COVID-19: The final countdown

[bambamcam4ever]

So I say this before people claim I'm not a believer of Covid. I have taken more precautions than any person in this thread. Guaranteed.

But the relation to hunger / school closings leading to child malnutrition? We just ignore that? Mental illness? Unemployment leading to hunger and death? Why do we shrug this off? Or better yet... how about CDC noting survival rate is 99+% for 70 and under without pre-existing condition. If we follow science, then....? Or do we only follow science that we want to fit our narrative?

So when people question lockdowns while stuff like that exist and you say "science is the pursuit of the truth", I have to question. Is it?

1) I believe the pandemic has caused these things like hunger, and people losing their jobs. Those stresses will continue until the pandemic is under control. I'm not saying you are, but I've seen people on site conflate problems caused by a pandemic with those created by lockdowns. People aren't stressed because Applebee's is closed. They're stressed because there is massive spread of a potentially deadly virus.

And yes, most people will survive, but would you eat from a box of jellybeans if 1 in 500 would kill you?

2) The idea that some children will go hungry if they don't go to school is unfortunately true. Instead of saying that we should force potential carriers back into incubators, maybe the thought should be that we need to fix our society so that people aren't put in a position to go hungry.

 

[Jacob]

Just a quick question. You allude to one individual, but what about Dr. Fauci. Just your quick thoughts from March to present? Serious question. And then maybe brief opinion on CDC and WHO. In the same light, that is.

I don’t really follow Fauci much. By the fine he became front-and-center in the US there was better info to be found on r/COVID19 and even the threads on hfboards.

The WHO totally screwed the pooch in my opinion, on a few fronts. Like so badly I don’t see any reason for the world to even allow the organization to continue operating as any kind of organization.

 

[Gurglesons]

1) I believe the pandemic has caused these things like hunger, and people losing their jobs. Those stresses will continue until the pandemic is under control. I'm not saying you are, but I've seen people on site conflate problems caused by a pandemic with those created by lockdowns. People aren't stressed because Applebee's is closed. They're stressed because there is massive spread of a potentially deadly virus.

And yes, most people will survive, but would you eat from a box of jellybeans if 1 in 500 would kill you?

2) The idea that some children will go hungry if they don't go to school is unfortunately true. Instead of saying that we should force potential carriers back into incubators, maybe the thought should be that we need to fix our society so that people aren't put in a position to go hungry.

Yeah, but the US solved COVID, why aren't you proud of US?

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Just a quick question. You allude to one individual, but what about Dr. Fauci. Just your quick thoughts from March to present? Serious question. And then maybe brief opinion on CDC and WHO. In the same light, that is.

1) Whataboutism is a tacit admission of wrongdoing.

2) Fauci has consistently done a good job explaining how to modify your behavior in the pandemic based on the information available at the time. I haven't heard much from him in the last few months though.

 

[ColePens]

I don’t really follow Fauci much. By the fine he became front-and-center in the US there was better info to be found on r/COVID19 and even the threads on hfboards.

The WHO totally screwed the pooch in my opinion, on a few fronts. Like so badly I don’t see any reason for the world to even allow the organization to continue operating as any kind of organization.

Totally agree with you about WHO. They are so inconsistent. But not as terribly flip floppy like this next one...

And just to give you massive props for not falling into that trap... here is the guy that flip flops 24/7 but people use his claims as definitive. This is in March. On.. quite a popular show. But you will see people blame a singular person.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Yeah, but the US solved COVID, why aren't you proud of US?

We actually did provide significant value at the national level in the development of the vaccine trials. We cultivated an environment of consistent levels of significant spread for 9 months, putting us alongside South American countries. We were successful guinea pigs.

 

[ColePens]

1) I believe the pandemic has caused these things like hunger, and people losing their jobs. Those stresses will continue until the pandemic is under control. I'm not saying you are, but I've seen people on site conflate problems caused by a pandemic with those created by lockdowns. People aren't stressed because Applebee's is closed. They're stressed because there is massive spread of a potentially deadly virus.

And yes, most people will survive, but would you eat from a box of jellybeans if 1 in 500 would kill you?

2) The idea that some children will go hungry if they don't go to school is unfortunately true. Instead of saying that we should force potential carriers back into incubators, maybe the thought should be that we need to fix our society so that people aren't put in a position to go hungry.

My dear friend... let me teach you about diabetes. It may be a bigger killer than you think!

And yeah everything I ask is that you take this info - compile it all. I want it all compiled and let people make the best decisions based on all the data. Very very very important.

 

[Gurglesons]

We actually did provide significant value at the national level in the development of the vaccine trials. We cultivated an environment of consistent levels of significant spread for 9 months, putting us alongside South American countries. We were successful guinea pigs.

I'm happy with the fact a vaccine was created and the world was able to put aside the financial ramifications of approving said vaccine and getting it into our hands as fast as possible.

I'm not sure I'd be proud of how any country has handled COVID outside of New Zealand and Australia.

 

[NMK11]

So wait... if someone is showing specific headlines from full on credible news sources, that doesn't count? How does this life even work?> Like even if you absolutely despise the person, how do you choose to ignore something so clear?

That doesn't seem even remotely troubling at all?

Wait, we were discussing the credibility of a person, not a news site:

- You specifically criticized someone for dismissing said person.
- I responded that the person had a well documented history of lying and shouldn't that come into play.

I didn't mention anything about the news site at all. If you're going to laugh, please make sure you're having a discussion in good faith and not changing the subject so it suits your side. I'm continuously disturbed by how easy you pivot once you're challenged by people.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

I'm happy with the fact a vaccine was created and the world was able to put aside the financial ramifications of approving said vaccine and getting it into our hands as fast as possible.

I'm not sure I'd be proud of how any country has handled COVID outside of New Zealand and Australia.

I agree. Although some of the East Asian countries have done well.

 

[Gurglesons]

I agree. Although some of the East Asian countries have done well.

And I think as we've seen in the case of most of those countries they are also suppressing facts much like our government.

 

[ColePens]

Wait, we were discussing the credibility of a person, not a news site:

- You specifically criticized someone for dismissing said person.
- I responded that the person had a well documented history of lying and shouldn't that come into play.

I didn't mention anything about the news site at all. If you're going to laugh, please make sure you're having a discussion in good faith and not changing the subject so it suits your side. I'm continuously disturbed by how easy you pivot once you're challenged by people.

Actually no. You were discussing that. I was discussing the multiple examples provided when a user said everyone expected a vaccine. That is factually incorrect. Most mainstream news and even most doctors said no way a vaccine happens in less than a year. SOME even claimed closer to 2.

8 months... and two. That is a Tiger Woods fist pump to help save millions worldwide.

 

[NMK11]

So I say this before people claim I'm not a believer of Covid. I have taken more precautions than any person in this thread. Guaranteed.

But the relation to hunger / school closings leading to child malnutrition? We just ignore that? Mental illness? Unemployment leading to hunger and death? Why do we shrug this off? Or better yet... how about CDC noting survival rate is 99+% for 70 and under without pre-existing condition. If we follow science, then....? Or do we only follow science that we want to fit our narrative?

So when people question lockdowns while stuff like that exist and you say "science is the pursuit of the truth", I have to question. Is it?

Once again, for the fifty millionth time. No one is ignoring these things. No one is shrugging them off. The decisions that have been made to take a certain course after weighing all of these options. Just because you don't like the decision doesn't mean that people are ignoring all of these other things. I just don't get why you think they are.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

And I think as we've seen in the case of most of those countries they are also suppressing facts much like our government.

I was talking more about Japan and South Korea, not China.

Much higher adherence to mask wearing, much of it culturally though.

 

[Jacob]

The only countries that handled it well are islands that have a healthy distrust of China.

 

[Gurglesons]

The only countries that handled it well are islands that have a healthy distrust of China.

Every country is an island if you think about it though, bro.

 

[NMK11]

Actually no. You were discussing that. I was discussing the multiple examples provided when a user said everyone expected a vaccine. That is factually incorrect. Most mainstream news and even most doctors said no way a vaccine happens in less than a year. SOME even claimed closer to 2.

8 months... and two. That is a Tiger Woods fist pump to help save millions worldwide.

I don't know why I even bother:

Please don’t talk about Kaleigh McEnany though. Seriously can’t find a less credible person on anything if I tried.

Exactly what you just did really hits to how disappointed I am in how people talk about this pandemic. It goes perfectly to my initial point. So if you hate or disagree with Person A - you will just automatically turn off anything. So when dates and quotes from multiple outlets laughing and fact checking against a vaccine being available by EOY - we just blatantly ignore it because we chose to dislike that person? That's exactly what I do not understand, but I see that's exactly how the media wants it to gain interest and money to get you to tune in. When in reality - America will now be able to save millions across the globe from this horrifying pandemic. What a damn great thing to be proud of.

Shady was talking about a person.
You responded back to his comments about a person, you LITERALLY said "Person" in the entity you were talking about.
I commented about said person whom you brought up.

And for the record, yeah, a lot of people including myself didn't expect a vaccine by the end of the year. How could anyone say they knew it would happen when it's unprecedented and blows away any prior vaccine development time in medical history? I've never been happier to be wrong, and I'm sure proud of the scientists and researchers who made this happen. I'm sure there were people out there who didn't believe it because it didn't fit a narrative, but I'd be willing to be most people didn't believe it because of how ambitious it was.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

I don't know why I even bother:





Shady was talking about a person.
You responded back to his comments about a person, you LITERALLY said "Person" in the entity you were talking about.
I commented about said person whom you brought up.

And for the record, yeah, a lot of people including myself didn't expect a vaccine by the end of the year. How could anyone say they knew it would happen when it's unprecedented and blows away any prior vaccine development time in medical history? I've never been happier to be wrong, and I'm sure proud of the scientists and researchers who made this happen. I'm sure there were people out there who didn't believe it because it didn't fit a narrative, but I'd be willing to be most people didn't believe it because of how ambitious it was.

Most respected scientists and doctors who were involved predicted an extremely good chance of a vaccine around Thanksgiving.

No guarantees.

But very strong consistent predictions.

So it was reasonable to rely on them to have a similar POV.

 

[NMK11]

Most respected scientists and doctors who were involved predicted an extremely good chance of a vaccine around Thanksgiving.

No guarantees.

But very strong consistent predictions.

So it was reasonable to rely on them to have a similar POV.

You're right, most of the people who were involved were saying that. And luckily for all of us they were spot on. It doesn't change that it was a pretty ambitious goal and wouldn't be the first time that someone involved promises something big but doesn't quite hit the mark.

Long and short, it doesn't really matter to me. The vaccine was going to come out when the vaccine came out. If it had come out next summer I wouldn't hold it against anyone, scientist or politician, and if it came out this past summer I'd still be lining up to take it. We were all guessing and estimating, so I don't think it's reasonable to hold it against anyone for a wrong guess or estimate, or for having a little bit of skepticism about something that sounded almost too good to be true.

 

[Pens1566]

Actually no. You were discussing that. I was discussing the multiple examples provided when a user said everyone expected a vaccine. That is factually incorrect. Most mainstream news and even most doctors said no way a vaccine happens in less than a year. SOME even claimed closer to 2.

8 months... and two. That is a Tiger Woods fist pump to help save millions worldwide.

Don't put words in my f***ing mouth. I specifically said "Fauci, and others with similar expertise,". If you morph that into "everyone", that's your f***ing issue, not mine.

 

[Beau Knows]

Calling for the WHO to be disbanded is such a mind-numbingly stupid idea. The WHO has issues that it need to address, but it's an important organization that does plenty of good work.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Calling for the WHO to be disbanded is such a mind-numbingly stupid idea. The WHO has issues that it need to address, but it's an important organization that does plenty of good work.

Know the best way to fix a problem? Throw your hands up in the air, cry about it a whole bunch and go home.

*checks notes*

Wait no the opposite of that.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Tons of great news daily.

But the other side of the coin is that people will take this less seriously. More needless deaths.

And Christmas will be even worse than Thanksgiving.

Please do not be stupid and let your guard down.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Calling for the WHO to be disbanded is such a mind-numbingly stupid idea. The WHO has issues that it need to address, but it's an important organization that does plenty of good work.

I agree.

The politicization of various parts of the UN is frustrating. However if the experience with the League of Nations between the World Wars taught us anything, when the US opted out, it is that letting some take unwarranted cheap shots is much better than taking your ball and going home.

We can agree on both concepts and find common ground. A rarity these days.

 

[ColePens]

Once again, for the fifty millionth time. No one is ignoring these things. No one is shrugging them off. The decisions that have been made to take a certain course after weighing all of these options. Just because you don't like the decision doesn't mean that people are ignoring all of these other things. I just don't get why you think they are.

Oh I think in the general population, because it's not being talked about AT ALL, it 100% is happening.

NMK - you are a very intelligent person who takes time to read and understand. The general population is not. They read headlines and that is it. The headlines are not telling you everything I just wrote. You have to understand that.