategy.

We're sitting with aging vets, young kids and a disaster on D. It's a reflection of a GM without a plan.

I can’t believe we’re headed into the season with that D corps, no additions to help the PP and the team’s 2nd ranking PPG producer last season sold for picks.