Coronavirus and the Washington Capitals

[tenken00]

I understand the business aspect of keeping the season going. Its unfortunate that the pandemic is going on while they are probably strategizing for the upcoming TV negotiations as of this very moment. And I've always said that a bad TV deal not only hurts you in the short term, but the ramifications could possibly span decades down the road.

I just wish that the NHL would be more stricter in enforcing their protocol rules. The NFL was at one point docking draft picks from organizations for rule breaches.

I know that something like that would hurt the Capitals organization with the Russian 4 hotel party, but if the NHL came out from the beginning stating that draft picks will be docked, teams and players would definitely sit up and listen and go the extra mile.

 

[g00n]

I understand the business aspect of keeping the season going. Its unfortunate that the pandemic is going on while they are probably strategizing for the upcoming TV negotiations as of this very moment. And I've always said that a bad TV deal not only hurts you in the short term, but the ramifications could possibly span decades down the road.

I just wish that the NHL would be more stricter in enforcing their protocol rules. The NFL was at one point docking draft picks from organizations for rule breaches.

I know that something like that would hurt the Capitals organization with the Russian 4 hotel party, but if the NHL came out from the beginning stating that draft picks will be docked, teams and players would definitely sit up and listen and go the extra mile.

I'm not so sure. The problem is self-regulation in general. People by nature are BAD at voluntary compliance, especially when there are narratives about this situation that cause people to flaunt precautions or deny the virus entirely. Which is why you have to maybe impose restrictions that are a bit more than necessary just to get to the level you really want.

 

[Corby78]

Are they "limiting it the best they can" right now? I don't think so. How many positive tests now compared to the bubble?

If they don't want to work in bubbles like many of us are forced to then that's on them. They can't complain when things go sideways.

Their restrictions are greater than most the public. They have to stay in hotel rooms, no restaurants, outings, visitors etc... I may need to wear a mask but I can go to McDonald’s if I want

 

[g00n]

Their restrictions are greater than most the public. They have to stay in hotel rooms, no restaurants, outings, visitors etc... I may need to wear a mask but I can go to McDonald’s if I want

And yet, here we are. So apparently not.

 

[AussieCapsFan]

And yet, here we are. So apparently not.

Is it reasonable to suggest these guys are infecting each other when they are playing the actual games, and maybe spreading it around during practices?

Buffalo, NJ, Philly and our Caps all have people on covid protocol etc - and they've all played each other in the last couple of weeks.
Tampa, Florida, Carolina in their division.
Minny, Colorado, Vegas in their division.

Or is it just the infection rate is so high in the U.S that it's inevitable people are going to catch it?

 

[Calicaps]

Is it reasonable to suggest these guys are infecting each other when they are playing the actual games, and maybe spreading it around during practices?

Buffalo, NJ, Philly and our Caps all have people on covid protocol etc - and they've all played each other in the last couple of weeks.
Tampa, Florida, Carolina in their division.
Minny, Colorado, Vegas in their division.

Or is it just the infection rate is so high in the U.S that it's inevitable people are going to catch it?

Yes it's reasonable, which is why the whole "they're doing everything they can" is quite obviously BS. Guys are getting infected. It takes 5 days tho to get a positive test after exposure. So clearly there can be guys shedding virus on the bench/ice, in the locker room, and in the gym before they ever test positive.

The infection rate here in the U.S. is a disgrace, but despite that, the bubble worked. This approach clearly is not.

 

[Corby78]

And yet, here we are. So apparently not.

So NHL players are catching it and not the public? Virus is going to virus, playing in the NHL with their rules is not increasing their chances of catching it

 

[Corby78]

Yes it's reasonable, which is why the whole "they're doing everything they can" is quite obviously BS. Guys are getting infected. It takes 5 days tho to get a positive test after exposure. So clearly there can be guys shedding virus on the bench/ice, in the locker room, and in the gym before they ever test positive.

The infection rate here in the U.S. is a disgrace, but despite that, the bubble worked. This approach clearly is not.

So what is the excepable level of positives to keep playing? 5? 10? Zero?

 

[Calicaps]

So what is the excepable level of positives to keep playing? 5? 10? Zero?

I don't even know how to answer that.

But it occurs to me that we have no idea whether any of these player infections have led to infections among staff, trainers, or family members. I'm not much ok with the idea that some assistant trainer's kid might get sick so the league can get a better TV deal.

 

[AussieCapsFan]

We could go one step further and suggest (somebody on the mains already did) that all players, staff etc get vaccinated.....

And yes, I know people will say "Why should they get priority over front line workers, etc?" But I don't think there's a shortage of vaccine doses, is there? It's more a case of trying to administer and manage the logistics around getting people vaccinated (throughout the U.S)?

 

[g00n]

There is a huge vaccine shortage

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Where’s Putin with those vaccines for the NHL like someone mentioned lol....

 

[Man Machine]

Right now it would be bad PR for NHL to get the players/staff vaccinated cutting the queue. But at some point hopefully soon the front line workers will have had their shots and same for the high risk patients. When this will happen nobody knows but my guess/hope is that NHL will get the vaccine at some point during the season.

 

[Ridley Simon]

I don't even know how to answer that.

But it occurs to me that we have no idea whether any of these player infections have led to infections among staff, trainers, or family members. I'm not much ok with the idea that some assistant trainer's kid might get sick so the league can get a better TV deal.

Yes — but this is true everywhere, in any business. Isn’t it? I’ve witnessed footage of companies in Michigan, Indiana, Texas, Florida, etc etc where no one is wearing masks and everyone is engaged with each other.

I’m not at all advocating that. But to pick on the NHL vs any other industry doesn’t seem fair.

I’d wager that the NHL is probably safer than these other places, and yet here we are.

Like I said earlier - people are free to make their choices. A janitor for the Cap Center in DC is the same as a janitor for United Wholesale Mortgage in Michigan (#2 mortgage company in the country) or *insert company name* in Texas/Florida.

They all do what they want, and the employees need to choose where they stand. This isn’t an NHL thing. It’s just not.

 

[AussieCapsFan]

There is a huge vaccine shortage

Oh okay I wasn't aware of that. I just had a look online and seems that yes indeed, supply can't keep up with demand. I guess it will improve in the coming months.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Right now it would be bad PR for NHL to get the players/staff vaccinated cutting the queue. But at some point hopefully soon the front line workers will have had their shots and same for the high risk patients. When this will happen nobody knows but my guess/hope is that NHL will get the vaccine at some point during the season.

Of course it would.....it’s a friggen joke because someone suggested Putin was going to ninja some goodwill with a move like this lol...

 

[Corby78]

Oh okay I wasn't aware of that. I just had a look online and seems that yes indeed, supply can't keep up with demand. I guess it will improve in the coming months.

Although to call it a shortage is a bit misleading. That usually implies the demand was underestimated or there has been a delay with production. We are talking about vacinating the world (or at least the world -anti vaccinators). The time and order to get this to everyone has been discussed for almost the entire time of the pandemic. We knew from the start this would be a drawn out process.
Thankfully the data out of Israel has been good so it looks like there is at least a light at the end of the tunnel.

 

[g00n]

Although to call it a shortage is a bit misleading. That usually implies the demand was underestimated or there has been a delay with production. We are talking about vacinating the world (or at least the world -anti vaccinators). The time and order to get this to everyone has been discussed for almost the entire time of the pandemic. We knew from the start this would be a drawn out process.
Thankfully the data out of Israel has been good so it looks like there is at least a light at the end of the tunnel.

Oh for f***'s sake, you need to argue with "shortage"?

Problem?

 

[g00n]

Yes — but this is true everywhere, in any business. Isn’t it? I’ve witnessed footage of companies in Michigan, Indiana, Texas, Florida, etc etc where no one is wearing masks and everyone is engaged with each other.

I’m not at all advocating that. But to pick on the NHL vs any other industry doesn’t seem fair.

I’d wager that the NHL is probably safer than these other places, and yet here we are.

Like I said earlier - people are free to make their choices. A janitor for the Cap Center in DC is the same as a janitor for United Wholesale Mortgage in Michigan (#2 mortgage company in the country) or *insert company name* in Texas/Florida.

They all do what they want, and the employees need to choose where they stand. This isn’t an NHL thing. It’s just not.

Some people behaving badly is not an excuse for everyone to behave badly.

If not for most people doing what they're supposed to do, and thanks to vaccine rollouts, this all could be MUCH worse.

We also don't know what happens to those people we see on video, either afterward or before (have they already recovered? Do they get sick later, maybe die or have long-term effects?)

There is a wave of "lockdown fatigue" that started in f***ing APRIL for some people, but the virus doesn't get any nicer.

In fact it seems to be getting more contagious through mutations, which is the #1 reason this is NOT just a personal choice where people can "choose where they stand". The more people allow infections to spread the more they mutate, and the worse it is for everyone. Then the vaccines may not work, and people isolate or practice caution end up doing so for naught while others simply become plague rats who selfishly do as they please. And that never changes.

So yeah, I have a BIG problem with people trying to turn this into yet another "reopen" propaganda campaign started by oligarchs pushing top-down concerns onto frontline employees just for the sake of company bottom line and personal profits.

 

[Corby78]

Oh for f***'s sake, you need to argue with "shortage"?

View attachment 394727

Problem?

Who is arguing? I was just saying we knew this was coming with vaccines. It’s not like we thought we would have 400 million day one. The suppliers said it would time. Relax, the week is half way over.

 

[g00n]

Who is arguing? I was just saying we knew this was coming with vaccines. It’s not like we thought we would have 400 million day one. The suppliers said it would time. Relax, the week is half way over.

Now you want to quibble about the definition of "argue". And next possibly "quibble".

lol

Your statement is totally false. First it was 100 million doses in December:

Trump vowed 100M COVID vaccine doses by end of 2020—only 2.1M have been administered

Then the Trump Administration said 35-40 million doses just in December. Then 20 million. And in actuality it was less than 5 million.

Goldman Sachs predicts how quickly coronavirus vaccines will be rolled out worldwide

Not even close. Then they scaled down to 20 million and STILL missed the mark BADLY:


America’s messy Covid-19 vaccine rollout, explained

Then the admin said they would release reserves and....there weren't any. Plus there are millions of doses unaccounted for.

In my county we have full capacity to begin widespread vaccination but have received only a few thousand doses, less than 10% of what we should have by now.

And as the new administration has tried to correct course and reassess they've realized we're not headed for "substantially back to normal" until MAYBE the Fall, not end of Spring as originally forecasted.

This is a huge BOTCH that has to be fixed, so yes it is a "shortage" and if you disagree you are "arguing".

 

[Corby78]

Now you want to quibble about the definition of "argue". And next possibly "quibble".

lol

Your statement is totally false. First it was 100 million doses in December:

Trump vowed 100M COVID vaccine doses by end of 2020—only 2.1M have been administered

View attachment 394732


Then the Trump Administration said 35-40 million doses just in December. Then 20 million. And in actuality it was less than 5 million.

Goldman Sachs predicts how quickly coronavirus vaccines will be rolled out worldwide

View attachment 394729

Not even close. Then they scaled down to 20 million and STILL missed the mark BADLY:


America’s messy Covid-19 vaccine rollout, explained

View attachment 394731

Then the admin said they would release reserves and....there weren't any. Plus there are millions of doses unaccounted for.

In my county we have full capacity to begin widespread vaccination but have received only a few thousand doses, less than 10% of what we should have by now.

And as the new administration has tried to correct course and reassess they've realized we're not headed for "substantially back to normal" until MAYBE the Fall, not end of Spring as originally forecasted.

This is a huge BOTCH that has to be fixed, so yes it is a "shortage" and if you disagree you are "arguing".

As if trump was the definitive expert in how many vaccines there would be. We all know he was just saying whatever, “this vaccine is going to be hhhuuugggeee”. I have family members In the medical community in different states and they said it was pretty clear it was going to take a while. Even if phizer doesn’t hit the exact mark per month they said it would take time to get to everyone. I don’t understand why flipping out over something we knew was going to happen helps anyone. It only drives scared people farther over the edge. And just because I don’t agree with you doesn’t mean we’re arguing.

but getting back to hockey before this all gets deleted, if you feel the NHL is seriously putting lives at risk for no reason but money, then do your part and don’t support it. That’s your right to act on your opinion.

 

[g00n]

As if trump was the definitive expert in how many vaccines there would be. We all know he was just saying whatever, “this vaccine is going to be hhhuuugggeee”. I have family members In the medical community in different states and they said it was pretty clear it was going to take a while. Even if phizer doesn’t hit the exact mark per month they said it would take time to get to everyone. I don’t understand why flipping out over something we knew was going to happen helps anyone. It only drives scared people farther over the edge. And just because I don’t agree with you doesn’t mean we’re arguing.

but getting back to hockey before this all gets deleted, if you feel the NHL is seriously putting lives at risk for no reason but money, then do your part and don’t support it. That’s your right to act on your opinion.

Oh stop it.

Everyone is connected to the medical community because it's so large and pervasive.

Trump was speaking on behalf of the entire medical team and his Covid task force. If he was promising too much that's on him and it still flies in the face of your "we always knew this would take a long time" narrative. The goalposts were moved by him AND his experts, and the response has been botched.

Hence: shortage.

 

[Corby78]

Oh stop it.

Everyone is connected to the medical community because it's so large and pervasive.

Trump was speaking on behalf of the entire medical team and his Covid task force. If he was promising too much that's on him and it still flies in the face of your "we always knew this would take a long time" narrative. The goalposts were moved by him AND his experts, and the response has been botched.

Hence: shortage.

So is your issue with trump or the vaccine suppliers? Because if it’s with trump I agree with you, but he is now gone. If it’s with the suppliers I never dealt they were not honest about the process. This is a pandemic that we have never felt with, if you didn’t think “goalposts” would move as we went, I don’t know what to tell you. I don’t have any reason to believe the shots aren’t coming out as fast as possible, so to me there isn’t any reason to get upset over it.

 

[g00n]

So is your issue with trump or the vaccine suppliers? Because if it’s with trump I agree with you, but he is now gone. If it’s with the suppliers I never felt they were not honest about the process. This is a pandemic that we have never felt with, if you didn’t think “goalposts” would move as we went, I don’t know what to tell you. I don’t have any reason to believe the shots aren’t coming out as fast as possible, so to me there isn’t any reason to get upset over it.

The problem is both. There has never been adequate central leadership.

Why the COVID-19 Vaccine Rollout Is So Slow

Biden's team is trying to fix what Trump's people broke or neglected with the necessary infrastructure and true "warp speed" guidance and action, including implementing "war time" footing initiatives to get things moving.

On Day 2 Biden signed an executive order to allow the Defense Production Act's powers to push the process which led to new, more aggressive goals.

What is the Defense Production Act and what does it mean for Covid vaccines? - CNNPolitics


So if he could do that why couldn't Trump? Because he never wanted to....they even SAID their plan was to let people get sick and develop "herd immunity". Why do you think they were against masks and wanted to reopen everything so quickly???

Again, this is more about the top 1% protecting their financial assets, and THAT is how this ties back to issues with what the NHL seems to be doing. There is enough disinformation out there that people are being convinced by billionaires that risking the lives of their families and friends for the sake of increased billionaire profits is patriotism, at a time when the entire country should be working as ONE to stop this pandemic before mutations make things even worse.

I'm not sympathetic to super rich NHL owners who just want another TV deal or millionaire players who are 20somethings and lower risk (and less cautious in general). They don't set the tone for the rest of us on this.

(mods: if there is a problem with this maybe we can move it to the hibernating COVID thread...)