Marc Bergevin to meet with media before Vancouver game - 5:15pm EST

[Lafleurs Guy]

It's a good question that we will find out very soon.... our GM is on a very thin thread. I'm just happy he is on record saying he will not mortgage the future for short term success.

Okay but why are you supporting him? You seem to be the last person on this forum who still wants this guy around. Why?

 

[jaffy27]

So what? He is still with Tampa and never actually hit Free Agency. Meanwhile the Habs lost their best forward to Free Agency.

Your point isn't even a point, you're arguing for the sake of.

Yes, resigning with a team that drafted you who just so happens to be located in the south of Florida in a tax free state vs Montreal, a free agent signing from a guy who exiled to Russia after screwing over his original team twice, had no ties to Montreal the city has harsh snowy winters and is the highest tax state in the entire league....now that's an even playing field for comparison

 

[DAChampion]

Okay but why are you supporting him? You seem to be the last person on this forum who still wants this guy around. Why?

Bergevin has looks, charisma, and that can inspire loyalty in people.

 

[WeThreeKings]

BS! So Stamkos and Hedman were dumb and fell into Yzerman's brilliance eh. They both signed deals that they could of got way more on the open market and taxes had nothing to do with it eh. Accountants in Montreal or Toronto are not the same as accountants in Florida eh. The same investment strategies can't be taken advantage of in each and every city right? Wait, there is the Canadian Dollar and being paid in US dollars.. those players spend 100% of their clear take home money each and every year.

There are many factors but not are as big as taxes.

So, explain Pacioretty's contract?

Also, you're underestimating that some players value a team and a GM/coach that treats them right. They value someone who can build a team and set them up for success.

Brady could have made a lot more money than he did with the Patriots, yet almost every year he restructures his contract to help them compete.

Stamkos, Hedman, Kucherov, signed contracts because they are a competitive team that can win it all, and they are willing to work with a GM who is taking that saved money and investing it in players that can help them win.

You are looking everywhere for excuses. There's a thousand voices staring back at you, with facts, telling you that you're wrong and you refuse to see it because you simply don't want to accept that you hitched your wagon to the wrong star.

 

[Habs Halifax]

So now your argument is that it is entire the player, and the GM is essentiallly useless.

You still have suggested twice that Stamkos talking to other teams puts Yzerman in the same camp as Bergevin.

Keep digging.

Stamkos likely didn't want to leave Tampa but was talking to other teams to get a max deal... a max deal Yzerman did not want to give because he knows the advantage he has with taxes and also a very competitive team. Yzerman played that card very well and won in the end... he got Stamkos and Hedman on very good team friendly deals and Stamkos and Hedman are taking home clear pay that is likely higher than most teams can offer in other cities.

 

[jaffy27]

He also got a blue chip prospect D for a disgruntled winger.
Signed Kucherov to a steal of a contract. (probably the best deal in the NHL)

Yzerman did well there

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Bergevin has looks, charisma, and that can inspire loyalty in people.

So do I. But I'd expect to have my ass handed to me if I wrecked the team the way this guy did.

 

[jaffy27]

That is my criticism of that trade, which was also my opinion back then. Not only that, but I had huge reservation regarding MB being able to secure Radulov. Therefore, it came out to me as a desperation move from day one, especially if we factor in the ethnicity. Not what I want to see from management.

Trade vets before they decline, even if it means giving up on one or two good seasons from them. Sure. Give up on blue-chippers before they even play 10 games in the NHL, while being one of the most coveted position. Please don't.

Sergachev, for me, was either going to replace Markov (or even Subban), or could be use to acquire the center we sorely lack. Now, he truned out to do neither.

I loved Sergachev, was always a fan of his, was okay with the trade but it hurt losing him. Right now it looks bad, let's let it play out for a few seasons before declaring one a winner.

 

[Habs Halifax]

So, explain Pacioretty's contract?

Also, you're underestimating that some players value a team and a GM/coach that treats them right. They value someone who can build a team and set them up for success.

Brady could have made a lot more money than he did with the Patriots, yet almost every year he restructures his contract to help them compete.

Stamkos, Hedman, Kucherov, signed contracts because they are a competitive team that can win it all, and they are willing to work with a GM who is taking that saved money and investing it in players that can help them win.

You are looking everywhere for excuses. There's a thousand voices staring back at you, with facts, telling you that you're wrong and you refuse to see it because you simply don't want to accept that you hitched your wagon to the wrong star.

Patch is not elite like Stamkos and Hedman and was not as close to UFA as Stamkos and Hedman. Stamkos was a pending UFA and Hedman was one year away from UFA I believe. Patch was a RFA who was 2 years away from UFA and the Cap was much lower at that point in time.

Price and Subban contracts are over inflated and taxes are likely a factor. They told Bergevin that this is what it will take or else. Bergevin had 0 leverage. Bergevin did screw up the bridge deal with Subban though and he also screwed up Galchenyuk's 3 year deal IMO. Hate that deal

 

[groovejuice]

So what you're saying is the player controls his destiny.....like let's sayyyyyy, Radulov!

Good on Bergevin for allowing Radulov to speak freely....nope, haven't heard that comment once last summer.

And oh ya, Yzerman had a hard number for Stamkos....difference is Stamkos felt a loyalty to Tampa.....Radulov, not so much

Basically you're saying that Bergevin allowed Radulov to go to free agency, where he's no longer under the thumb of the Habs in any way. That was very magnanimous of Bergevin considering all his other options there.

 

[Tighthead]

BS! So Stamkos and Hedman were dumb and fell into Yzerman's brilliance eh. They both signed deals that they could of got way more on the open market and taxes had nothing to do with it eh. Accountants in Montreal or Toronto are not the same as accountants in Florida eh. The same investment strategies can't be taken advantage of in each and every city right? Wait, there is the Canadian Dollar and being paid in US dollars.. those players spend 100% of their clear take home money each and every year.

There are many factors but not are as big as taxes.

So you are saying you have a better knowledge and understanding of the tax issues than Allan Walsh, an active and prominently player agent?

 

[Puck Luck Run Amok]

So what you're saying is the player controls his destiny.....like let's sayyyyyy, Radulov!

Good on Bergevin for allowing Radulov to speak freely....nope, haven't heard that comment once last summer.

And oh ya, Yzerman had a hard number for Stamkos....difference is Stamkos felt a loyalty to Tampa.....Radulov, not so much

Keep ignoring my question Jaffy, keep making strawman arguments, keep showing your intellectual dishonesty buddy.

I loved Sergachev, was always a fan of his, was okay with the trade but it hurt losing him. Right now it looks bad, let's let it play out for a few seasons before declaring one a winner.

Really? Because you seemed to have a different opinion LITERALLY a few posts prior to this. O yea let's play out the logic behind trading your future #1 D man for a #2LW who is on pace for 45 points.

 

[isthatso]

I loved Sergachev, was always a fan of his, was okay with the trade but it hurt losing him. Right now it looks bad, let's let it play out for a few seasons before declaring one a winner.

I understand your point of view. In my opinion, if they both reach their full potential, we will still have the short end of that deal due to position. I also believe that Serg has more chances to reach his full potential, especially given the team he plays for.

But add that with Bergevin's habit of trading away or not resigning almost all of his PMD, him not being able to maximise the return on most of his assets and that makes me uneasy to still have him in charge.

 

[Habs Halifax]

So you are saying you have a better knowledge and understanding of the tax issues than Allan Walsh, an active and prominently player agent?

Nope, I'm saying taxes are known knowledge. It's fact, you can look it up and you don't need Allan Walsh to tweet about it. Accountants have the same skills in each and every city

 

[jaffy27]

Why isn't everyone signing in Tampa and Florida then? These tax excuses are BS. Allen Walsh even called out everyone using this excuse this summer because the tax issue is easy to get around to even the playing field.

Why didn't the Habs have to overpay Pacioretty and Gallagher because of taxes yet had to overpay Price?

It's not only a bull**** excuse, it's intellectually dishonest.

Because there's only two teams in Florida and 800 players in the league.....I can display the math for you if you'd like.

Why aren't players rushing to go play in Winnipeg? Why aren't marquee players rushing to sign in Edmonton?

Besides players that are already playing there, you rarely see this

 

[walsy37]

In the last 12 months, it's been an utter fail.....this is why I'M giving him one last chance at righting the ship right. If he fails at aquiring a #1 centre between now and the off season, it's cup or gone

You know you replied to me on the summer the same exact thing about cap space and the start of season....

 

[angry pirate]

A couple of things wrong here though.

1. Galchenyuk wasn't playing at centre in Sarnia. He was on the wing. So I'm not sure he develops as a centre in Sarnia if the lockout lasts the year since he wasn't playing centre.

2. 2014-2015 was not a good year. Standings wise it was, but that team played terrible for most of the year and were saved by Price's heroic performance. They barely looked like a playoff team and won the division. This is where the holes in the team became incredibly apparent and the team started its downward slope. On a team that couldnt score a goal, MB thought it was appropriate to get two buffalo rejects in Mitchell and Flynn at the deadline as help.

3. 2013-2014 Desharnais had 1 point in his first 19 games and the Habs still refused to try other options at centre and stuck with him no matter what. He ended up picking up the pace by season's end, but he was such a liability at centre and held the team back. If there was a time to put Galchenyuk at centre, it was those first 19 games. Circumstances didn't keep Galchenyuk on the wing, coaching staff and management did.

1. Was he though? I've saw this a few times today and I don't profess to have watched Galchenyuk in junior, but I recall that he was centering Yakupov at some point? Litterally every website from Sportsnet to NHL.com articles to thehockeywrites.com listed him as a center.

2. I don't disagree, but it's hard to sell a rebuild when you are winning the division. 2 division championships and a conference final in 3 years. Even if there are apparent holes, and there obviously was, the expectation is now skewed heavily towards winning instead of building.

3. Problem being again, move Galchenyuk off the wing and who replaces him. Team is trying to be competitive even though they should have been rebuilding. Not saying I agree, but given our roster makeup that season, and the mentality that we were competing, I understand the decision making. It was obviously short sighted thinking, but given the context that management believed in the team it's understandable.


Hindsight tells us this was a major mistake. Probably lots of posters here called it. It's likely fireable. But it doesn't change that fact that I believe Galchenyuk was drafted to be a center, and the team just got kind of distracted before it could happen. They were happy to use Galchenyuk as a goal scoring winger. Wasted some important years, and now we'll likely never know if it could have been or not.

 

[Tighthead]

Nope, I'm saying taxes are known knowledge. It's fact, you can look it up and you don't need Allan Walsh to tweet about it. Accountants have the same skills in each and every city

So people like you and I can look it up and have the same expertise as a tax professional?

You are saying Walsh is wrong and you know better right?

I’ll assume your argument is just based on effective tax rates as everyone knows those are just a starting point.

Two posts ago you said accountants are different in each city.

 

[nhlfan9191]

I loved Sergachev, was always a fan of his, was okay with the trade but it hurt losing him. Right now it looks bad, let's let it play out for a few seasons before declaring one a winner.

Even if Drouin puts up 60 points at some point on the wing, it’ll still look bad. Sergachev will hurt just as bad as McDonaugh.

 

[Roke]

Re: Walsh and taxes...



That's a pretty sweet tax deal for European players.

 

[jaffy27]

Even if Drouin puts up 60 points at some point on the wing, it’ll still look bad. Sergachev will hurt just as bad as McDonaugh.

Never that bad, let's be real here

 

[Habs Halifax]

So people like you and I can look it up and have the same expertise as a tax professional?

You are saying Walsh is wrong and you know better right?

I’ll assume your argument is just based on effective tax rates as everyone knows those are just a starting point.

Two things to consider. There are more but I will keep it simple for you.

1) Taxes differences between cities are known knowledge. Check out this site, it shows you the difference between cities ( Personal Income Tax Rates in NHL Cities | Gavin Group ). In Subban's case, he cleared an extra $1.3M annually playing with the Preds.

2) In the above case with Subban... Imagine how much more the Accountant can make Subban with a $1.3M annual advantage . The accountant in Montreal would have to be a genius to overcome this advantage

 

[nhlfan9191]

Never that bad, let's be real here

Drouin may not be close to Gomez, but even trading an elite defender for someone inferior is something that Habs fans know all to well. This would be the third time in less then a decade.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Never that bad, let's be real here

Drouin will hurt as bad as Gomez.... that is the comeback we get. What a joke! They are running out of excuses and it's getting hilarious.

 

[Tighthead]

Accountants in Montreal or Toronto are not the same as accountants in Florida eh.

Accountants have the same skills in each and every city