yep and a few others
with Claude
how many 30+ goals seasons has he had?
How many 100 pts seasons has he had?
when the answer is none at this point in time?
hall of greatness not very good
for me he is 425 pts away from even being in the discussion and 120 to 200 goals
needs atleast one back to back 30 goal season and 2 100 pts seasons to get in the discussion
hall is for greatness
not for the very good
Based on current performance, I say he doesn't come close. He would have to win a cup or two for sure, and a lot more points. To me he is similar to how I view Toews in the HOF. I don't see either with a pace similar to their current performance, getting into the Hall. For example: I love Zetterberg, but very likely he doesn't make it in, with less than 1000 pts and more than 1000 GP. Right now Giroux, Toews, and number of other really good players right now, will likely not make it in, unless the HOF standards go quite a bit down.
This is great, and winner of the thread!
Why are the bolded ones HOF locks? Toews has three cups, but is well under a 1000 points, and he seems to be trending downwards the past 1 or 2 seasons. Doughty hasn't done enough to be in HOF consideration yet. Even Kane and Keith aren't locks, as winning 3 Cups doesn't guarentee you a spot. In Keith's case there are number of really good defenceman who haven't made it in yet, so he could easily not make it. The only ones on your list who are guaranteed, are Crosby and Malkin. Price has to keep adding to his win totals and maybe add a cup or more hardware to get in.
He's not gonna make it lol
One cup win and 4 or 5 more 70+ point seasons
ok now it is clear you have no idea how the hall works, it's like you think they only take 2 guys every 10 years or something, you want to keep out the main core of a team that won 3 cups
Kane and Keith have multiple individual trophies so i have no idea why you would think they aren't getting in the hall, there is zero argument against them they are already better than most of the guys already in
Toews is the most loved guy by the media, he is getting in easily
I'll never understand the whole "most points scored over 5 years" narrative.
To me that's always come off as a detriment to arguments in favor of Giroux rather than a benefit, because people know they have to disingenuously omit games played in order to pass it off as if it was an accurate representation of his skill level compared to his peers at the time. It's why Giroux-adjusted-points are so funny, because it's telling that in order to make him appear better than the other stars of the time, you have to leave out crucial information that would tell a contradictory story.
If you knowingly have to fudge numbers to make your case for a player, you know you never really had one in the first place.
Get over yourself, thinking you are the only one who knows how it works. If Toews/Kane can hit 900+ points, plus their cups and awards, yeah they are locks to get in, but Turgeon for example has 1200 pts and he isn't in. There are lots of guys who aren't in, that maybe should be in, that have had similar and better careers than Toews/Kane.
Winning cups is not a guarantee to get in the Hall, otherwise Kris Draper would be in, he has 4. Neither Toews or Kane have won that many personal awards to be locks yet with 600-700 pts. Being a media darling as Toews is, is also not getting you in, on that alone.
The reason I said Zetterberg won't get in, is how many less than a 1000pt forwards get into the HOF? Not many at all.
Also want to add in, that Giroux has similar points in less GP than Toews.
Why would Stanley Cup wins help his cause? Everyone always says it's a team game, so players don't get any credit for winning them.
Not the Cup itself, but if Flyers win the SC while Giroux is MVP and wins the Conn Smythe? Then suddenly there's a legit discussion + couple of elite seasons with around 80 pts. There's still a chance for Giroux. He's not even 30 years old. It's nothing unusual to see that older players (30+) are able to play on elite level for multiple years.
Right. But usually those guys are still playing at an elite level *before* they turn 30 in order to keep that level of play up. Giroux hasn't played like an elite player for at least 2 seasons now.
So what do you think of Tavares PPG dropping for the last 3 years in a row as well as his points?
Will he continue to go down?
With regards to HoF chances, my view is the same on Tavares as it is on Giroux. They'd have to get in based on longevity and milestone career totals, rather than individual dominance because both guys have an empty trophy case that will get them in.
With regards to point totals as a whole, I think there's a better chance Tavares rebounds a bit (though I'm not sold he'll return to anywhere close to Art Ross contender) simply because he's two years younger and still smack dab in his prime, while Giroux is inching ever closer to outside those typical prime years in the mid to late 20s.
And that's fair to say.
Of course one could look at it a different way and say that both guys have seen their PPG go down the last 3 years straight. And since it's happening to Tavares at a younger age, it's even more surprising.
But if you go to the Tavares HHOF thread, way more different "tone" compared to this one.
Both guys need to rebound for multiple years to have a chance. Not sure it happens but this coming year is important for both.
That is a part of it, but it probably has even more to do with anti-Flyers bias causing Giroux to be treated like he's a bum playing on his last legs.I think that stems from, for whatever reason, HF still putting Tavares on a pedestal based on his hype coming out of junior and the player he was supposed to become (ie. almost Crosby/McDavid tier). Just my 2 cents, but it sometimes seems Tavares is ranked/rated based on what he *should have been* rather than what he's actually achieved.