Proposal: Buffalo Proposals for Hanifin (Merged)

[JCLA]

You have to be joking. In no way would Hanifin fetch a young #1C. If Carolina called up NJ asking for Nico, Shero would laugh Francis off the phone.

Hanifins on pace for .54 points per game which is 44 points in 82 games and is the #1 defensive Corsi player in the league with 20+ games played. The only defensive player with a meaningful number of games played with a higher corsi is Franson from Chicago who has played 18 games.

Seth jones when he was traded for Johansen? He had a career high of 27 points in 82 games and the following year was hurt and had 11 points in 40 games which is on pace for 23 points.

There is also only two defensive players higher than Hanifin in Fenwick who has played a meaningful amount of games, and that is Werenski and Franson

side note, all advanced stats are at even strength.

Stats prove a different tale.

And all I said is that is the only thing the Hurricanes are trading Hanifin for.

 

[StormCast]

If we value Kane at a mid-1st. I'd do Reinhart+mid 1st for Hanifin any day.

But when you look at cost and term control, there is a huge difference between a mid-1st and Kane even if he re-upped. Pass.

 

[72hockey guy]

Just curious why Hanifin is only averaging 18:05 min/game of ice time if he is playing really well this season?

That is only about 10 seconds more per game than his first two seasons in the league.

It is also interesting that his O-Zone starts have increased each season he has been in the league.

easy to answer with the defenders they have its prudent to bring along a young player slowly

they have enough quality that theres no need to rush him

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

But when you look at cost and term control, there is a huge difference between a mid-1st and Kane even if he re-upped. Pass.

Thanks captain obvious. That's what an elite rental is. Assumption here is that Carolina tries to seriously compete this year. If your management don't want to go for it, there is no deal to be made as Sam is not evne close in value to Hanifin.

 

[72hockey guy]

The Canes are being sold today. Not an issue, so no the canes don't need a bad deal to make the playoffs.

Hanifin for RoR without significant retention makes zero sense financially for the Canes.

this i strongly disagree with

you have several quality defenders, and you have zero #1 centers, ROR may be a low end 1C or more properly a quality 2C though slightly over compensated, but he improves your team immensely

I understand you value Hanifin, but dont be ridiculous you could go years and not develop a center as good as ROR

Thats asset management . what good is having 5 quality defenders if you cant score, you still miss the playoffs, the same can be said conversely, what good is having multiple quality centers if you cant stop anybody

 

[StormCast]

Thanks captain obvious. That's what an elite rental is. Assumption here is that Carolina tries to seriously compete this year. If your management don't want to go for it, there is no deal to be made as Sam is not evne close in value to Hanifin.

I quoted you in full. It was your comparison and there were no caveats when you compared Kane with a mid-1st. That's on you for a poor and/or poorly worded post. Cheers.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

Not enough. They need a top 6 center for him or they will just keep him

 

[JCLA]

Thanks captain obvious. That's what an elite rental is. Assumption here is that Carolina tries to seriously compete this year. If your management don't want to go for it, there is no deal to be made as Sam is not evne close in value to Hanifin.

You don't sign rentals to compete for a playoff spot. You sign rentals to win the cup. The canes aren't winning the cup with or without evander kane

 

[StormCast]

You don't sign rentals to compete for a playoff spot. You sign rentals to win the cup. The canes aren't winning the cup with or without evander kane

True and you typically don't send franchise D-men the other way for a rental and a disappointing, undersized center.

 

[72hockey guy]

Thanks captain obvious. That's what an elite rental is. Assumption here is that Carolina tries to seriously compete this year. If your management don't want to go for it, there is no deal to be made as Sam is not evne close in value to Hanifin.

theres no such thing as an elite rental. a Crosby a McDavid a Tavares, never hit the market.

youre vastly overating the return on an evander kane

 

[72hockey guy]

You don't sign rentals to compete for a playoff spot. You sign rentals to win the cup. The canes aren't winning the cup with or without evander kane

exactly. bookmark this post. the man gets it

its also why you dont get mid firsts for him either

teams with mid firsts arent expecting to win the stanley cup

 

[cptjeff]

If by "Reinhart and Nylander", you mean "an extended Tavares wearing a fake mustache", then yes. If you mean the Buffalo players, then Francis is going to block every incoming call with a Buffalo area code.

Hanifin is not available for spare parts. Full stop.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

Nope. This is worse than the other one.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

I think we should be at a full stop on Hanifin to Buffalo threads. Unless Eichel is involved, and he obviously won't be, then there's not a player on Buffalo that Carolina would trade Hanifin for.

 

[72hockey guy]

I think we should be at a full stop on Hanifin to Buffalo threads. Unless Eichel is involved, and he obviously won't be, then there's not a player on Buffalo that Carolina would trade Hanifin for.

i disagree. I think Hanifin for ROR is a reasonable basis for a trade, Carolina may not agree, but they could go a decade without drafting a center as good as ROR, they could see Hanifins enire career go by being non competitive

 

[MinJaBen]

I'd do it. But first, tell me how you are going to get Toronto to trade you Willie? Once you have that figured out, I'll be on board with this proposal.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

i disagree. I think Hanifin for ROR is a reasonable basis for a trade, Carolina may not agree, but they could go a decade without drafting a center as good as ROR, they could see Hanifins enire career go by being non competitive

You may disagree but Hanifin is trending up in a big way. He has elite D potential. We know what ROR is. He's a better Jordan Staal. He's a 60+ point center with excellent defense. He would be great to have but not at the expense of Hanifin.

 

[72hockey guy]

You may disagree but Hanifin is trending up in a big way. He has elite D potential. We know what ROR is. He's a better Jordan Staal. He's a 60+ point center with excellent defense. He would be great to have but not at the expense of Hanifin.

i dont disagree with any of what youve written, but it is possible that you never draft and develop a center that good for Hanifins entire career. it does happen. with your defense you could draft 8-14 and never be in a position to get one

im just talking probabilities

im a fan of neither team and trying to evaluate needs as rationally as possible

what good is having an elite defense if you legitimately cannot score

being in the middle is mediocre. not winning enough to have a chance at a cup and not bad enough to gain elite players in the draft

 

[Svechhammer]

At this point, Hanifin is beginning to develop into the player the Canes were hoping he would be. He is contributing more offensively while continuing to develop his already good defensive game. If you were serious about getting him in what you would consider to be an even trade, it was during the season last year. Any deal going forward that involves him will be something that you consider to be a drastic overpayment. Enough other teams will want someone of his skill that it would become a bidding war and Francis knows this, so he won't accept anything less than a fleecing, and he'd be justified in doing so.

Outside of Eichel, there isn't anyone on the Sabres that could reasonably be moved for Hanifin. He's that valuable to the Canes and their core.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

i dont disagree with any of what youve written, but it is possible that you never draft and develop a center that good for Hanifins entire career. it does happen. with your defense you could draft 8-14 and never be in a position to get one

im just talking probabilities

One Thomas Vanek returned 1st, 2nd and Matt Moulson as a 1 year rental to the Islanders who finished 5th from bottom. Guess who traded Vanek away. Now come back and tell me how impossible it is to get a mid 1st for Kane.

 

[Chainshot]

Merged three from the first two pages.

 

[Chainshot]

Upon further review -- knock it off with the name calling.

 

[72hockey guy]

One Thomas Vanek returned 1st, 2nd and Matt Moulson as a 1 year rental to the Islanders who finished 5th from bottom. Guess who traded Vanek away. Now come back and tell me how impossible it is to get a mid 1st for Kane.

and the Islanders rued that deal ever since. it was done by the owner trying to secure an arena which failed. if your depending on Charles Wang to save you your in for a long wait... even Islander fans knew he was a clown. he also offered Vanek 50 million dollars , that shows how clueless he was

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

and the Islanders rued that deal ever since. it was done by the owner trying to secure an arena which failed. if your depending on Charles Wang to save you your in for a long wait... even Islander fans knew he was a clown. he also offered Vanek 50 million dollars , that shows how clueless he was

Carolina has an owner who is ready to sell the team that is also struggling to generate revenues. See the logic now?

 

[drw02]

Just curious why Hanifin is only averaging 18:05 min/game of ice time if he is playing really well this season?

That is only about 10 seconds more per game than his first two seasons in the league.

It is also interesting that his O-Zone starts have increased each season he has been in the league.

Because context matters. The Canes have a very deep blueline with good vets in the heart of their prime while Hanifin is still really young and has not even entered his prime.