Prospect Info: #3 Overall Pick Discussion - Part 3

[ColdSteel2]

Fair. But with Toews and Strome, we’re much stronger at C than we our with our D core

Yeah, it would be difficult to give all 3 the ice time they deserve. When Pittsburgh stacked 3 centers, they used Malkin and Staal at wing at times to get them out there more often with their other top players.

I’d like to know if people prefer Turcotte to Strome and if so, would there be any interest in a trade of Strome for the No. 4 overall?

 

[CallMeShaft]

Yeah, it would be difficult to give all 3 the ice time they deserve. When Pittsburgh stacked 3 centers, they used Malkin and Staal at wing at times to get them out there more often with their other top players.

I’d like to know if people prefer Turcotte to Strome and if so, would there be any interest in a trade of Strome for the No. 4 overall?

I do prefer Turcotte, but we wouldn't get 4th overall for Strome.

 

[ColdSteel2]

I do prefer Turcotte, but we wouldn't get 4th overall for Strome.

What about Strome + one of the existing D prospects, would you do that?

This is tough. If we get Turcotte alone, we could easily end up with a ton of cap space tied up in centers. It’s not something teams generally try to do.

 

[Drumman44]

I’m incredibly torn on Turcotte vs Byram.

I just want both so bad

 

[Kevin Musto]

does anyone here think Strome is a top line center that can be part of a cup winner?

Yes.

 

[AmericanDream]

Yes and no. We are stronger right now at center. But in the future, when Toews is nearing the end, does anyone here think Strome is a top line center that can be part of a cup winner? There have been questions raised recently about if a team like Nashville can win with a top center like Johansson, who I see as a similar player to current day Strome (Strome can continue to improve, but that isn't a guarantee).

Our defense sucks right now, but we have a lot of future depth there. A guy like Byram might make an NHL squad next year, but will he be a legit player for us next year? How much better is an 18yo future stud in the NHL in comparison to a 24yo career 3rd pairing guy in Carl Dahlstrom (who also has a lot more pro experience)?

A lot of tough questions, but picking a player based on immediate need instead of looking at 3-5 years down the line might be a bit of a mistake IMO.

rephrase- does anyone else besides Musto feel Strome will be a #1C??

 

[Patagonia]

Yeah, it would be difficult to give all 3 the ice time they deserve. When Pittsburgh stacked 3 centers, they used Malkin and Staal at wing at times to get them out there more often with their other top players.

I’d like to know if people prefer Turcotte to Strome and if so, would there be any interest in a trade of Strome for the No. 4 overall?

AVs are looking at the same players Byram/Turcotte, so it's unlikely they'll move the pick. Strome is nowhere near Turcotte + Hawks best prospects are RHD which the AVs have as well.

Hawks and AVs are just bad trading partners with the same needs and prospects.

 

[CallMeShaft]

What about Strome + one of the existing D prospects, would you do that?

This is tough. If we get Turcotte alone, we could easily end up with a ton of cap space tied up in centers. It’s not something teams generally try to do.

Would I? Depends on the prospect. But that isn't going to happen for a multitude of reasons.

And unless Turcotte's freshman year in college ends early, he won't start his 3 year ELC until the 20-21 season. If that is the case, AT's first non ELC season would start up right after Toews' 10.5m per year contract ends (provided he can still play at that point, I'd love to keep Toews on as a 2C/3C, but he certainly wont command $10m a year at that point).

Yes.

Not you....

We all know how you feel about your boy.

 

[CallMeShaft]

rephrase- does anyone else besides Musto feel Strome will be a #1C??

The thing is, I do think Strome can be a 1C. Just a guy who is more in the 20-31 best centers in a given season, and not the level of center that Toews, Crosby, Bergeron, and Kopitar were during their cup runs.

Like I said, he's more Ryan Johansson right now, and to be a true cup contending center, playing the style he does, he needs to become a Getzlaf or Jumbo Joe type.

 

[ColdSteel2]

Would I? Depends on the prospect. But that isn't going to happen for a multitude of reasons.

And unless Turcotte's freshman year in college ends early, he won't start his 3 year ELC until the 20-21 season. If that is the case, AT's first non ELC season would start up right after Toews' 10.5m per year contract ends (provided he can still play at that point, I'd love to keep Toews on as a 2C/3C, but he certainly wont command $10m a year at that point).



Not you....

We all know how you feel about your boy.

I think the issue with this plan is what do we do if Toews doesn’t decline to a 2/3 C making 2/3 C money?

As for Strome, he looks pretty good to be a 1C offensively pretty soon. Nashville doesn’t have a C anywhere near Toews level to take the defensive role of a 1C. Seems like we have a pretty nice setup in place regardless of whether Toews declines or Strome doesn’t become an all around 1C.

 

[Kaners Bald Spot]

rephrase- does anyone else besides Musto feel Strome will be a #1C??

Offensively, absolutely. Defensively, not so much. Strome is interesting because he's offensively gifted but a complete defensive liability. I don't see how he can get much better in his own zone without improving his skating. He outperforms his xG% by a ton due to the offensive/defensive gap. If he starts to exceed 75 pts you can live with the defense. If he stays in the 50-60 range it gets iffy.

 

[Idionym]

I think Strome will be better than Ryan Johansen given that on the Hawks he was on pace to have a better season than Johansen has had in his career, and as a 21 year old. I think Strome ends up as a solid 1C. Not top 10 C but more like top 15, and on a bad year top 20.

I think next year will be very illuminating to see what type of player he is/can be.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Offensively, absolutely. Defensively, not so much. Strome is interesting because he's offensively gifted but a complete defensive liability. I don't see how he can get much better in his own zone without improving his skating. He outperforms his xG% by a ton due to the offensive/defensive gap. If he starts to exceed 75 pts you can live with the defense. If he stays in the 50-60 range it gets iffy.

Can we live with guys at the top of our forward rotation that’s aren’t defensively responsible if we supplement them with pretty much a full bottom-6 of defensive specialists?

It would load scoring onto a few guys, and they’d need to come through for you in key situations in order to win anything, but I don’t know what other option you’d have with Kane, Strome, and DeBrincat.

 

[AmericanDream]

The thing is, I do think Strome can be a 1C. Just a guy who is more in the 20-31 best centers in a given season, and not the level of center that Toews, Crosby, Bergeron, and Kopitar were during their cup runs.

Like I said, he's more Ryan Johansson right now, and to be a true cup contending center, playing the style he does, he needs to become a Getzlaf or Jumbo Joe type.

I would say his ceiling would be Matt Duchene level - a #1C at peak, but has his flaws and I think it is a short peak as well..he just isn't good enough in other areas to be a legit #1C or all around #1C, but damn glad to have him as a hopeful elite #2C....

 

[LordKOTL]

I think Strome will be better than Ryan Johansen given that on the Hawks he was on pace to have a better season than Johansen has had in his career, and as a 21 year old. I think Strome ends up as a solid 1C. Not top 10 C but more like top 15, and on a bad year top 20.

I think next year will be very illuminating to see what type of player he is/can be.

Yes and no. He is in a contract year next year and that can skew things. If he's not very good playing for a new paycheck we can close the book--if he can't bring it when playing for his paycheck that says a ton. If he is very good there's a chance he'll recede after he gets his paycheck.

In other words, if he plays like a $5M center next season, long term I'd be expecting $4-4.5M output.

 

[Kevin Musto]

Yes and no. He is in a contract year next year and that can skew things. If he's not very good playing for a new paycheck we can close the book--if he can't bring it when playing for his paycheck that says a ton. If he is very good there's a chance he'll recede after he gets his paycheck.

In other words, if he plays like a $5M center next season, long term I'd be expecting $4-4.5M output.

Strome isn't a Saad type player who hangs up the skates for the summer. He's like Kane who lives and breathes hockey all year round. Strome isn't going to all of a sudden start coasting by once he gets paid. He's been playing top level hockey almost his entirely life and never got paid bucks to do so. He plays well because he loves the game, not because he loves money.

 

[CallMeShaft]

I think the issue with this plan is what do we do if Toews doesn’t decline to a 2/3 C making 2/3 C money?

As for Strome, he looks pretty good to be a 1C offensively pretty soon. Nashville doesn’t have a C anywhere near Toews level to take the defensive role of a 1C. Seems like we have a pretty nice setup in place regardless of whether Toews declines or Strome doesn’t become an all around 1C.

Like I said, if we draft Turcotte, he will not likely play a single game for us next season (unless his college season ends early and he plays 10 games with us, burning an ELC year).

So assuming his first NHL season is the 20-21 season, when his ELC is over with, he'll need a new deal after Toews' current contract ends. And Toews, being in his mid-thirties at that point, will no longer be able to command $10m a year (even if he's still a good player at that point). He might get $6m(ish) a season to be a middle pairing center, but he won't get near as mush as he does now.

 

[clydesdale line]

rephrase- does anyone else besides Musto feel Strome will be a #1C??

Absolutely. Just moreso on the low end. Now if he gets stronger and continues to improve his skating....

 

[hawksrule]

Ideally Strome is a high end 2c.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Strome upside is huge because of how piss poor he was developed in arizona..

 

[dougd]

Ideally Strome is a high end 2c.

Tom Lysiak all over.
Lysiak, extremely smart, vision,not fast.
Strome slowly....sorry on the choice...gradually picked up the pace as the season went on.
Wasn't winning too many races but really looked like his adjustments put him into better positioning for successes that came.
Over the summer, if he can get a little better shot at strength conditioning, it will show even more.

 

[TLEH]

A lot of Strome's advanced stats predict a regression next year and my eye test alone shows a guy who really struggles to stop and start. In his own zone he can really get worked over by guys with good edge work. I see him as a 2C that needs to be sheltered a bit until he improves that area.

 

[Kevin Musto]

A lot of Strome's advanced stats predict a regression next year and my eye test alone shows a guy who really struggles to stop and start. In his own zone he can really get worked over by guys with good edge work. I see him as a 2C that needs to be sheltered a bit until he improves that area.

Advanced stats don't take generationism into account.

 

[TLEH]

Advanced stats don't take generationism into account.

Also true.

 

[Kevin Musto]

Also true.

We'll see what happens in the off season. Strome has really gained his confidence back and if he stays in Chicago and trains with DeBrincat, I think we'll see him in top shape next season.