Player Discussion Adam Larsson (Hall talk will result in a thread ban)

[McJadeddog]

Called him a Smid clone from the minute he got here. Smid was better

Yup, Smid was always the best comparison for Larsson. I don't know that Smid was better, I think they are still very close to be honest.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Still don't get the hate this guy gets. I guess people are still upset about "the thing that will result in a thread ban," but honestly Larsson is a solid shutdown guy. Useful, under appreciated player.

Define with any statistic, ANY, how Larsson is a "solid shutdown guy". Because he isn't.

The only thing he's good at shutting down is the Oilers possibility of winning games the last few seasons.

 

[StoveTopStauffer]

Probably too late for that.

There's always some GM in love with this optics if this type of player.

 

[LTIR]

Define with any statistic, ANY, how Larsson is a "solid shutdown guy". Because he isn't.

The only thing he's good at shutting down is the Oilers possibility of winning games the last few seasons.

Played top pairing minutes and unlike the other 2 pairings didn't shit the bed.
Back to back good games now yet keeps getting singled out.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Played top pairing minutes and unlike the other 2 pairings didn't **** the bed.
Back to back good games now yet keeps getting singled out.

A couple of games is certainly not reason to silence the concerns with Larssons play over the last few seasons. Nor is it reasonable to expect it would. Especially in context.

The reality is that Larsson will never be well liked by this fanbase in anycase and that aspect has nothing to do with him, its the Jimmy Carson dynamic.

A vet GM should have recognized that coming in and try to move Larsson immediately before it was too late.

This is a disaffected player playing in a foreign market that doesn't like him. That kind of dynamic is rarely positive or goes well.

 

[AddyTheWrath]

Kind of odd this thread gets brought back up when I actually think he’s been playing better than he has for a while (in the past few games).

I do feel like he gets unnecessarily singled out. Partly because of we paid to get him.

I agree he hasn’t been great since 16/17 but a lot of that has been due to poor circumstances (injury, personal, etc.) and he hasn’t really been able to find his footing again.

I would give him till the end of the season and then make a decision on him (unless there’s an unbelievable deal for him at the deadline). I’d sooner move Russell.

 

[ujju2]

A couple of games is certainly not reason to silence the concerns with Larssons play over the last few seasons. Nor is it reasonable to expect it would. Especially in context.

The reality is that Larsson will never be well liked by this fanbase in anycase and that aspect has nothing to do with him, its the Jimmy Carson dynamic.

A vet GM should have recognized that coming in and try to move Larsson immediately before it was too late.

This is a disaffected player playing in a foreign market that doesn't like him. That kind of dynamic is rarely positive or goes well.

Disagree. People liked him well enough in 2016-17. His play the past couple years has been below average, so the fans have somewhat turned on him. I think he's been playing well this year though. If he can continue to play well this season (and ideally if the team can have some success and make the playoffs) I think the fanbase will return to liking him.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Disagree. People liked him well enough in 2016-17. His play the past couple years has been below average, so the fans have somewhat turned on him. I think he's been playing well this year though. If he can continue to play well this season (and ideally if the team can have some success and make the playoffs) I think the fanbase will return to liking him.

its not going to happen. Really I've known few fans here at all that have a particular liking to Larsson. On the board its the pro swede or from Sweden crowd that largely sings this players praise and have from the start. I was talking about local affectation. You wouldn't find 3 Adam Larsson Jerseys on a typical night at Rogers. I haven't even seen his name on store racks.

Would be interesting if such details as tickets sold per player were known. Should actually be as agents could actually use that to substantiate player popularity and entertainment worth in any given market.

In anycase the fanbase here in 16-17 liked even Milan Lucic which reveals how fleeting that is.

 

[ujju2]

its not going to happen. Really I've known few fans here at all that have a particular liking to Larsson. On the board its the pro swede or from Sweden crowd that largely sings this players praise and have from the start. I was talking about local affectation. You wouldn't find 3 Adam Larsson Jerseys on a typical night at Rogers. I haven't even seen his name on store racks.

Would be interesting if such details as tickets sold per player were known. Should actually be as agents could actually use that to substantiate player popularity and entertainment worth in any given market.

In anycase the fanbase here in 16-17 liked even Milan Lucic which reveals how fleeting that is.

Probably because McDavid, Draisaitl, and Nuge play for this team? Also, Lucic was well-liked, yes. Because he played decently well that year. Which was my point about Larsson. But Looch was too old to get his game back once he declined. Larsson's game is coming back imo, so give him the season. He's been playing well.

 

[Oil Dood]

its not going to happen. Really I've known few fans here at all that have a particular liking to Larsson. On the board its the pro swede or from Sweden crowd that largely sings this players praise and have from the start. I was talking about local affectation. You wouldn't find 3 Adam Larsson Jerseys on a typical night at Rogers. I haven't even seen his name on store racks.

Would be interesting if such details as tickets sold per player were known. Should actually be as agents could actually use that to substantiate player popularity and entertainment worth in any given market.

In anycase the fanbase here in 16-17 liked even Milan Lucic which reveals how fleeting that is.

I would like Larsson a lot if he had Benning's contract. Right now he is not a 4 million a year defender

 

[Drivesaitl]

Probably because McDavid, Draisaitl, and Nuge play for this team? Also, Lucic was well-liked, yes. Because he played decently well that year. Which was my point about Larsson. But Looch was too old to get his game back once he declined. Larsson's game is coming back imo, so give him the season. He's been playing well.

My point is that at no point here in Edmonton did Larsson love really ever take off. The board might give the appearance of it at times in 16-17 but locally I doubt it was the case. Try to spot anybody in Edmonton wearing a Larsson Jersey at games or walking around town. I mean isn't that pretty much what defines a "well liked" player?

But in honesty I don't get Larssons game, and never have. Always been my opinion that "his game" owes an awful lot to Andy Greene, at least in the NHL sense. The Adam Larsson of prior to the NHL, is nowhere to be found. None of those scouting reports have panned out. Adam Larsson is offensively inept. Which is putting it kindly. On this club he's only offensively in league with Russell.

All of Bear, Klef, Nurse, Jones, Bouchard etc are miles better offensively than Larsson.

Larrson isn't quick. doesn't move or transition the puck well, doesn't read the game well, doesn't possess the puck well, doesn't have any semblance of a shot, isn't a shutdown D, isn't realistically even a top pair D at this point.

What does he do well? I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I really don't spot it.

 

[ujju2]

My point is that at no point here in Edmonton did Larsson love really ever take off. The board might give the appearance of it at times in 16-17 but locally I doubt it was the case. Try to spot anybody in Edmonton wearing a Larsson Jersey at games or walking around town. I mean isn't that pretty much what defines a "well liked" player?

But in honesty I don't get Larssons game, and never have. Always been my opinion that "his game" owes an awful lot to Andy Greene, at least in the NHL sense. The Adam Larsson of prior to the NHL, is nowhere to be found. None of those scouting reports have panned out. Adam Larsson is offensively inept. Which is putting it kindly. On this club he's only offensively in league with Russell.

All of Bear, Klef, Nurse, Jones, Bouchard etc are miles better offensively than Larsson.

Larrson isn't quick. doesn't move or transition the puck well, doesn't read the game well, doesn't possess the puck well, doesn't have any semblance of a shot, isn't a shutdown D, isn't realistically even a top pair D at this point.

What does he do well? I'm not trying to be sarcastic, I really don't spot it.

Well you don't think he's a shutdown D, I think he is. At his best he also has a pretty damn good outlet pass. Both of these factors have been missing for the past couple seasons, but I'm seeing again them this season.

 

[LaGu]

Define with any statistic, ANY, how Larsson is a "solid shutdown guy". Because he isn't.

The only thing he's good at shutting down is the Oilers possibility of winning games the last few seasons.

How about now?

I really don't get it, he broke a leg in the first game of the season, coming back he looked rusty but these last 3-5 games he has been good. Despite that posters are all over him more than usual... He could score a hattrick in the next game and he'd still be blamed for something.

This has nothing to do with acknowledging his struggles these last years by the way. It's about right now and at least for me seeing a player move in the right direction is good news despite the crap we're going through right now. Gives me hope that if we get out of this slump, we'll have a stronger right side.

 

[LaGu]

"Right now". He played good last night, that was his first good game this year. Outside of that he has been one of our worst defenders.

BS. He was good against LA and good against Minnesota. I'd say very good actually.

I mean it all depends on how you measure.

The last 5 games he's been buried vs tough competition and with defenisve zone starts and still has done a good job. What do you want more?

 

[Drivesaitl]

How about now?

I really don't get it, he broke a leg in the first game of the season, coming back he looked rusty but these last 3-5 games he has been good. Despite that posters are all over him more than usual... He could score a hattrick in the next game and he'd still be blamed for something.

This has nothing to do with acknowledging his struggles these last years by the way. It's about right now and at least for me seeing a player move in the right direction is good news despite the crap we're going through right now. Gives me hope that if we get out of this slump, we'll have a stronger right side.

Probably not a reasonably strong, or realistic point considering the player in question has scored 3 goals in the last two seasons combined.

One of the sad things is the team with Larsson out of the lineup with a broken leg was immeasurably better. I said at the time his absence wouldn't make a difference, wouldn't even be noticed, and the team would be fine without him. Turns out I was right. He doesn't even move the dial at this point. This can't be completely lost on Holland or Tippett.

Really on a club that desperately needs capspace I think Larsson just gets packaged in a trade deadline deal or something if we're still kicking at that point. We have several good D prospects and Bear already moving the dial in the show. The reality is Larsson is not needed here and offers no intangibles here that are irreplaceable. He's imminently replaceable, which is sad considering this is not a great team.

 

[LaGu]

A couple of games is certainly not reason to silence the concerns with Larssons play over the last few seasons. Nor is it reasonable to expect it would. Especially in context.

The reality is that Larsson will never be well liked by this fanbase in anycase and that aspect has nothing to do with him, its the Jimmy Carson dynamic.

A vet GM should have recognized that coming in and try to move Larsson immediately before it was too late.

This is a disaffected player playing in a foreign market that doesn't like him. That kind of dynamic is rarely positive or goes well.

That's rich. A vet GM wouldn't be a vet GM if he reasoned like you in these last posts.

Fast, move out the player who on paper is the strongest RD just because ... fanbase don't like him.

 

[LaGu]

Probably not a reasonably strong, or realistic point considering the player in question has scored 3 goals in the last two seasons combined.

One of the sad things is the team with Larsson out of the lineup with a broken leg was immeasurably better. I said at the time his absence wouldn't make a difference, wouldn't even be noticed, and the team would be fine without him. Turns out I was right. He doesn't even move the dial at this point. This can't be completely lost on Holland or Tippett.

Really on a club that desperately needs capspace I think Larsson just gets packaged in a trade deadline deal or something if we're still kicking at that point. We have several good D prospects and Bear already moving the dial in the show. The reality is Larsson is not needed here and offers no intangibles here that are irreplaceable. He's imminently replaceable, which is sad considering this is not a great team.

We were lucky that two rookies managed to step up in Bear and Persson. If you cannot ackonwledge that I don't really know what say. Any reasonable poster should have worried about losing Larsson right away, and also really glad to see the team doing well with rookies really stepping up. This was and is good for the team.

But apparently this is a good moment to trash the player and the posters who were worried. Remember that we're supporting the same team here, I want what you want in the long run.

 

[LaGu]

One thing which I do find interesting, are people really seriously suggesting that the team would be better without him in the lineup these last games? I mean I've seen it posted a few times, but I was assuming in gest and/or frustration in general. He's been on against the toughest opposition, being delpoyed heavily in the D zone and playing big minutes.

Would a Persson instead of Larsson have removed the D breakdowns we've seen these last games? Especially since he was not even on the ice for most of them. How does that logic work?

 

[Drivesaitl]

We were lucky that two rookies managed to step up in Bear and Persson. If you cannot ackonwledge that I don't really know what to think about it. Any reasonable poster should have worried about losing Larsson right away, and also really glad to see the team doing well with rookies really stepping up. This was and is good for the team.

But apparently this is a good moment to trash the player and the posters who were worried. Remember that we're supporting the same team here, I want what you want in the long run.

So wait, my preposition that the team was better without Larsson, and any stat and the teams results bears this out, is "unreasonable" because you say so, while positing such as Larsson "could score 3 goals in one game" as response.

Really as Oilers fans we'd be happy if Larsson could even contribute any solid play for any appreciable amount of time before his game disappears again. That he could be so easily bettered by a Bear or a Persson should give you pause for thought. Not that I think much of anything about Persson. But Bear is for real. His play on the puck, confidence with it, offensive acumen is better than anything Larsson has EVER done in the NHL. The kid picked up the puck and running with it. Walking opponents one on one and getting scoring chances like a budding elite offensive D. Bear is a better transition D right now than I've ever seen Larsson be. In Bears damn rookie season he's hands down better at moving the puck.

Moving forward its reasonable to say that theres no room for Larssons cap or play. I said that earlier about Sekera being redundant cap use and the org saw it the same way. Larsson is redundant what with the D players and prospects we have. It just is the case. All of Bear, Klef, Nurse, Bouchard, Jones, Broberg are likely better. I don't think its unreasonable to feel that way.

We could disagree, which is fine.

As far as my point that theres little love for the player here, this does feature often, and prominently in pro sports. Players often inevitably struggle in markets that are not keen on said player. They usually get moved out. Its not a ridiculous point. Does Larsson ever look happy to you here? Adam Larsson plays his best apparently when he's not here, and playing in Europe.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Called him a Smid clone from the minute he got here. Smid was better

lol

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

while the rest of the team is getting caved-in at ES (Drai, Bear, Klefbom)... Larsson has managed to only be minus -1 in the last 4 games, while playing 21 minutes

he's not the problem

 

[Drivesaitl]

while the rest of the team is getting caved-in at ES (Drai, Bear, Klefbom)... Larsson has managed to only be minus -1 in the last 4 games, while playing 21 minutes

he's not the problem

For clarity this would be an example of a carefully selected sample. With its intended distortion. Because Adam Larsson was -6 in the 4 games prior to this 4 game sample and is -7 on the season.

But Larsson hasn't been scorched in the last 4 games so we should all forget he was burned to a crisp by Ottawa, one of the worst lineups in the league.

But heres the thing. It might not be be the most objective thing to highlight that a player that has struggled for his 3 last seasons is somehow much better now on the basis of an outlier 4 game sample.

That said if Larsson has stats like this for the next month I'll look at it. Right now it means very little.

 

[guymez]

BS. He was good against LA and good against Minnesota. I'd say very good actually.

I mean it all depends on how you measure.

The last 5 games he's been buried vs tough competition and with defenisve zone starts and still has done a good job. What do you want more?

I dont get why anyone would complain about Larsson's game recently. He has been one of the better Dmen the last few games.
The concern right now should be for Nurse and Bear.

Both have looked bad lately...that needs to change if this team is going to get back on track.

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

For clarity this would be an example of a carefully selected sample. With its intended distortion. Because Adam Larsson was -6 in the 4 games prior to this 4 game sample and is -7 on the season.

But Larsson hasn't been scorched in the last 4 games so we should all forget he was burned to a crisp by Ottawa, one of the worst lineups in the league.

But heres the thing. It might not be be the most objective thing to highlight that a player that has struggled for his 3 last seasons is somehow much better now on the basis of an outlier 4 game sample.

That said if Larsson has stats like this for the next month I'll look at it. Right now it means very little.

because he was coming back from a big injury....took some time to get up to NHL speed

he's been the best defender the past 2 games

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

while the rest of the team is getting caved-in at ES (Drai, Bear, Klefbom)... Larsson has managed to only be minus -1 in the last 4 games, while playing 21 minutes

he's not the problem

Don't let that get in the way of important measures like # of jerseys in the stands (one of the strangest things I've ever read). Larsson's holding his own adequately as the whole team has disintegrated in November and December. When a league top scorer like Draisaitl is sporting -4 in November and -9 in December, this is a reflection of a very average team regressing massively against the means. This is a team failing with goaltending regressing; defense corp slipping; and forwards including top guns lapsing back to cheating habits that in this team's out of body experience to start the season are now fully on display.

Conveniently pinning it one one player is simply denying what all the fancy stats and rolling eye observations reveal. I think there's a lot of confirmation bias involved. But harsh reality is not one player on this roster is immune to the substandard team play and results in November and December.