Panarin to the Blackhawks!

[CallMeShaft]

Who cares if we can't re-sign the Bread Man after next season? We'll just trade him away for a huge return (ala the Saad deal).

For a guy who is yet to be in his prime and who's capable of being a PPG player, we could get another great top 6 player.

Better yet, we'll need someone who has top pairing potential to help replace Keith (who will eventually wear down). Trading Panarin's rights could get you this type of player.

These are good problems to have.

 

[JustABlackhawksFan]

I never complained about the lack of scoring in particular, I complained about him generally playing like **** through the bulk of the 3rd round and SCF.

Speaking to the bolded, my position regarding Kane has always been the same. He's a remarkable offensive talent and wonderful to watch, but if he's not putting up points (ie, creating offense) then he's not contributing anything. Players like Toews, Hossa, etc, they buffer themselves against criticism when their production goes through cold spells, because they contribute to and impact the games in other ways. Kane does not.

So when Kane was playing poorly in the Stanley Cup Playoffs (and again, it wasn't about point production - players can generate but be cold. Toews was in 2013, when he basically owned the puck and controlled the game every shift he was on the ice, he simply couldn't put it in the net to save his life. Kane wasn't generating anything, he was making dumb decisions with the puck and he was floating around his zone... which was a large part of the reason his line spent the bulk of their shifts trapped in their own zone).

He's not a particularly good or dedicated 2-way player, and as I said before, he doesn't need to be. He's on a team with plenty of them. He's here to put up points. That's his one job. He's very good at it. If he's not doing that one job, it's fair to criticize him more than the guys who have that job in addition to several others.

He was doing that job perfectly fine last year before he got injured (as he was leading the league in points), and he's been doing it fine so far this season.

He also was fine in the first round of playoffs (considering he just came back from injury), spectacular in the second round, pretty good in the later games of the third round, and yeah, not great in the fourth round, but he did score the last goal of the season, and it was a beauty.

You know what? It's hard to score points in the league these days. Stamkos, for instance, was worse than Kane in the SCF. Sometimes you're just not gonna have your best playoff series.... though Kane is a PPG playoff performer so it's a little odd to me to criticize him of all people for his playoff performance.

Also, it seems contradictory to me to say that you weren't complaining about lack of point production, and then say it's fair to criticize him for not doing his "one job" of scoring points.

 

[G0AT]

Did anyone hear Coach Q screaming "Bread man!" on the bench after Panarin scored? I died when I heard it, and now I've been spam texting the bread emoji to my dad whenever he scores.

 

[Sarava]

I never complained about the lack of scoring in particular, I complained about him generally playing like **** through the bulk of the 3rd round and SCF.

Speaking to the bolded, my position regarding Kane has always been the same. He's a remarkable offensive talent and wonderful to watch, but if he's not putting up points (ie, creating offense) then he's not contributing anything. Players like Toews, Hossa, etc, they buffer themselves against criticism when their production goes through cold spells, because they contribute to and impact the games in other ways. Kane does not.

So when Kane was playing poorly in the Stanley Cup Playoffs (and again, it wasn't about point production - players can generate but be cold. Toews was in 2013, when he basically owned the puck and controlled the game every shift he was on the ice, he simply couldn't put it in the net to save his life. Kane wasn't generating anything, he was making dumb decisions with the puck and he was floating around his zone... which was a large part of the reason his line spent the bulk of their shifts trapped in their own zone).

He's not a particularly good or dedicated 2-way player, and as I said before, he doesn't need to be. He's on a team with plenty of them. He's here to put up points. That's his one job. He's very good at it. If he's not doing that one job, it's fair to criticize him more than the guys who have that job in addition to several others.

It's impossible to bring it every game. We're talking about a player who is widely considered the most clutch player of this generation. Kane's game usually rises when the spotlight gets bright. But you have to be realistic too. There's no dynamic offensive talent in the world that meets the expectation you have placed on Patrick Kane.

 

[JaegerDice]

He was doing that job perfectly fine last year before he got injured (as he was leading the league in points), and he's been doing it fine so far this season.

He also was fine in the first round of playoffs (considering he just came back from injury), spectacular in the second round, pretty good in the later games of the third round, and yeah, not great in the fourth round, but he did score the last goal of the season, and it was a beauty.

You know what? It's hard to score points in the league these days. Stamkos, for instance, was worse than Kane in the SCF. Sometimes you're just not gonna have your best playoff series.... though Kane is a PPG playoff performer so it's a little odd to me to criticize him of all people for his playoff performance.

Also, it seems contradictory to me to say that you weren't complaining about lack of point production, and then say it's fair to criticize him for not doing his "one job" of scoring points.

No, there's a difference between putting up points and creating and generating. Kane's production will always be linked to his personal shooting percentage and on-ice shooting percentage, just as any other player. He can't control that, it will ebb and flow, get hot and cold, just like everybody else's.

But he wasn't generating or creating or doing much of anything through the bulk of the final two rounds of the playoffs. He had some big multi-point games at key times, no doubt. And thank god for that, but that doesn't entirely wipe the 8+ games or so of floating, bad decision making, etc. He was objectively playing like crap for long stretches, and the lack of points on his invisible nights was tied to that.

And I've never criticized Kane's playoff performance from a career-wide perspective. Simply his play through 2 rounds last year in particular.

Anyway, this is off-top for a thread about Panarin.

 

[Bubba88]

we got him for free... no assets needed.

Imagine THAT

 

[Kshahdoo]

we got him for free... no assets needed.

Imagine THAT

Yeah, like TBL got Johnson. I mean, it's a rare thing, but it happens. I'm sure there are some other brilliants in the KHL right now, because NHL teams don't scout the league that well.

 

[Bubba88]

Panarin wasn't an unknown Player. Remember that line with Tarasenko and Kuznetsov?

He was small and there was the russian factor 5 years ago... when he was 18 and in the Draft. Would you take a Chance on that undersized russian guy?

 

[Salvaged Ship]

People who moan about Stan need to look at this signing. He picked the Hawks over how many teams? The rep of the Hawks and the job Stan and co. did to impress this kid was huge.

 

[ClydeLee]

People who moan about Stan need to look at this signing. He picked the Hawks over how many teams? The rep of the Hawks and the job Stan and co. did to impress this kid was huge.

Don't you know all the successful moves are the work of Scotty's influence and this being due to his buddy Barry Smith.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Barry Smith could have had a big impact on this signing, tbh. But Panarin/TT are going nowhere. They'll clear out the space to resign these guys to long-term deals. Already listed two that are likely to go, Crow and Bick. Something about Panarin makes me think he's incredibly grateful to be a Chicago Blackhawk. He's really embracing the fanbase and the organization as a whole. Love his attitude about taking it to the next level in the NHL and learning from 88. The Panera Bread picture had me dying yesterday morning. I should be receiving his jersey this afternoon.

 

[Salvaged Ship]

Barry Smith could have had a big impact on this signing, tbh. But Panarin/TT are going nowhere. They'll clear out the space to resign these guys to long-term deals. Already listed two that are likely to go, Crow and Bick.

Agreed. If Darling continues his strong play this season it makes the most sense to move Crow. its not a shot against Crow, its just a logical solution to move a good chunk of cap space.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Right, has nothing to do with Crow. I love the guy. It will just be time to hand it off to Darling and clear up a ton of space. That said, it's two years away, unless the expansion draft is next summer. And the NMC doesn't apply to expansion drafts, which I really hope just to have that option.

 

[RobertR]

Btw, there was a rumour Panarin's linemates in KHL Dadonov and Shipachev also wanna go to NHL next year. They were doing wonders in KHL together.

P.S Breadman is such a lame nickname.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Btw, there was a rumour Panarin's linemates in KHL Dadonov and Shipachev also wanna go to NHL next year. They were doing wonders in KHL together.

P.S Breadman is such a lame nickname.

What the ****... *Breadman voice*

 

[bwana63]

Who cares if we can't re-sign the Bread Man after next season? We'll just trade him away for a huge return (ala the Saad deal).

For a guy who is yet to be in his prime and who's capable of being a PPG player, we could get another great top 6 player.

Better yet, we'll need someone who has top pairing potential to help replace Keith (who will eventually wear down). Trading Panarin's rights could get you this type of player.

These are good problems to have.

+infinity

These are great problems to have.

 

[zac]

When Kane was Teuvo's age this season he scored 88 points. TT will be lucky to break 50 and he's not exactly Toews, Bergeron, or Hossa on the other side of the puck. Not going to comment on the guy who's played 3 NHL games because who the hell knows, but I have extreme doubts he'll ever be a PPG playoff player like Kane.

It's not about points, it's about outscoring your opponents. In order to do that you need to score AND defend. Nobody questions Kane's ability to score, but everyone should question his defensive zone effort as well as his risk/versus reward instincts. The SH goal against last night was a prime example of Kane "being Kane". He tries some ******** flash maneuver along the boards, turns it over, and it ends up in a 2 on 1 and in the back of our net. He simply doesn't understand when to can the flash and when it's needed to make a high percentage play. TT hasn't even been here a year, yet it's apparent he has superior instincts to Kane. Three games might be premature but I've already seen enough from Panarin to suggest he's superior in this regard as well.

It's rather disgusting how overvalued players like Kane and Stamkos are in this league. It's not that they aren't great players, but many consistently rate them over two-way talents because they put up elite point production. Often that production comes at the expense of better defensive play and that routinely negates much of their contributions.

When Kane isn't scoring he he's basically a black hole. TT and likely Panarin? You can see their value in other areas on the ice.

I think both Kane and Toews are overpaid, but Toews' overall superiority makes his number palatable. Kane? He's a one-dimensional player who's paid like a two-way superstar. If it came down to keeping Kane at that number OR locking up both Panarin and TT to long term deals I'll take the latter every time. In a year's (if even that) time there's a great chance that both will individually be better overall players than Kane. Combined? It's not even close.

 

[zac]

Stan actually does a great job, but whatever u say man.... I bet if you were running the show we'd have won 4 Cups by now instead of 3, right? Panarin and TT better than Kane? Let Kane walk for anything more than 9.5mil? Shouldn't have resigned Seabrook? Thank the heavens you aren't a GM.

Kane's 2way game isn't even an issue anyways. He made a nice play to force a turnover and set up our 2nd goal yesterday. He's been all over the place.

He does a good job of retooling, but that's often necessitated from his previous Cap blunders. There wasn't much he could do about 2010, but since 2013 he's done a piss poor job. Bickell never should have been brought back, T+K extensions were ridiculous, he gave Crawford more money and years than any other team would have, he ****ed up with Leddy and he's wasted money on washed up players like Zus and Roszival.

When it comes to contracts Stan hit home runs on the 2 cap circumvention deals (kudos to that) and has made some very good trades (especially when we are trying to acquire guys). But outside of Hammer's deal, many of his contracts have been complete *********. Luckily he struck gold with Panarin and did well with the Richards deal last season. Much of the reason we were in those predicaments was because of his stupid and irresponsible spending.

 

[zac]

I never complained about the lack of scoring in particular, I complained about him generally playing like **** through the bulk of the 3rd round and SCF.

Speaking to the bolded, my position regarding Kane has always been the same. He's a remarkable offensive talent and wonderful to watch, but if he's not putting up points (ie, creating offense) then he's not contributing anything. Players like Toews, Hossa, etc, they buffer themselves against criticism when their production goes through cold spells, because they contribute to and impact the games in other ways. Kane does not.

So when Kane was playing poorly in the Stanley Cup Playoffs (and again, it wasn't about point production - players can generate but be cold. Toews was in 2013, when he basically owned the puck and controlled the game every shift he was on the ice, he simply couldn't put it in the net to save his life. Kane wasn't generating anything, he was making dumb decisions with the puck and he was floating around his zone... which was a large part of the reason his line spent the bulk of their shifts trapped in their own zone).

He's not a particularly good or dedicated 2-way player, and as I said before, he doesn't need to be. He's on a team with plenty of them. He's here to put up points. That's his one job. He's very good at it. If he's not doing that one job, it's fair to criticize him more than the guys who have that job in addition to several others.

This. To add to that, it's not unreasonable to expect Kane to pay attention in the defensive zone, stay on his man, and use his stick to create a lot more turnovers than he currently does. Nobody is expecting him to be physical or anything. All it requires is a FRACTION of effort and common sense. Something most of our team is willing to do.

If a player like Toews reaches 95-100% of what he's capable of then Kane is less than 80%. That's the gripe and that's what should be pissing more people off than it currently does. I'm sorry if I expect a 10.5 million dollar player to give two ***** in the d-zone. Shame on me.

 

[Marotte Marauder]

It's not about points, it's about outscoring your opponents. In order to do that you need to score AND defend. Nobody questions Kane's ability to score, but everyone should question his defensive zone effort as well as his risk/versus reward instincts. The SH goal against last night was a prime example of Kane "being Kane". He tries some ******** flash maneuver along the boards, turns it over, and it ends up in a 2 on 1 and in the back of our net. He simply doesn't understand when to can the flash and when it's needed to make a high percentage play. TT hasn't even been here a year, yet it's apparent he has superior instincts to Kane. Three games might be premature but I've already seen enough from Panarin to suggest he's superior in this regard as well.

It's rather disgusting how overvalued players like Kane and Stamkos are in this league. It's not that they aren't great players, but many consistently rate them over two-way talents because they put up elite point production. Often that production comes at the expense of better defensive play and that routinely negates much of their contributions.

When Kane isn't scoring he he's basically a black hole. TT and likely Panarin? You can see their value in other areas on the ice.

I think both Kane and Toews are overpaid, but Toews' overall superiority makes his number palatable. Kane? He's a one-dimensional player who's paid like a two-way superstar. If it came down to keeping Kane at that number OR locking up both Panarin and TT to long term deals I'll take the latter every time. In a year's (if even that) time there's a great chance that both will individually be better overall players than Kane. Combined? It's not even close.

This is a prime example of lack of hockey understanding...YOURS.

Up 4 zip, on PP, with a minute to go in the game is when you can do exactly whatever you want if you're #88.

I want the puck on his stick as much as possible and will trust his vision and instincts.

 

[CourtneyDagger50]

Excuse me, how the **** is one of Kane or Bread Man not one of the stars of the week in the NHL?!

RIGGED.

 

[zac]

This is a prime example of lack of hockey understanding...YOURS.

Up 4 zip, on PP, with a minute to go in the game is when you can do exactly whatever you want if you're #88.

I want the puck on his stick as much as possible and will trust his vision and instincts.

Actually this shows your lack of hockey understanding.

Kane does that **** ALL the time and that was just another in a long list of examples. The fact that this was late in an already determined outcome is rather irrelevant. Just because it didn't matter (this time) doesn't mean that he should be doing that. It just reinforces his inability to make those judgments.

 

[Marotte Marauder]

Actually this shows your lack of hockey understanding.

Kane does that **** ALL the time and that was just another in a long list of examples. The fact that this was late in an already determined outcome is rather irrelevant. Just because it didn't matter (this time) doesn't mean that he should be doing that. It just reinforces his inability to make those judgments.

You made it a prime example. It's not a prime example of anything.

Guys with his skill level are looking to make things happen, thankfully.

You've got Kane moving for TT and Panarin. Let's let the bright light of stardom shine on them a bit, then we'll see if their sphincter puckers up a bit. We know the big stage suits Kane juuuust fine.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Maybe when Kane wins the Art Ross (finally) this year people will stop *****ing about him. He's a top 3 player in the league right now, imo. Not many have his regular season/playoff track record over the past 3 years.

 

[SAADfather]

Bickell never should have been brought back

I'll have to try and find it at some point. But I do remeber reading that in 2013 Stan was close to a deal in the middle of the season on Bicks 2mil/2years and McD wanted to hold off until summer for more media attention over the summer months. No one would have had a problem with Bicks remaining on this team at 2x2. Regardless I would bet McD had alot to do with Bickell being brought back aswell. I'm sure he diddnt want a playoff hero walking in free agency.

, T+K extensions were ridiculous,

That was also with the impression that the cap was supposed to go up alot more than it did. Pretty ****** timing honestly.

Crawford more money and years than any other team would have

Uh what? Crawford is in a 3 way tie for the 8th highest paid goaltender in the league and makes only 250k more than leauge starting goaltender median. That was also coming off a Stanley Cup season where he got robbed of a Conn Smythe. That's really not bad. I have zero problem with Crawford getting paid like an average starting goaltender but I guess you're right in the fact that it could have been a year shorter though.

As a comparable:
MAF's hit is 250k less and one more year.
Lehtonen is 100k less and one less year
Cam Ward is 300k more and same length
Mike Smith is 333k less and same length
Jimmy ****ing Howard is 700k less and same length

I'll take Crow at his contract over all of the above. I don't know what you're basing this statement on...

he ****ed up with Leddy

There was just no way we were going to be able to afford Leddy and just about everyone knows that. Tell me how we would be able to afford Leddy's 5.5AAV right now? I mean we won the cup the year we traded him. Who would you have prefered we traded? Sharp? Maybe we don't win the cup if Sharp isn't a part of this team and Leddy is...