Proposal: Buffalo Proposals for Hanifin (Merged)

[CraigsList]

This makes about 0 sense for Buffalo so it is a non-starter.

Canes are rumoured to be sellling the franchise no? What if they want to make a playoff push to get revenues/attendance up to fetch a better return on the franchise? Kane+Reinhart helps this way more than Hanifin over Gorges on your bottom pairing.

So let’s just give Hanifin up to get a small increase in attendance? No.

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

I think too much from Buffalo's end, Hanifin for Reinhart would be good and don't know who'd have to add, but that's a trade that looks good to me.

I was thinking at the deadline maybe Kane, Lehner and Reinhart for Ekman-Larsson.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

So let’s just give Hanifin up to get a small increase in attendance? No.

You don't give up Hanifin for nothing. Potentially 7 years of Sam Reinhart in return is not "giving up" a player. Also Kane could re-sign in theory, you have capspace and you would have first option to negotiate with him. It's not about small increase of attendance. It's about making a playoff push that adds quite a bit of additional revenue if I understand things correctly if you actually make it. Also an owner looking to sell will look at any possible ways to increase revenue to sell on a high (just look at the UFC and the monstrocities they did with Ronda and McGregor before they sold the company on a high). Selling a team with low attendance that also is not making a playoff push is not exactly great for his return. Fans may not like it but I am talking about real business circumstances here.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

I think too much from Buffalo's end, Hanifin for Reinhart would be good and don't know who'd have to add, but that's a trade that looks good to me.

I was thinking at the deadline maybe Kane, Lehner and Reinhart for Ekman-Larsson.

I'd rather have Hanifin who is on ELC now rather than 1.25 years of OEL who may not re-sign if we continue to suck like we do now. Also Arizona has 0 reason to trade for a rental - they absolutely suck like we do.

 

[Savant]

Uh I say no.

Just Reinhart for Hanafin. Two underachieving high draft picks flipped for each other based on other teams needs.

I don’t think you have watched Hanifin this season.

 

[CaptPantalones]

Hanifin is clearly the highest piece here, but the gap isn't Kane AND Reinhart wide

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

You don't give up Hanifin for nothing. Potentially 7 years of Sam Reinhart in return is not "giving up" a player. Also Kane could re-sign in theory, you have capspace and you would have first option to negotiate with him. It's not about small increase of attendance. It's about making a playoff push that adds quite a bit of additional revenue if I understand things correctly if you actually make it. Also an owner looking to sell will look at any possible ways to increase revenue to sell on a high (just look at the UFC and the monstrocities they did with Ronda and McGregor before they sold the company on a high). Selling a team with low attendance that also is not making a playoff push is not exactly great for his return. Fans may not like it but I am talking about real business circumstances here.

Slavin - Pesce
Fleury - Faulk
Gorges/Dahlbeck - van Riemsdyk

That group would be Buffalo-caliber offensively, if Faulk doesn't start producing. Even if he does, that's still a poorly balanced blueline that would struggle to put the upgraded forwards in a position to produce.

They're no closer to the playoffs with that, imo.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

Slavin - Pesce
Fleury - Faulk
Gorges/Dahlbeck - van Riemsdyk

That group would be Buffalo-caliber offensively, if Faulk doesn't start producing. Even if he does, that's still a poorly balanced blueline that would struggle to put the upgraded forwards in a position to produce.

They're no closer to the playoffs with that, imo.

You have a very solid top4D and you have 2 good forward additions. You are a better team with Kane and Reinhart and it's not even close.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

Hanifin is clearly the highest piece here, but the gap isn't Kane AND Reinhart wide

If we value Kane at a mid-1st. I'd do Reinhart+mid 1st for Hanifin any day.

 

[UnleashRasmus]

I honestly don't know how you trade both for Hanifin. As good as Hanifin could be, he's playing third pair minutes. I'm not giving up two of our best assets for him. Seems too high.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

I honestly don't know how you trade both for Hanifin. As good as Hanifin could be, he's playing third pair minutes. I'm not giving up two of our best assets for him. Seems too high.

There are 2 ways to obtain elite D - draft them or get them young. We haven't drafted any for years so I take the gamble that Hanifin becomes one, the potential is clearly there. I just don't see the upside in Sam to become an elite Center even though it's clear he weill be at least a good middle 6 forward in the NHL and Kane is the difference in value between both. Once again, I always find it funny that both sides say they give up too much...it's clearly not possible.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

If you're looking at value in a vacuum I guess it's fine but we're not. Kane being a UFA makes him really unattractive to Carolina. If he walks then it's Hanifin for Reinhart which would be bad for us.

 

[Fear the Wushu]

Wake Up TehDoak, it's time to go to work!!

I don't like trading Hanifin, and I really don't want to trade Hanifin, but I think the value might equal out but it's not something the canes would trade hanifin for. They aren't moving Hanifin unless it's for a for sure 1C. See: Jones and Johansen.

I don't know what other canes fans will say

You have to be joking. In no way would Hanifin fetch a young #1C. If Carolina called up NJ asking for Nico, Shero would laugh Francis off the phone.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

If you're looking at value in a vacuum I guess it's fine but we're not. Kane being a UFA makes him really unattractive to Carolina. If he walks then it's Hanifin for Reinhart which would be bad for us.

Potential franchise sale changes some things as I said. I am sure they are looking at getting some short term results and revenue increases to bump up franchise sale value.

 

[72hockey guy]

If we value Kane at a mid-1st. I'd do Reinhart+mid 1st for Hanifin any day.

then if thats the case trade kane for that mid first. i honestly dont see any lottery bubble team giving up a chance for Dahlin for Evander Kane, not after Philly getting 1OA last year

and I know Reinhart doesnt have the value you think he does

buffalo has every right to value their players as they see fit. but then so do other teams

 

[dogbazinho]

It's a fair trade and what it would take to acquire Hanifin but I don't think we trade Hanifin. We appear to be outside of the playoffs again and Hanifin has been the one bright spot. You'll get far more value for Kane trading with a playoff team. I could see another D or prospects/picks for Reinhart but that's about it.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

You have a very solid top4D and you have 2 good forward additions. You are a better team with Kane and Reinhart and it's not even close.

There's more to offense than just forward talent. Otherwise, Buffalo, for example, wouldn't have been near the basement offensively over the past couple of seasons with Eichel, O'Reilly, Kane and Reinhart.

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

then if thats the case trade kane for that mid first. i honestly dont see any lottery bubble team giving up a chance for Dahlin for Evander Kane, not after Philly getting 1OA last year

and I know Reinhart doesnt have the value you think he does

Bubble team chance of lottery win still remains under 5%....similar chance as hitting an elite player in the 3rd round. Doubt anyone gunning for playoffs thinks this way.

 

[Jim Bob]

Just curious why Hanifin is only averaging 18:05 min/game of ice time if he is playing really well this season?

That is only about 10 seconds more per game than his first two seasons in the league.

It is also interesting that his O-Zone starts have increased each season he has been in the league.

 

[72hockey guy]

Bubble team chance of lottery win still remains under 5%....similar chance as hitting an elite player in the 3rd round. Doubt anyone gunning for playoffs thinks this way.

its a matter of asset management, if youre a true bubble team you know that most likely its a one and done scenario, and with kane likely to walk afterward why wouldnt you bank on that 5 %

its better than winding up with nothing

as a fan of a team with 2 firsts, on the playoff bubble

id be furious if garth snow traded one for kane (it wouldnt happen because his arch enemy Ladd is an Isle but the point is the same)

if you get a first it will be team with real contender status not a bubble team.
pittsburgh, washington nashville yes. the Isles, montreal detroit, no

follow me?

good teams hoping to make a meaningful run not teams who may or may not make the dance

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

Just curious why Hanifin is only averaging 18:05 min/game of ice time if he is playing really well this season?

That is only about 10 seconds more per game than his first two seasons in the league.

It is also interesting that his O-Zone starts have increased each season he has been in the league.

Cause they have Slavin and Pesce that take most of the tough minutes and take them well

There's more to offense than just forward talent. Otherwise, Buffalo, for example, wouldn't have been near the basement offensively over the past couple of seasons with Eichel, O'Reilly, Kane and Reinhart.

We know this quite well. But your D corp even without Hanifin is lightyears ahead of what we have had in the past decade. You still have 5 solid D and you would get choice between Bealieu and Gorges from us for 6th...depending if you want offensive numbers and defensive liability or the opposite no offense and solid shutdown guy.

 

[CaptPantalones]

If we value Kane at a mid-1st. I'd do Reinhart+mid 1st for Hanifin any day.

Honestly, the way he's playing now he's worth more then a mid 1st alone.

And if he keeps it up were looking at a Andrew Ladd like return for him (1st, middle to high prospect and a conditional pick)

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

Honestly, the way he's playing now he's worth more then a mid 1st alone.

And if he keeps it up were looking at a Andrew Ladd like return for him (1st, middle to high prospect and a conditional pick)

If you go on the Sabres board, most are saying late 1st is the expectation on him. I'm normally in the late 1st+b prospect category or mid 1st....I know Ladd got much more but how did that work out for the buyer...

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Just curious why Hanifin is only averaging 18:05 min/game of ice time if he is playing really well this season?

That is only about 10 seconds more per game than his first two seasons in the league.

It is also interesting that his O-Zone starts have increased each season he has been in the league.

1) Because he's 20 years old and not as good defensively as Slavin and Pesce who take up the lion share of the tough matchups and dzone face offs.
2) Even with that, the Canes start in the Ozone the VAST majority of the time (Even Slavin and Pesce are at 49% and 50%) so none of their defensemen have low O-zone starts.
3) He's still learning how to play defense effectively at the NHL level. He's improving, but not yet there, which nobody would disagree with.
4) He was playing with Faulk, but the two were too similar in terms of driving offense and thus the other pairing struggled so the coach split them up.

All in all, his offense and confidence have grown in leaps and bounds this year and his defense is getting better and better. I think it's the tip of the iceberg for him.

 

[bleedgreen]

The Canes are being sold today. Not an issue, so no the canes don't need a bad deal to make the playoffs.

Hanifin for RoR without significant retention makes zero sense financially for the Canes.