Prospect Info: #3 Overall Pick Discussion - Part 3

[ChicagoHockeyFan]

Been a while since the last Fiddy rant, I wonder if he OD’d after the last one

 

[Blue Liner]

I think my top 10 list would be something like
1. Hughes
2. Kakko
3. Byram
4. Turcotte
5. Pod
6. Newhook
7. Dach
8. York
9. Zegras
10. Caufield

You really like Newhook, eh?

 

[ChicagoHockeyFan]

You really like Newhook, eh?

Yeah I think he has one of the best blends of talent, speed, and a good IQ. I really think he can be a difference maker. I think he needs about 2 years in college and then maybe one in the AHL, then he can be a really good player

 

[TLEH]

Zegras reminds me a lot of Keller

 

[RememberTheRoar]

If a #1 D is more valuable than a #1 C, and if a #1 C is more valuable than a #1 RW then why is Byram not the consensus top pick if he’s a #1 D?

Either the rule of thumb that some cite has exceptions, or Byram isn’t a true #1 D.

I’m not taking sides here, just would like to hear the rationale behind all this.

Also, I’m walking home from a good happy hour, so feel free to dismiss this post as nonsense.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

If a #1 D is more valuable than a #1 C, and if a #1 C is more valuable than a #1 RW then why is Byram not the consensus top pick if he’s a #1 D?

Either the rule of thumb that some cite has exceptions, or Byram isn’t a true #1 D.

I’m not taking sides here, just would like to hear the rationale behind all this.

Also, I’m walking home from a good happy hour, so feel free to dismiss this post as nonsense.

Because nobody knows what the hell a bunch of eighteen year olds will end up being.

 

[crazyhawk]

If a #1 D is more valuable than a #1 C, and if a #1 C is more valuable than a #1 RW then why is Byram not the consensus top pick if he’s a #1 D?

Either the rule of thumb that some cite has exceptions, or Byram isn’t a true #1 D.

I’m not taking sides here, just would like to hear the rationale behind all this.

Also, I’m walking home from a good happy hour, so feel free to dismiss this post as nonsense.

Not all #1 D's or 1LC's are created equal ..

 

[Polar Bear]

If a #1 D is more valuable than a #1 C, and if a #1 C is more valuable than a #1 RW then why is Byram not the consensus top pick if he’s a #1 D?

Either the rule of thumb that some cite has exceptions, or Byram isn’t a true #1 D.

I’m not taking sides here, just would like to hear the rationale behind all this.

Also, I’m walking home from a good happy hour, so feel free to dismiss this post as nonsense.

Every situation is nuanced. In this case, Kakko/Hughes are far superior in their potential as a number 1 than Byram is, even if he manages to be a number 1 d-man. As the other poster wrote, not all number 1 centers, wingers, and d-men are created equal.

 

[Patagonia]

AVs fan reading your Board to understand where our 4th could land. Forget about Hughes/Kakko, they staying at the Top 2 picks.

We seem to be leaning on the same players and not here to convince on which player is better as we also seem to be split.

Here is my take:

• Turcotte - Strong defensively and elite skater/passer. Fits the speed game. Due to a serious injury which has since recovered, he's returned strong. Might be the best C after Hughes. Hawks might be interested since he is from Illinois. Comparable: Ryan O'Reilly.
• Byram - Nothing is elite, but does everything well and possible 1D. LHD with size that is great in transitioning passes to improve the Forwards. As many on this thread commented, good DMen are difficult to find or trade. Easily the best DMan in a draft loaded with Forwards. Interestingly, he scored more than Dach which plays Forward. Comparable: Doughty
• Cozens - Solid bigger forward, great shot with good skating. IQ and skating are good, but not elite. Decent defensively. Can play both 1C or RW, but likely a better fit on the Wing. More of a shooter than passer. Rated 3rd, but likely 5th player selected. Comparable: Jeff Carter
• Podkolzin - Stay away. RW, this season, never played more than 16 games in multiple leagues or tourney. Elite all-around skills, besides the Hlinka Tourney never dominated anywhere. Struggling with the current IIHF tourney. He has the greatest upside, but consider him the most risky pick. Committed for another 2 years in Russia and afterwards ??? I expect him to fall to bottom Top 10.
• Dach - Size and passing. Extremely smart player, but was outscored by Byram which plays in the same league with similar team results. Some risk, but not Top 4. Comparable - Getzlaf

I believe either Turcotte or Byram are the choices for 3rd and 4th.

AVs and Hawks have similar strengths and needs. I personally would choose Turcotte due the lack of 2C depth, but Byram would be a deadly partner for Makar. So either choice would still make us happy.

 

[BK]

AVs fan reading your Board to understand where our 4th could land. Forget about Hughes/Kakko, they staying at the Top 2 picks.

We seem to be leaning on the same players and not here to convince on which player is better as we also seem to be split.

Here is my take:

• Turcotte - Strong defensively and elite skater/passer. Fits the speed game. Due to a serious injury which has since recovered, he's returned strong. Might be the best C after Hughes. Hawks might be interested since he is from Illinois. Comparable: Ryan O'Reilly.
• Byram - Nothing is elite, but does everything well and possible 1D. LHD with size that is great in transitioning passes to improve the Forwards. As many on this thread commented, good DMen are difficult to find or trade. Easily the best DMan in a draft loaded with Forwards. Interestingly, he scored more than Dach which plays Forward. Comparable: Doughty
• Cozens - Solid bigger forward, great shot with good skating. IQ and skating are good, but not elite. Decent defensively. Can play both 1C or RW, but likely a better fit on the Wing. More of a shooter than passer. Rated 3rd, but likely 5th player selected. Comparable: Jeff Carter
• Podkolzin - Stay away. This season, never played more than 16 games in any league or tourney. Elite all-around skills, besides the Hlinka Tourney never dominated anywhere. Struggling with the current IIHF tourney. He has the greatest upside, but consider him the most risky pick. Committed for another 2 years in Russia and afterwards ??? I expect him to fall to bottom Top 10.
• Dach - Size and passing. Extremely smart player, but was outscored by Byram which plays in the same league with similar team results. Some risk, but not Top 4. Comparable - Getzlaf

I believe either Turcotte or Byram are the choices for 3rd and 4th.

AVs and Hawks have similar strengths and needs. I personally would choose Turcotte due the lack of 2C depth, but Byram would be a deadly partner for Makar. So either choice would still make us happy.

I don't think saying Byram does nothing at an elite level is accurate. You are underrating his skating and his ability to think the game.

Also, you might want to look into Pods more and why the game numbers add up like they do.

 

[Patagonia]

I don't think saying Byram does nothing at an elite level is accurate. You are underrating his skating and his ability to think the game.

This is not to downgrade his abilities.

Just not at the same skating level which few are: QHughes (size), Makar (size/competition) or Heiskanen (skinny). He doesn't seem to have any weakness or elite skills. He has size, excels in a tough league, scores a ton of points and performs well under pressure in the playoffs and IIHF. Overall, he does everything well which is more important that being elite in 1 category.

I'm a strong believer that Byram should be the 3rd choice and fully expect Hawks picking him. AVs getting Turcotte.

 

[HawksDub89]

I read multiple scouting reports calling Byram an excellent or elite skater.

Has a great shot too, not Boqvist level, but really good.

He’s the real deal.

I’m incredibly torn on Turcotte vs Byram.

 

[pvr]

I’m still on the Turcotte/Byram train. If Kelley and the management deem someone like Zegras or Krebs a better choice, I’d go with their expertise. It’s also easy for me to say that who I’d be most disappointed with would be Cozens a bit more than Dach.

 

[CallMeShaft]

Bowman should just go up on stage at the draft and say "The Chicago Blackhawks are proud to select, Alex Turcotte...Bowen Byram, Kirby Dach, Dylan Cozens, Cole Caufield, Trevor Zegras, Peyton Krebs, and Matthew Boldy".

Sometimes when you want something in life, you just gotta stand up and fight for it. Don't let anyone tell you that you can't do something. Tell them to f*** off until they throw you outta the arena.

 

[Kevin Musto]

Bowman should just go up on stage at the draft and say "The Chicago Blackhawks are proud to select, Alex Turcotte...Bowen Byram, Kirby Dach, Dylan Cozens, Cole Caufield, Trevor Zegras, Peyton Krebs, and Matthew Boldy".

Has anyone tried this before? It's worth a shot...

 

[CallMeShaft]

Has anyone tried this before? It's worth a shot...

What's the worst that could happen?

He might as well try to draft Hughes and Kakko too. Hughes will be doing an interview, pretending to be happy he's going to New Jersey, when all of a sudden he hears his name being announced by Bowman, turns to look at the stage, let's out a giant grin, and starts running like a madman.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Has anyone tried this before? It's worth a shot...

Would be a generational move

 

[Kevin Musto]

Would be a generational move

"With the third overall pick the Chicago Blackhawks are proud to select, Dylan Strome."

 

[Toews2Bickell]

"With the third overall pick the Chicago Blackhawks are proud to select, Dylan Strome."

If we’re going back in time lets get Hayton too. Rumor has it the Hawks wanted him bad

 

[RememberTheRoar]

What's the worst that could happen?

He might as well try to draft Hughes and Kakko too. Hughes will be doing an interview, pretending to be happy he's going to New Jersey, when all of a sudden he hears his name being announced by Bowman, turns to look at the stage, let's out a giant grin, and starts running like a madman.

“One person chooses a gift. The next person can either choose a gift or steal that person's gift. If your gift gets stolen, then you can steal somebody else's gift or choose a new gift.”

Bowman should just steal Hughes from the Devils.

 

[x Tame Impala]

If you have the chance to get an excellent defenseman you’ve gotta take it

 

[RayP]

If you have the chance to get an excellent defenseman you’ve gotta take it

I mean you can literally say the same thing for a 1C, which he projects to be.

 

[x Tame Impala]

I mean you can literally say the same thing for a 1C, which he projects to be.

Fair. But with Toews and Strome, we’re much stronger at C than we our with our D core

 

[CallMeShaft]

View attachment 220429

“One person chooses a gift. The next person can either choose a gift or steal that person's gift. If your gift gets stolen, then you can steal somebody else's gift or choose a new gift.”

Bowman should just steal Hughes from the Devils.

Devils can keep Hughes. I want the iPod, easily the best gift.

 

[CallMeShaft]

Fair. But with Toews and Strome, we’re much stronger at C than we our with our D core

Yes and no. We are stronger right now at center. But in the future, when Toews is nearing the end, does anyone here think Strome is a top line center that can be part of a cup winner? There have been questions raised recently about if a team like Nashville can win with a top center like Johansson, who I see as a similar player to current day Strome (Strome can continue to improve, but that isn't a guarantee).

Our defense sucks right now, but we have a lot of future depth there. A guy like Byram might make an NHL squad next year, but will he be a legit player for us next year? How much better is an 18yo future stud in the NHL in comparison to a 24yo career 3rd pairing guy in Carl Dahlstrom (who also has a lot more pro experience)?

A lot of tough questions, but picking a player based on immediate need instead of looking at 3-5 years down the line might be a bit of a mistake IMO.