Confirmed with Link: Zucker to the Pens for 1st round pick, Gally, and Addison Part Duex

[Peat]

Just checked and was surprised to find that you're right. Perhaps that's why he's playing 4th line minutes? Maybe the Pens are subtly convincing him to accept an 0ffseason trade by showing him what his future with this team will be like?

I kinda wonder that myself at times but at the same time, it wasn't that long he was in the top 6 with Bryan Rust moved to accommodate him. I think that as explanations go, there being an awkward fit here in terms of getting him playing time at times is probably a simpler explanation than trying to gently move him along.

 

[Tom Hanks]

Just checked and was surprised to find that you're right. Perhaps that's why he's playing 4th line minutes? Maybe the Pens are subtly convincing him to accept an 0ffseason trade by showing him what his future with this team will be like?

His ATOI in February is 15:35 (career ATOI is 16:05).

 

[pistolpete11]

His ATOI in February is 15:35 (career ATOI is 16:05).

I was just going to ask is he really getting '4th line' minutes? He's getting similar TOI as he usually does. It's just that the '4th' line is getting 3rd line minutes because a) they've been effective b) the injuries and c) Sully doesn't want to break them up. Fully healthy, Hornqvist is your 3RW and 1PP net front.

 

[Will Hunting]

Coleman and Tanev are wonderful players. Wonderful. But there is a reason they are 3rd liners. I love Tanev to death. He would be my next choice for a jersey if I was a kid still. Coleman is very similar and I mean that as a compliment. I would love him here and thats why I am not gonna criticize what Tampa did. But cmon. Give me Zucker over Tanev all day all night. To me Tanev = Coleman so give me Zucker over him all day all night too. JR did well here. By getting Tanev for free at FA - as that contract is absolutely a no issue as well. And by getting Zucker cheaper and for longer than TB just got Coleman. And yeah.. all of that could have been even better if Kessel doesnt nix that trade. Not JRs fault. He almost hit a jackpot there but no.. instead he only did very well there.

 

[Turin]

Coleman is better than Tanev too guys. They aren’t the same. This weird triangle of player comparisons doesn’t make sense beyond them being fast LH wingers.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I was just going to ask is he really getting '4th line' minutes? He's getting similar TOI as he usually does. It's just that the '4th' line is getting 3rd line minutes because a) they've been effective b) the injuries and c) Sully doesn't want to break them up. Fully healthy, Hornqvist is your 3RW and 1PP net front.

Ice time was down last couple games but it happens to everyone. Overall though he gets top 6 minutes every season.

Patric Hornqvist 2019-20 Game Log | Hockey-Reference.com

 

[Will Hunting]

Coleman is better than Tanev too guys. They aren’t the same. This weird triangle of player comparisons doesn’t make sense beyond them being fast LH wingers.

Tanev is great. Remember. He is playing super-defensive role on a line with ZAR and Blueger. He is on pace for 16 goals and 37 points without PP time on a super-defensive line. That is REALLY good. You basically cant find a better modern 3rd liner than him. Coleman might be one. But only by a very slim margin. And lets see how he does on a contender where his role might be different than on a bad NJ team. We have seen that movie before. I dont think thats gonna be Colemans case but lets see it first. Tanev already proved that he can be great in a very difficult role.

Zucker to them is obviously an apple to oranges. But he is very probably gonna be great here.

 

[Louis Hensler]

Ice time was down last couple games but it happens to everyone. Overall though he gets top 6 minutes every season.

Patric Hornqvist 2019-20 Game Log | Hockey-Reference.com

Yeah, too soon to see what his TOI will be since he's only been on the 4th line since the Zucker trade. Plus, his ice time will fluctuate depending on special teams. I just don't see them wanting to pay that money for that role, no matter his TOI.

 

[pistolpete11]

Ice time was down last couple games but it happens to everyone. Overall though he gets top 6 minutes every season.

Patric Hornqvist 2019-20 Game Log | Hockey-Reference.com

Yeah, I think its also just the circumstances with the injuries and Sully not wanting to break up ZAR-Blueger-Tanev. Horny just doesn't fit anywhere except with the AHL guys who Sully still doesn't trust enough.

 

[Gurglesons]

Yeah, I think its also just the circumstances with the injuries and Sully not wanting to break up ZAR-Blueger-Tanev. Horny just doesn't fit anywhere except with the AHL guys who Sully still doesn't trust enough.

Hornqvist is a huge part of our PP and is on pace for our best ES goal total that isn’t Geno, Sid, Guentzel or Rust.

 

[pistolpete11]

Hornqvist is a huge part of our PP and is on pace for our best ES goal total that isn’t Geno, Sid, Guentzel or Rust.

Yep. That's why in my previous post I said, "Fully healthy, Hornqvist is your 3RW and 1PP net front."

 

[dogthateats]

A lot of people seem to love players that have had big games against the Penguins. I don’t think they really watch the players other than when they play us.

 

[ChaosAgent]

A lot of people seem to love players that have had big games against the Penguins. I don’t think they really watch the players other than when they play us.

Ain't nobody got time for that.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

Anybody trying to compare this trade with the Coleman deal is crazy. Coleman is a decent player but not close to Zucker. Zucker has had a 33 goal and 64 point season. Coleman really had one season as a decent 36 point 3rd line player on a bad team and this year having a good 2/3 season.

Zucker is signed for the next 4 playoffs and Coleman 2 playoffs. I see Zucker on this team easily being a 25+ goal 50+ point player while also providing a fast two way game. I wouldn't be surprised to see Zucker back to 30 goal and 60 point player next season. As is Zucker is on pace if he played 82 games to score 27 goals and 54 points and that was with almost all games on the Wild. I think that pace will be 30 goal and 60 point pace at season end.

I don't see Coleman being at best a 20 goal 40 point guy and most years less than 40 points. I don't think anyone really believes he is in Zucker's class. Essentially Tampa payed the same price and maybe higher for a lesser player for less years. The reason his contract is so low is because he never has been anything up until this season worth more than $1.8 million and that isn't good at 28 years old. I think he is what he is which in most years will be low 20 goal scorer and mid 30 point player that will play the body and PK. Honestly don't think he is better than Tanev. Tanev would of had just as good of numbers on that team in the same spot. If we put Tanev with forwards better than ZAR and Blueger and upgraded him with McCann and Hornqvist he would be a 20+ goal and 40+ point guy also.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

The Coleman Trade made the Zucker deal look good but wait until Kreider gets traded. Someone will give up as much for him as a rental. All take 4 playoff runs with Zucker any day over one shot at the playoffs and then have lost a 1st and a good prospect with nothing to show for it unless you win the Cup.

I always hate giving up anything big for a rental. I certainly have no problem giving that up for 4 years of a top line forward. I think Rutherford will have made the best deal when all deals have been done. I wanted Palmieri but if Coleman got that much what does 1 1/2 of Palmieri cost?

 

[ChaosAgent]

The Coleman Trade made the Zucker deal look good but wait until Kreider gets traded. Someone will give up as much for him as a rental. All take 4 playoff runs with Zucker any day over one shot at the playoffs and then have lost a 1st and a good prospect with nothing to show for it unless you win the Cup.

I always hate giving up anything big for a rental. I certainly have no problem giving that up for 4 years of a top line forward. I think Rutherford will have made the best deal when all deals have been done. I wanted Palmieri but if Coleman got that much what does 1 1/2 of Palmieri cost?

Probably more, but not that much.

A huge part of Coleman's appeal is how dirt-cheap he is, particularly for a team that's going to be running up against the cap like Tampa. Their entire defense outside Hedmen, McD and Coburn is up after this year - notably Sergachev.

 

[LOGiK]

With how well Zucker is melding with Sid and company at a very nice pace and Sid himself saying Zucker is "the type of player that is easy to play with" signals good things ahead there... unfortunately Jake won't be around until next season, but I still kind of think any MAJOR moves don't really need be made before the trade dead line.

Pushing too much breaks the mold. Maybe something on defense, but that would be a 1:1 trade. JJ for an improved defensive d man or something..... With Bjug coming back and being virtually untradeable at this point in the season - he would be the only player I'd move this trade dead line for someone.

If I were GM that'd be my stance, but I'm not, so who knows what will happen, but main point, Zucker being a slam dunk... does JR need to really push for more?

 

[Peat]

With how well Zucker is melding with Sid and company at a very nice pace and Sid himself saying Zucker is "the type of player that is easy to play with" signals good things ahead there... unfortunately Jake won't be around until next season, but I still kind of think any MAJOR moves don't really need be made before the trade dead line.

Pushing too much breaks the mold. Maybe something on defense, but that would be a 1:1 trade. JJ for an improved defensive d man or something..... With Bjug coming back and being virtually untradeable at this point in the season - he would be the only player I'd move this trade dead line for someone.

If I were GM that'd be my stance, but I'm not, so who knows what will happen, but main point, Zucker being a slam dunk... does JR need to really push for more?

Yeah. I don't think it needs to be big but when you look at Sully's current trust levels for for the depth lines right now, I think getting a little something done makes sense. Sure, we'll hopefully be healthy again for the play-offs - but there's no guarantees and injuries still happen there. Best to pick up a little insurance.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

With how well Zucker is melding with Sid and company at a very nice pace and Sid himself saying Zucker is "the type of player that is easy to play with" signals good things ahead there... unfortunately Jake won't be around until next season, but I still kind of think any MAJOR moves don't really need be made before the trade dead line.

Pushing too much breaks the mold. Maybe something on defense, but that would be a 1:1 trade. JJ for an improved defensive d man or something..... With Bjug coming back and being virtually untradeable at this point in the season - he would be the only player I'd move this trade dead line for someone.

If I were GM that'd be my stance, but I'm not, so who knows what will happen, but main point, Zucker being a slam dunk... does JR need to really push for more?

If I was going to trade anyone at this time it would be Schultz. I love how Rutherford trades UFA's for players with term. Rutherford is one of the best GM's at asset management. Just in the past year Rutherford has added four young players that had been 22 or 23 that all four are like drafting late 1st round picks and instantly developing them (Pettersson, McCann, Marino, and Kahun). Since the average late first round pick has only a 50% chance of being a regular NHL player getting 4 young developed players like that is pretty impressive.

That is why I have no problem getting Zucker who will still be 30 in his last year of his deal is certainly worth a late 1st and a smallish offensive defenseman that his Junior numbers have stagnated for the past 3 years. The chances either the pick or Addison end up being as good as Zucker is fairly small. Plus Zucker is here for our next 4 Cup runs and after that this team will be about out of those chances. If a 37 year old Malkin and 36 year old Crosby still can make a run for the Cup then I will worry about that then. Rutherford has kept the team young around the core with his methods so I don't see why that strategy would change over the years.

 

[LOGiK]

Yeah. I don't think it needs to be big but when you look at Sully's current trust levels for for the depth lines right now, I think getting a little something done makes sense. Sure, we'll hopefully be healthy again for the play-offs - but there's no guarantees and injuries still happen there. Best to pick up a little insurance.

Who would the penguins black aces be this post season?

With Bjug, Kahun and Doom coming back.... that leaves 3 current roster players as black aces... so I mean Sully gotta have some trust in the depth lines though right? They played a decent chunk of the season due to injuries.

What do you think?

 

[ChaosAgent]

Yeah. I don't think it needs to be big but when you look at Sully's current trust levels for for the depth lines right now, I think getting a little something done makes sense. Sure, we'll hopefully be healthy again for the play-offs - but there's no guarantees and injuries still happen there. Best to pick up a little insurance.

Realistically if we have Bjugs and Kahun back I think there's a trickling down throughout the lineup - to where the 4th line becomes playable again.

I also think the 4th line hasn't formed an identity because it was a glorified parking spot for Galchenyuk (not a 4th line guy at all) for like 70% of the year.

 

[LOGiK]

If I was going to trade anyone at this time it would be Schultz. I love how Rutherford trades UFA's for players with term. Rutherford is one of the best GM's at asset management. Just in the past year Rutherford has added four young players that had been 22 or 23 that all four are like drafting late 1st round picks and instantly developing them (Pettersson, McCann, Marino, and Kahun). Since the average late first round pick has only a 50% chance of being a regular NHL player getting 4 young developed players like that is pretty impressive.

That is why I have no problem getting Zucker who will still be 30 in his last year of his deal is certainly worth a late 1st and a smallish offensive defenseman that his Junior numbers have stagnated for the past 3 years. The chances either the pick or Addison end up being as good as Zucker is fairly small. Plus Zucker is here for our next 4 Cup runs and after that this team will be about out of those chances.

True true true. I forgot about Schultzy. Since he is definitely gone I would ship him westward. Not like the devils injecting our enemies with more fire power.

Who would be a return target or 'what' picks wise would be the target for Schultz do you think?

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

Realistically if we have Bjugs and Kahun back I think there's a trickling down throughout the lineup - to where the 4th line becomes playable again.

I also think the 4th line hasn't formed an identity because it was a glorified parking spot for Galchenyuk (not a 4th line guy at all) for like 70% of the year.

I think with everyone healthy the 4th line is the Blueger line. The 3rd line will be a combination of players like McCann-Bjugstad-Hornqvist or something like that.

 

[Tom Hanks]

I think with everyone healthy the 4th line is the Blueger line. The 3rd line will be a combination of players like McCann-Bjugstad-Hornqvist or something like that.

Theyll probably play similar minutes. Then you’ll see it deployed situationally depending on the game/circumstances etc

I was hoping to pick a cheap LW that would mesh with Geno/Rust to make a Kahun-McCann-Hornqvist line.

I’m pretending Bjugstad isn’t coming back or still has issues.

 

[ChaosAgent]

I think with everyone healthy the 4th line is the Blueger line. The 3rd line will be a combination of players like McCann-Bjugstad-Hornqvist or something like that.

I guess that's true.

But thinking there will be a much more even distribution of minutes between those 2 lines. Right now the Blueger line is playing as much as ES as the Sid & Geno lines. By then the distribution should be - assuming 50 minutes at ES - 15 Sid, 15 Geno, 10 Bjugs/Cann, 10 Blueger.