Confirmed with Link: Hamonic traded to CGY

[AcerComputer]

Can anyone explain the major advantage of not letting Vegas select Hamonic, and keeping the 15th pick + your 2018 2nd round pick. Vs waiting for a 1st round pick in 2018 + two future 2nd rounders + Dumping Grabovski.

I mean the advantage for the NYI here is very slight. I mean sure you dump Grabao, but he has one year left and likely stays on the IR - Not a big deal to me.

I understand you get an extra 2nd round pick. But, they could have traded down from 15 a few spots and got a 2nd round pick in 2017 if they wanted. Or stand pat, and draft one of Valimaki/Brannstrom/Liljegren.

Also you don't know where those 2018 picks will land. I personally would rather draft 15th, and take a prospect now, instead of waiting for 2018-2020 to use those picks.

 

[Flair19Woo]

Can anyone explain the major advantage of not letting Vegas select Hamonic, and keeping the 15th pick + your 2018 2nd round pick. Vs waiting for a 1st round pick in 2018 + two future 2nd rounders + Dumping Grabovski.

I mean the advantage for the NYI here is very slight. I mean sure you dump Grabao, but he has one year left and likely stays on the IR - Not a big deal to me.

I understand you get an extra 2nd round pick. But, they could have traded down from 15 a few spots and got a 2nd round pick in 2017 if they wanted. Or stand pat, and draft one of Valimaki/Brannstrom/Liljegren.

Also you don't know where those 2018 picks will land. I personally would rather draft 15th, and take a prospect now, instead of waiting for 2018-2020 to use those picks.

No guarantee vegas takes hammer. $5 mil less cap room to play with if Grabowski still here. If vegas takes Strome no eberle (could be good thing).

 

[GrandmaSlices51631]

That isn't the first time. I think it was Dwayne Roloson who also spoke highly of Garth Snow after he was traded. For all of the complaining, I do not recall ever seeing a player have anything negative to say about Garth Snow.

Have you looked in Berubeport? I mean Bridgeport, Rumor has it there is a Halakness monster. Seriously, talk bad about Snow and he will troll you for the duration of your contract.

 

[boredmale]

Can anyone explain the major advantage of not letting Vegas select Hamonic, and keeping the 15th pick + your 2018 2nd round pick. Vs waiting for a 1st round pick in 2018 + two future 2nd rounders + Dumping Grabovski.

2018 is a better draft then 2017. Also the pick Vegas got from us is in 2019 not 2018.

Don't get me wrong there was still some interesting players left at 15 but the hopes of one of the top 12/13 guys falling to us(or at least that 15th pick) didn't happen. In terms of future picks I do think they are worth more as trading assets either this year or before the next draft then if we drafted player X and try using him as a bargaining chip.

 

[islesjuncky]

What did toronto offer us?

 

[boredmale]

What did toronto offer us?

rumor is 2018 first and JVR(who has one year remaining on his contract). I have to think islanders add a bit to that since JVR worth is probably more then two 2nd rounders

 

[Richie Daggers Crime]

Can anyone explain the major advantage of not letting Vegas select Hamonic, and keeping the 15th pick + your 2018 2nd round pick. Vs waiting for a 1st round pick in 2018 + two future 2nd rounders + Dumping Grabovski.

My guess is that Snow told Hamonic he'd do what he can to get him to the geographic area he wants to be in. Fobbing him off onto Vegas in the expansion draft would be kind of a dick move from that perspective.

 

[LetsGoIslanders]

Snow allegedly balked at moving Hamonic for Hall last year, that's on him, 100%.

However, this a legitimate move considering the Eberle deal and the need to acquire cap space. I also don't think an immediate move is in the cards. This could be a training camp sort of deal like Leddy and Boychuk.

We also need to look at the historical significance of this as Islanders' fans. We need to clear cap room. Ummm, a few years ago it was we need to meet the cap floor -- one situation is better than the other.

Travis' mother isn't doing well. And this Snow doing a nice guy and a good player a solid.

 

[PK Cronin]

Can also consider...I mean just one little iota...That even if Tavares loves snow as a person, that if snow was replaced there might be a BETTER CHANCE that he resigns? Can you please just consider that...I mean even the smallest amount?

Yes. I've already said as much, but once again I'm getting 4 paragraphs about how I don't understand that or something because I simply mentioned the possibility of Snow having a good relationship with players and how that could matter.

 

[IslandersFan17]

Can anyone explain the major advantage of not letting Vegas select Hamonic, and keeping the 15th pick + your 2018 2nd round pick. Vs waiting for a 1st round pick in 2018 + two future 2nd rounders + Dumping Grabovski.

I mean the advantage for the NYI here is very slight. I mean sure you dump Grabao, but he has one year left and likely stays on the IR - Not a big deal to me.

I understand you get an extra 2nd round pick. But, they could have traded down from 15 a few spots and got a 2nd round pick in 2017 if they wanted. Or stand pat, and draft one of Valimaki/Brannstrom/Liljegren.

Also you don't know where those 2018 picks will land. I personally would rather draft 15th, and take a prospect now, instead of waiting for 2018-2020 to use those picks.

- It's a 2019 2nd not a 2018 second.

- We gained cap relief with moving Grabo, and the LTIR and when it can be applied can be tricky in terms of how not effects the cap.

- Easier to protect Hamonic than to expose him and hope what you offer Vegas is enough to entice them not to take Hammer. Might have to had to give up a bit more.

Among other things that were in play.

I also have a very off the wall theory, NOT from a source or anyone else... just me-I think Snow was operating under the assumption that both Eberle and Duchene were basically done deals.

 

[CanadianPantherFan]

Who is John Shannon?



Not sure what you mean.

Used to be main producer of Hockey Night In Canada broadcasts , now co-host on tv/radio shows all the time up here. Might've been around when Dave Hodge was fired/early Don Cherry years.

 

[BarBeauWahlDobLok]

The longer we have this pick, the longer the Flames have to lose. The value of the pick goes up and down as the Flames go this season. If the Flames bottom out, the Islanders might hold the pick. For Duchene, should a deal take place, the Islanders must decide whether they send their own pick, the Flames pick, or both.

Also, as time goes on, Duchene's value goes down. A trade before training camp nets a team two full and protected years of Duchene. After or during training camp, it's one year+ of Duchene. And I don't think he's worth selling the farm for, but efforts should continue.

Another thing Garth could try, if he's feeling bold; is packing the Flames pick and/Or the Islanders own pick along with a bad contract (Boychuck, for Example) to New Jersey for Taylor Hall, then make another move to get Alex Galchenyuk.

That would give a first line or Taylor Hall (younger than Duchene), John Tavares, and Jordan Eberle; and a 2md line center in Alex Galchenyuk.

The aforementioned is purely cooked up in my head and is beyond unlikely, but it is an idea, and it would shoe Tavares that we're serious.

#1 picks aren't that important right now, and with the right players on the roster, we can go another year or two without them.

If Garth wants to prove his genius, he'll have this team set up for the next 12 years. Let's just say he signs Tavares for $90m over 9 years, that brings him to 36, and will no longer be a number 1 center. Matt Barzal will be 29, and should be there at number 1. If we do it right, there should be a solid number 2 waiting to become number 1 behind him.

Not for nothing, this is the shape we would have been in during the late 80s and early 90s, had we drafted Sakic instead of Deam Chynoweth.

... Yes, sour grapes.

 

[periferal]

Yes. I've already said as much, but once again I'm getting 4 paragraphs about how I don't understand that or something because I simply mentioned the possibility of Snow having a good relationship with players and how that could matter.

PK...I think the problem is that you seem to be hanging your hat more than most on what *could* be the case, and seemingly putting more importance on that then wins and losses - Which is the bottom line on how all GMs should be judged. That was always my debate with you.

I don't believe for a second Tavares would leave if we hired a more competent GM - No matter his relationship with snow. If Tavares is going to leave it's because of everything we've been hearing - The chance to win, which, unlike a possible relationship, we can easily see that is an issue because of snow's failures.

It's like it finally took Tavares' potential departure to get snow to wake up and try to have a good offseason. Why did it come to this? I mean if snow is such a good friend to JT, why not surround him with better talent earlier? Because again the business of hockey comes first no matter how close you are with someone.

snow seemingly had a great relationship with Hamonic and wanted to help him with his family matters (the most important thing) and yet he wasn't going to let him go with out getting a fair deal and it took over a year.

If snow drafted better, traded better, and signed better, we would be much closer to the Cup and wouldn't be missing the playoffs 8 years into Tavares' career. If snow didn't fail as much as he did then the Isles would be better and they're wouldn't be talk about him leaving.

So again it doesn't matter about if snow/JT are friends. If snow did better as a GM then all problems would be solved.

 

[Dipietro39]

Analyzing the trade is pretty simple IMO:

(1) We got max return with respect to draft picks;

(2) Pelech and/ or Pulock now have a spot on bottom pairing;

(3) Hamonic didn't want to be here; and

(4) most importantly, if Snow moves the picks for Duchene or another forward, it's a good deal. If this is our opening night roster, horrible move as we aren't improved enough from last year.

 

[gramatanboy]

- It's a 2019 2nd not a 2018 second.

- We gained cap relief with moving Grabo, and the LTIR and when it can be applied can be tricky in terms of how not effects the cap.

- Easier to protect Hamonic than to expose him and hope what you offer Vegas is enough to entice them not to take Hammer. Might have to had to give up a bit more.

Among other things that were in play.

I also have a very off the wall theory, NOT from a source or anyone else... just me-I think Snow was operating under the assumption that both Eberle and Duchene were basically done deals.

It says on the NHL website that it it a 2018 2nd round pick and a conditional 2019 or 2020 2nd round pick from Calgary.

 

[boredmale]

It says on the NHL website that it it a 2018 2nd round pick and a conditional 2019 or 2020 2nd round pick from Calgary.

The condition is either us or Calgary(I am not sure who) get to choose when to use it(2019 or 2020)

 

[BarBeauWahlDobLok]

Analyzing the trade is pretty simple IMO:

(1) We got max return with respect to draft picks;

(2) Pelech and/ or Pulock now have a spot on bottom pairing;

(3) Hamonic didn't want to be here; and

(4) most importantly, if Snow moves the picks for Duchene or another forward, it's a good deal. If this is our opening night roster, horrible move as we aren't improved enough from last year.

I agree that in his heart of hearts, Hamonic wanted to be somewhere else.

As for Duchene, the clock is ticking. The pinnacle of his value very well may have been yesterday and Friday. Now, the more time that goes on, the more his value decreases. Any team that gets him will want him for two full years, including training camp. Anything less than that is a long-term rental, going on the assumption that the team trading for is either unable or unwilling to re-sign him after the two years.

I'm not a Snow apologist, but he's kind of in the catbird's seat in dealing with Sakic right now. It could very well turn out that next year at this time, Sakic is wishing he would have gotten one of those picks for Duchene. Sakic does run the risk of running out of runway in trading Duchene.

Conversely, Snow has his own runway to worry about. He has about 8 months to convince Tavares that the Islanders are a team with re-signing with. That clock is also ticking.

 

[gramatanboy]

The condition is either us or Calgary(I am not sure who) get to choose when to use it(2019 or 2020)

If Calgary misses the playoffs in 2019 the Islanders get their 2nd round pick. If the Flames make the playoffs in 2019, then Arizona gets their 2nd round pick and the Islanders get Calgary's 2020 2nd round pick. The Isles will ship their 4th round pick in the corresponding year (2019 or 2020) that Calgary sends us their 2nd round pick.

 

[Dipietro39]

I agree that in his heart of hearts, Hamonic wanted to be somewhere else.

As for Duchene, the clock is ticking. The pinnacle of his value very well may have been yesterday and Friday. Now, the more time that goes on, the more his value decreases. Any team that gets him will want him for two full years, including training camp. Anything less than that is a long-term rental, going on the assumption that the team trading for is either unable or unwilling to re-sign him after the two years.

I'm not a Snow apologist, but he's kind of in the catbird's seat in dealing with Sakic right now. It could very well turn out that next year at this time, Sakic is wishing he would have gotten one of those picks for Duchene. Sakic does run the risk of running out of runway in trading Duchene.

Conversely, Snow has his own runway to worry about. He has about 8 months to convince Tavares that the Islanders are a team with re-signing with. That clock is also ticking.

Agree. Just want to add that we do need Duchene. He is the perfect fit. Snow has to land him. If it comes to september and Sakic is still being stubborn, I offer Barzal + 1st and get it done. This is the most important offseason in the franchises history: JT and new building.

At least JT has seen the efforts from Snow is landing Eberle and doing everything to try and get Duchene.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

Nah...we nerdz want guys who contribute to wins first and foremost. Idc how tall a player is or how gritty he is if he can't play hockey. Also we want robots on the ice and revenge against the jocks who bullied us in high school.

Because hockey isn't a contact sport, right?

 

[CupHolders]

Agree. Just want to add that we do need Duchene. He is the perfect fit. Snow has to land him. If it comes to september and Sakic is still being stubborn, I offer Barzal + 1st and get it done. This is the most important offseason in the franchises history: JT and new building.

At least JT has seen the efforts from Snow is landing Eberle and doing everything to try and get Duchene.

Provided the following conditions:

- JT signs this summer
- Isles don't find another center option

than I would:

- hold off on trading Barzal
- use Nelson at center

No it is not ideal, but this team was only one of the following from making the playoffs:

- an earlier coaching change
- better goaltending handling
- slightly better shootout record
- above average PP

Going in with Nelson at center is not ideal and certainly not my preference. But it allows time to determine if:

- Duchene is declining as a player
- Sakic's valuation of him lowers
- if Barzal can earn a spot
- Another option presents itself

Isles would then have to look at the deadline for an upgrade.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

But here's the thing about that, PK... I've left plenty of jobs where I had a lot of respect for my boss or my boss's boss. There are other factors at play and just because the guys respect him, doesn't mean they won't walk away if they get a better opportunity. Snow may be respected, but if the Isles ain't winning... who gives a **** about that?

UFAs give a ****. That, I can assure you.

He is also so loyal that it falls into cronyism. See Capuano, Jack about that one. His loyalty is a two edged sword - helps for some, hurts for others.

 

[blitzkriegs]

Really funny how the entire fanbase has fallen for this 'JT is gonna wait on Snow to show him he wants to build a winner' thing.

 

[Beautvillier]

Really funny how the entire fanbase has fallen for this 'JT is gonna wait on Snow to show him he wants to build a winner' thing.

it's not like it's an unreasonable thing to believe.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

Really funny how the entire fanbase has fallen for this 'JT is gonna wait on Snow to show him he wants to build a winner' thing.

Because the best player of a team never walked because he thought his parent club wasn't really trying?