Proposal: Buffalo and Rangers not involving Eichel

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UnleashRasmus

Rasmus has gone Super Saiyan VI!
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That's relatively close.

Buchnevich is a fine goal scorer, but he's not as refined offensively across the board. In the same breath Sam Reinhart is very underrated with forechecking and stick poking. He's still our second best forward IMO. This deal makes no sense at all. We're getting an upgrade on offense at the back with DeAngelo, but the Buffalo Sabres problem is TEAM DEFENSE. Nothing in this deal helps. I like Georgiev on his own. There isn't a deal I would move Cozens in that isn't for an upgrade over Staal. This is not that deal. Sorry.
 
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bernmeister

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Ignoring the value, it’s a bad fit for Buffalo. We have an abundance of RD. So sabres are trading their top prospect at a position of need, for an area where they are set.

I agree as originally presented OP is not the best fit.
Possible to save it w/tweaking-retweaking.

BUF needs to recognize Deangelo, the core piece, is better, WAY better D asset than anyone besides Dahlin.
So there are 2 logical forks in the road, if a deal is to be done at all, assuming both sides can live with what they are getting/giving up.

1. Sabes are intransigent and move on from one or more of their lesser RDs
and/or
2. A third team is brought in.
 

explore

I was wrong about Don Granato and TNT
Jun 28, 2011
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I agree as originally presented OP is not the best fit.
Possible to save it w/tweaking-retweaking.

BUF needs to recognize Deangelo, the core piece, is better, WAY better D asset than anyone besides Dahlin.
So there are 2 logical forks in the road, if a deal is to be done at all, assuming both sides can live with what they are getting/giving up.

1. Sabes are intransigent and move on from one or more of their lesser RDs
and/or
2. A third team is brought in.

Tony DeAngelo is a toxic, one-dimensional offensive defenseman who can't play defense and put up more than 30 points once in his career.

Buffalo already has Rasmus Ristolainen who consistently puts up 40+ points a year (four times, and on pace for five this past season) while playing subpar defense, and he's only one year older than DeAngelo.

Tony DeAngelo is not a valuable asset to the Sabres, and certainly not valuable enough to give up our top prospect.

Hawk your wares elsewhere.

The end.
 

krt88nc

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Oct 7, 2017
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We all know Buffalo is looking to surround Eichel with better players. Would Buffalo be interested in something like this?

Rangers trade
RD- Tony DeAngelo
RW- Pavel Buchnevich
G- Alexander Georgiev

to Buffalo for
C- Dylan Cozens
and Cap dump

I know Buffalo has lots of Defenseman but DeAngelo would be a huge upgrade. Georgiev would be the starter more then likely and Buchnevich gives them another top 6 forward. Thoughts???


SO the Sabres are collecting about 11 million in players this season and give up almost nothing?

Are the Rangers dumping salary here? and do the Sabres not have to follow the cap?

And how does this help the Rangers?

I'm completely confused and I am not thrilled to trade our top prospect for guys on 1 and 2 year deals.
 

bernmeister

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Tony DeAngelo is a toxic, one-dimensional offensive defenseman who can't play defense and put up more than 30 points once in his career.

Buffalo already has Rasmus Ristolainen who consistently puts up 40+ points a year while playing subpar defense, and he's only one year older than DeAngelo.

Tony DeAngelo is not a valuable asset to the Sabres, and certainly not valuable enough to give up our top prospect.

Hawk your wares elsewhere.

The end.

Setting aside any other aspect of this post, Risto is far removed from his 8OA, to quote Don McLean, "a long, long time ago".

RR earns kudos for clearing the crease and I expect still has a nice slapper from the point, but that is it.
HE is the poster boy for defensive insufficiencies, and his horrendous +/- objectively confirms this, to at least some extent.
 

UnleashRasmus

Rasmus has gone Super Saiyan VI!
Apr 15, 2012
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Nashville Tennessee
Tony DeAngelo is a toxic, one-dimensional offensive defenseman who can't play defense and put up more than 30 points once in his career.

Buffalo already has Rasmus Ristolainen who consistently puts up 40+ points a year (four times, and on pace for five this past season) while playing subpar defense, and he's only one year older than DeAngelo.

Tony DeAngelo is not a valuable asset to the Sabres, and certainly not valuable enough to give up our top prospect.

Hawk your wares elsewhere.

The end.

Rasmus Ristolainen, NEEDS to be traded. I'm sorry, he's one dimensional as well. His brand of defense is so flawed, and we've never once put in a concerted effort to find someone to cover up his warts. Which are so blatantly obvious. The only two defensemen on the current roster that are worth protecting are Rasmus Dahlin and Henri Jokiharju. Everyone else, can be had.
 
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krt88nc

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WTF

Cozens is going nowhere...he’s untouchable

Buffalo already has 10,000 RD and Dahlin will p,ay 1st PP ..ADA wouldn’t so his value ducks if he isn’t a PP1guy

At RW buffalo has a Reinhart, Thomoson, and they drafted Quinn..all you get than Buch

Then there is the cap....

Buffalo after RFAs are signed might have $1.5M in space.


sorry have to laugh at the untouchable part. The Sabres would trade him if it made sense. This does not.
 

explore

I was wrong about Don Granato and TNT
Jun 28, 2011
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Setting aside any other aspect of this post, Risto is far removed from his 8OA, to quote Don McLean, "a long, long time ago".

RR earns kudos for clearing the crease and I expect still has a nice slapper from the point, but that is it.
HE is the poster boy for defensive insufficiencies, and his horrendous +/- objectively confirms this, to at least some extent.

lmao how does this change the argument that Tony DeAngelo is the last type of player and especially character a team like the Sabres need?

The Sabres have too many right-shot defenseman, and they aren't going to give up valuable assets for Tony DeAngelo.

Tony DeAngelo does not fill a need for the Sabres.

Tony DeAngelo has a history of toxic behavior and a team like the Sabres can't afford to add someone like him to the locker room.

Rangers fans need to do the Sabres a favor and keep Tony DeAngelo.
 

Mikachu93

Formerly MacTruck
Aug 1, 2010
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Disaster trade for Buffalo unless the dumps are Hutton, Okposo and Skinner.

You can get really good players for 3rd and 4th round picks why would we spend our third most valuable player for a goalie, a rhd that would be outside of the lineup and a winger that would't make it into our top 6?

We'd lose better players because of the cap trouble this would cause us as well if you don't take the absurd trio of cap dumps...

Buffalo needs: defensive specialists (lhd, 4C) and a goalie.

This is hilarious. Tony DeAngelo would have been second in points on the Sabres last season and Buchnevich 3rd. Both would have had more goals than everyone except Reinhart and Olofsson.

Regardless of that fact, neither side does this trade.
 

pld459666

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lmao how does this change the argument that Tony DeAngelo is the last type of player and especially character a team like the Sabres need?

The Sabres have too many right-shot defenseman, and they aren't going to give up valuable assets for Tony DeAngelo.

Tony DeAngelo does not fill a need for the Sabres.

Tony DeAngelo has a history of toxic behavior and a team like the Sabres can't afford to add someone like him to the locker room.

Rangers fans need to do the Sabres a favor and keep Tony DeAngelo.

So, a player that the whole NYR clubhouse loves, that would go through a brick wall for any one of his teammates is not welcome?

That's an odd and un-informed take.

Pray tell what history are you referring to in the last 4 years that make Tony a Toxic person?

Please enlighten the less informed such as myself?
 

explore

I was wrong about Don Granato and TNT
Jun 28, 2011
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So, a player that the whole NYR clubhouse loves, that would go through a brick wall for any one of his teammates is not welcome?

That's an odd and un-informed take.

Pray tell what history are you referring to in the last 4 years that make Tony a Toxic person?

Please enlighten the less informed such as myself?

Disciplinary issues[Tony DeAngelo - Wikipedia]

DeAngelo has been involved in several incidents related to his personal conduct on the ice. In February 2014, DeAngelo was suspended eight games for violating the OHL's harassment, abuse and diversity policy after using a slur against his own teammate. [24]

Additionally, the article which confirmed the suspension mentioned this was the second time DeAngelo had been suspended by the OHL for violating the harassment, abuse and diversity policy, though it did not detail the first incident. In November of the same year, DeAngelo was suspended one game for abuse of officials. [25]

While playing for the Arizona Coyotes of the NHL during the 2016-17 season, DeAngelo was again suspended for abuse of officials (though this time for three games). [26]

He's also 24 and he's been traded three times in his career already and he has exactly one season of putting up more than 30 points in a season.

If he was as integral to the Rangers as Rangers fans try to convince everyone he is, he wouldn't be in every trade proposal by Rangers fans trying to dump him on another team.

Do. Not. Want.
 

TGWL

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Tony DeAngelo is a toxic, one-dimensional offensive defenseman who can't play defense and put up more than 30 points once in his career.

Buffalo already has Rasmus Ristolainen who consistently puts up 40+ points a year (four times, and on pace for five this past season) while playing subpar defense, and he's only one year older than DeAngelo.

Tony DeAngelo is not a valuable asset to the Sabres, and certainly not valuable enough to give up our top prospect.

Hawk your wares elsewhere.

The end.
So let's give Ristolainen the "on pace" bonus, while ignoring DeAngelo's on pace 2018-2019 season. At least then you can continue talking about, "Once".
 
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explore

I was wrong about Don Granato and TNT
Jun 28, 2011
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So let's give Ristolainen the "on pace" bonus, while ignoring DeAngelo's on pace 2018-2019 season. At least then you can continue talking about, "Once".

How does that change the fact that DeAngelo has exactly one season of putting up more than 30 points at 24 years old, while Ristolainen has 4 confirmed seasons of 40 points at 25 years old?'

I don't get why this is so hard for Rangers fans to grasp:

Tony DeAngelo is a one-dimensional offensive defenseman who can't play defense, the Sabres already have that.

Tony DeAngelo has a confirmed history of toxic behavior, and a young team like the Sabres who's GM has openly said they were looking for "character guys" to surround the young talent with aren't going to want someone like Tony "Will run through a wall for a teammate, while screaming racist/homophobic slurs at teammates and officials" DeAngelo

He's had exactly one good season in his career.

The Sabres have too many RD and Tony DeAngelo is not worth trading our best prospect for. He's not worth trading for on the Sabres at all. It's as poor a fit as you can get.
 
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TGWL

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How does that change the fact that DeAngelo has exactly one season of putting up more than 30 points at 24 years old, while Ristolainen has 4 confirmed seasons of 40 points at 25 years old?'

I don't get why this is so hard for Rangers fans to grasp:

Tony DeAngelo is a one-dimensional offensive defenseman who can't play defense, the Sabres already have that.

Tony DeAngelo has a confirmed history of toxic behavior, and a young team like the Sabres who's GM has openly said they were looking for "character guys" to surround the young talent with aren't going to want someone like Tony "Will run through a wall for a teammate, while screaming racist/homophobic slurs at teammates and officials" DeAngelo

He's had exactly one good season in his career.

The Sabres have too many RD and Tony DeAngelo is not worth trading our best prospect for. He's not worth trading for on the Sabres at all. It's as poor a fit as you can get.


That's all fantastic. All I did was point out how you casually added in the on pace bonus for 1 player, while coming at a hard once for another player. So no need to lump me in with what you think our fanbase can't grasps... I honestly couldn't care less if you don't want DeAngelo. I am not trying to pawn him off to Buffalo. This deal is bad. But like I originally stated, it's bad for both teams.
 

broc

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Dec 20, 2010
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Setting aside any other aspect of this post, Risto is far removed from his 8OA, to quote Don McLean, "a long, long time ago".

dude I just read a post of yours not too long ago where you mention how Ryan Strome was a high pick way back when.. while you were trying to sell him in one of your offers. Hypocrite much? Lol
 

Asymmetric Solution

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Cool. Then trade us Lafreniere for Miller or Montour, Thompson, and 6K Luukkonen. Btw, Laf has exactly zero NHL games played.

Oh wait. You’re gonna quote this and say Laf is worth more than that return. Fun fact: Sabres feel that same way about Cozens, despite his zero games of NHL experience.

They said Laf was worth more than Eichel in the Eichel thread. Funny.
 
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MarkusKetterer

Shoulda got one game in
Except this isn't apples to apples and you know that. Cozens is a top prospect for sure, I think he'll be a really good player at least, but he's much more of an unknown, so lets not pretend they have anywhere close to the same value. You're better than that.

Both are unknowns, seeing neither has played at the NHL level yet. However my point was that neither player is being traded because they’re each teams top prospect.
 

smoneil

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How does that change the fact that DeAngelo has exactly one season of putting up more than 30 points at 24 years old, while Ristolainen has 4 confirmed seasons of 40 points at 25 years old?'

I don't get why this is so hard for Rangers fans to grasp:

Tony DeAngelo is a one-dimensional offensive defenseman who can't play defense, the Sabres already have that.

Tony DeAngelo has a confirmed history of toxic behavior, and a young team like the Sabres who's GM has openly said they were looking for "character guys" to surround the young talent with aren't going to want someone like Tony "Will run through a wall for a teammate, while screaming racist/homophobic slurs at teammates and officials" DeAngelo

He's had exactly one good season in his career.

The Sabres have too many RD and Tony DeAngelo is not worth trading our best prospect for. He's not worth trading for on the Sabres at all. It's as poor a fit as you can get.


You can't beat the context drum and ignore the context you don't like. Yes, Risto got 40+ points 4 times. All four times, he played a largely complete season (82, 79, 78, and 73 games respectively). DeAngelo "only" put up 30 points two years ago--but he did it in 61 games. Last year, DeAngelo scored 53 points (8 points better than Risto's best season) in 68 games.

More context--goals tend to be valued more than assists. DeAngelo scored 15 goals last year--almost double Risto's career high.

More context-- All four times Risto put up 40+, he played WAY more minutes than he should have (25+ minutes per game in three of those seasons, 24:38 in another). DeAngelo? He played just over 19 minutes per game the last two years. So Risto put up 40 playing nearly 7 minutes more per game, and (as mentioned earlier) playing ~20 more games than DeAngelo's 30 point season two years ago. Color me impressed.

More context-- All four times Risto scored 40+, he seemingly didn't even TRY to play defense (-96 collectively over those four seasons. His best season before this year's -2, he was a -9. Those are his only two seasons that he was under double digits on +/-). I tend to think +/- only reveals anything in the context of how other players on the same team performed. Aside from his -9 outlier season, his other 40+ point seasons saw Risto with a team worst +/- twice, including a -21 (nobody else within 5) and a -41 (the next worse player "only" had a -22). His other 40+point season he was -25 with only two players worse. DeAngelo? He was a +12, while being stuck with Marc Staal all season. He was a +6 in his 30 point season. He used to be a miserable defensive player on the scale of Risto, but--and this is a key difference here--the Rangers' coach sent him down to the AHL and wouldn't trust him as a regular until he addressed that issue and at least tried to play passable defense. Risto never addressed his defensive issues. DeAngelo has.

Regarding your other "points"--I don't know how many years are considered "long enough" so that you aren't judged by what you did as a teenager, but mid-20s seems like more than enough time. He's been a model citizen on this team for several years now.

And as has been mentioned before by others, he was traded by Arizona because the Rangers targeted him and offered their mid-20s 1B center and a top young goalie to get him (and a 1st). The reason people are looking to trade him now is that Rangers fans don't want to be in a Tampa Bay situation. The Rangers are committed to Trouba, they have Fox in the fold already, and both Nils Lundkvist and Schneider near the top of our prospect pool for RD. Better to move a "final RFA contract" player at a position of absurd depth for a player on an ELC. Otherwise we'll be setting ourselves up for an offer sheet on Laf when he comes up for a second contract. If the salary cap weren't a thing, you wouldn't see a single Rangers fan trying to move DeAngelo.

That doesn't mean Buffalo fans need to want to trade for him, but you should at least refrain from this "ONLY 30 POINTS ONCE HUR DUR" nonsense. DeAngelo is at least a full tier better than Risto as a player. Putting up 40 points a few times because your team is incompetent and plays you 25+ minutes a game isn't exactly a point of pride.
 

Asymmetric Solution

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As far as from the marketing side, he is more valuable to the Rags than Eichel. On ice tho, they’re not even close (unless Laf becomes Draisatl 2.0) then they have a claim.
Eichel moving to NYR would have a far greater marketing impact than AL. Maybe the day or the lottery and draft day are great boons. But Eichel in NYC becomes a Hank like figure to NYC sports
 

smoneil

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Eichel moving to NYR would have a far greater marketing impact than AL. Maybe the day or the lottery and draft day are great boons. But Eichel in NYC becomes a Hank like figure to NYC sports

It's tough to say. As a franchise, the Rangers have done that before. Panarin, Jagr, Gretzky, Bure, Lindros, etc etc. Those players have all been a bit older (or a LOT older in some cases) than Eichel, but "importing a star" to NY just isn't the same as developing one. They've never had a top 3 pick until the last two years. It's novel.
 

pld459666

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He's also 24 and he's been traded three times in his career already and he has exactly one season of putting up more than 30 points in a season.

If he was as integral to the Rangers as Rangers fans try to convince everyone he is, he wouldn't be in every trade proposal by Rangers fans trying to dump him on another team.

Do. Not. Want.

I don't want to trade him, personally. But I also understand that in any sport, you deal from a position of strength and RD is a deep position of strength for the NYR.

As for production, he had 30 points in 60 games his rookie season, pacing 40 in 82

Still not seeing what is making him a toxic person today. Unless of course you posit that no one can learn and grow from mistakes that have made when young and dumb.

Is that your position?
 
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bernmeister

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dude I just read a post of yours not too long ago where you mention how Ryan Strome was a high pick way back when.. while you were trying to sell him in one of your offers. Hypocrite much? Lol

Not at all.
2 dif players have evolved dif in their game over time; what a shock!

Strome was disappointment and fail until Rangers got him, then things STARTED to gel soon thereafter, and really blossomed with breadman.

Is Strome dominant? Hell no.
But he has demonstrated he is solidly productive in a complementary role.
W/NY, that's Panarin.
If a team like FL, that could be Hoffman or similar.

Strome def makes mistakes, that is obvious but he is not the turnover machine that is Risto.

So no, no hypocrisy.
How disingenuous is your dig, btw?
 
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