JVR-Bozak-Marner or JVR-Bozak-Brown ?

[ULF_55]

I am sticking with Bozak is culprit A. JVR B and finally Mitch C. When I reflect on his body of work there is no way that I can say his erroneous passes is the chief reason we get hemmed in our zone. Mitch is far to often the first man to get the puck and carrier it out. Bozak drfits and JVR takes up position in front of the net.

Except for the blatant goals against that Marner has been responsible for he's been fine defensively.

 

[The Apologist]

You know I hesitate to delve into this much detail (not saying you or anyone else shouldn't, always interesting to read about what others see) just because it's really hard to watch games on TV and actually notice everything that happens on the ice. Having said that, I think you're probably right about Marner, he's seemed off to me so far this season but mostly that's because of strange things he's done in the offensive zone. I'm also not too worried about him, not yet anyway. He has a rep for being avery smart player, hard not to think he won't figure things out eventually. I do look forward to the day he has different linemates though, I think he needs that to grow as a player.

This I agree with. Sometimes we forget how young he is. Marner has always been a great player, lots of heart and skill. I think he is struggling to find his role honestly. He tries to do it all but he really doesn't need to. I do believe management has asked him to do more this season and it may be throwing him off.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I don't think its necessarily directed at you but at everyone in general. We do tend to amplify the mistakes of those who we expect to falter while 'missing' the mistakes of others.

And I get that a lot as well, the name Kadri usually being involved. He is actually one of my favourites to ever wear the blue and white, but because I like Bozak too any criticism of Kadri at all gets me the 'you hate him' label.

I know how you feel on that score. I've been perhaps Kadri's biggest defender over the years and I've had the "Bozak hater" label pinned on me a number of times. That can be annoying when the fact is that I actually like Bozak and the fact that I've always seen Kadri as the better player doesn't change that one bit.

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

Is he getting any blame for something that's not deserved? People have said his line has sucked defensively, is that unfair? I'm not sure I've seen anyone say it's all his fault, it's definitely been a "team effort".

You're right about his reputation, that's also deserved. We've been watching the guy play for years, I think by now we all know what he is, both the good and the bad.

I think it's fair to say his line is having issues with defense, I think it's unfair to say the biggest problem is Bozak. He seems to be putting in more effort this year into playing defense.

I've watched all the games, well I missed part of the last one after that 5-3 I decided to watch something else. I just haven't seen Bozak playing in a way that justifies some of the comments about him.

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

I don't think its necessarily directed at you but at everyone in general. We do tend to amplify the mistakes of those who we expect to falter while 'missing' the mistakes of others.

And I get that a lot as well, the name Kadri usually being involved. He is actually one of my favourites to ever wear the blue and white, but because I like Bozak too any criticism of Kadri at all gets me the 'you hate him' label.

Yeah I've had that issue too, I like Kadri a lot it's some of his biggest supporters I've had issues with.

 

[Nithoniniel]

He seems to be putting in more effort this year into playing defense.

I don't think people have an issue with the effort. It's just that he's not very effective. He apparently ranks very low among forwards overall in how well he breaks up plays and how many puck battles he wins. If I remember correctly, his numbers for effective zone exits are what you expect from a fourth liner. He's quite good at managing the puck in the defensive zone, but his lines almost always struggle immensely in shot and chance metrics against.

Whereas with Marner it's a bit early to say anything, and JVR mainly just struggles with zone exits.

 

[The Apologist]

I know how you feel on that score. I've been perhaps Kadri's biggest defender over the years and I've had the "Bozak hater" label pinned on me a number of times. That can be annoying when the fact is that I actually like Bozak and the fact that I've always seen Kadri as the better player doesn't change that one bit.

Which is fair. I dont think there was ever much doubt as to who SHOULD be better. Naz is a gem.

 

[Drytoast]

Perfect time to scratch him and give Leivo a game or two ??

Maybe? He needs to know defense isn't optional...

 

[MJ65]

I am a big fan of Mitch but so far I am not happy with his decision making and his defensive effort, I know it's way too early in the season but you expect way better then what he has shown so far

 

[RLF]

This I agree with. Sometimes we forget how young he is. Marner has always been a great player, lots of heart and skill. I think he is struggling to find his role honestly. He tries to do it all but he really doesn't need to. I do believe management has asked him to do more this season and it may be throwing him off.

If he is trying to hard, I think it has to do more with trying to match what Matthews and Nylander have seemed to do. They have both seemed to be able to grasp both sides of the game, Matthews even more so imo. Maybe Marner wants to show he can be just as effective as they are and is trying too hard to be perfect and trying to anticipate too much which is getting himself running around..

 

[WTFMAN99]

Offensively he's been good, a touch of over passing. I think he's had the odd break down but I also think JVR-Bozak have been worse. JVR is scoring goals but he's been badddd defensively. Marner is having to do too much on the line for a sophomore.

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

I know how you feel on that score. I've been perhaps Kadri's biggest defender over the years and I've had the "Bozak hater" label pinned on me a number of times. That can be annoying when the fact is that I actually like Bozak and the fact that I've always seen Kadri as the better player doesn't change that one bit.

For what it's worth I wasn't suggesting you were a Bozak hater, Bozak like everyone deserves criticism when he plays bad. That being said I've seen people literally complain that Bozak didn't score a hat trick because he flubbed a pass. I mean sure he scored two goals but since he missed a pass a poster felt the need to just trash him in a PGT.

I'm not even that big of a fan of Bozak, I liked Kessel way more than Bozak back then. I just find he gets an undeserved amount of criticism for the role he plays.

 

[Critical13]

Marner hasn't been that bad defensively. It's hard to control the ice from the wing. Bozak is not a good defensive C. JvR might be the worst Leafs forward in terms of defensive coverage and backchecking.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Marner hasn't been that bad defensively. It's hard to control the ice from the wing. Bozak is not a good defensive C. JvR might be the worst Leafs forward in terms of defensive coverage and backchecking.

Yeah and let's be honest, we've seen this from JVR and Bozak for years. But yet they stay together - perhaps from lack of depth previously, but now?

 

[Lightsol]

I just find he gets an undeserved amount of criticism for the role he plays.

There's an easy pattern to follow when it comes to Leaf fans and blaming players; there are specific players that get blamed for practically everything wrong with the team (Bozak, Hyman, Phaneuf when he was here), and specific players that NEVER get blamed for anything (hello, Carl Gunnarsson!). Once you're in either group, you can never leave, no matter how you play for the rest of your Leafs career...

 

[ACC1224]

There's an easy pattern to follow when it comes to Leaf fans and blaming players; there are specific players that get blamed for practically everything wrong with the team (Bozak, Hyman, Phaneuf when he was here), and specific players that NEVER get blamed for anything (hello, Carl Gunnarsson!). Once you're in either group, you can never leave, no matter how you play for the rest of your Leafs career...

Shouldn't generalize, there are many that are in neither camp.

 

[LeafsBoyo]

What's disappointing to me is that he just seems to have completely lost that electricity that he played with early on last season. He was so damn noticeable - his play making, his speed, creativity, almost every shift we would see a flash of brilliance. I haven't seen it since.

https://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/...uston-matthews-tyler-bozak-james-van-riemsdyk

His first game was absolutely ridiculous, what happened?

 

[Polaris1010]

What's disappointing to me is that he just seems to have completely lost that electricity that he played with early on last season. He was so damn noticeable - his play making, his speed, creativity, almost every shift we would see a flash of brilliance. I haven't seen it since.

Are we talking about Marner?

My amateur arm chair qb guess is that Marner, is a perimeter player, who likes to carry the puck around and around and not going to the net, himself or the puck because he's too small to be effective in front of the net.

So he skates circles around looking for an open man. Since his linemates are getting up there in age, they are covered easily. Therefore, no where to go with the puck. Then the whole line gets trapped in their own zone. That tends to be a 5 on 5 shift for that line.

Looking dangerous, but not much develops, then the other team cycles the puck.

Randy Carlyle's advice to Nazeem Kadri, play a north south game, and not an east west game. By the time Kadri finally learned that, Randy Carlyle was gone again. Marner has to do the same. North south not east west.

Don't look for the perfect play unless your name is Matthews.

 

[ShaneFalco]

 

[GordieHoweHatTrick]

Still to early to worry about the efficacy of this line.

 

[Nithoniniel]

Still to early to worry about the efficacy of this line.

For sure. I mean, we know what kind of line that is. They need to be sheltered, they need to play with defenders that can really move the puck, but they can also really score. They have been that and done that.

 

[ACC1224]

Still to early to worry about the efficacy of this line.

They've played about 80 games together. I think most have a pretty good idea what this line brings.

 

[Critical13]

What's disappointing to me is that he just seems to have completely lost that electricity that he played with early on last season. He was so damn noticeable - his play making, his speed, creativity, almost every shift we would see a flash of brilliance. I haven't seen it since.

https://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/...uston-matthews-tyler-bozak-james-van-riemsdyk

His first game was absolutely ridiculous, what happened?

I disagree - I still see the electricity. He's on the 3rd best line though, and would really benefit from two linemates with more speed, and a possibly at least 1 puck hound. I would like to see Komarov - Kadri - Marner. Marleau can line up with Bozie and JVR.

 

[Mess]

Babcock can reduce this lines 5v5 ES time, in an effort to get them to focus more on their defense.

Its one of the tools a coach has to motivated players by using TOI/g as a tool for improvement.

 

[ULF_55]

Which is fair. I dont think there was ever much doubt as to who SHOULD be better. Naz is a gem.

Yep, he wasn't always the better player, but he always had the higher ceiling.

It is outrageous that some people don't believe he has improved dramatically since he had a course direction change.