Would you be okay with an extended losing streak if Bylsma gets canned?

[Shockmaster]

What are you talking about? Bylsma had been excellent at holding his young players to account.

I sense sarcasm....

 

[eXile59]

I don't know, coming out of the lockout we had...

Kunitz-Crosby-Dupuis
Tangradi-Malkin-Neal
Cooke-Sutter-Kennedy
Glass-Vitale-Adams

Orpik-Martin
Niskanen-Letang
Despres-Engelland
Bortuzzo

This year we came into the season with...

Kunitz-Crosby-Dupuis
Jokinen-Malkin-Neal
Bennett-Sutter-Kobasew/D'Agostini
Glass-Jeffrey/Vitale-Adams

Orpik-Martin
Scuderi-Niskanen/Letang
Maatta-Bortuzzo
Engelland

Jokinen replaces Tangradi, Bennett replaces Cooke, Kobasew and D'Agostini replace Kennedy, Scuderi and Maatta are solid additions on defense. In my opinion...

Jokinen > Tangradi True
Bennett > Cooke In the future maybe but right now Cooke is the better player.
D'Agostini/Kobasew < (but not much) or = Kennedy Kennedy got a lot of hate but he is considerable bit better than. I would be willing to be that if/when these guys hit waivers they go unclaimed.

People want to blame Bylsma and Shero, why don't we wait until we have close to a full lineup, because we haven't seen this team as a whole yet, key injuries early on, let's not play the blame game.

All this goes back to Shero's hoarding of D-men. We could take a lot injuries at the D position & still be alright but only two injuries & Kobasew is playing on the 2nd line.

The closets thing we have to a prospect to promote when injuries occurred up front was Megna. The Neal & Bennett injuries are unfortunate but should not have been crippling if we weren't so starved at that position. In the end they're just excuses to distract from the fact this is not a balanced organization.

 

[IcedCapp]

As I just suggested, the problem may be that you need two pairs of fresh eyes looking at this personnel mix. This team is just so much like the late 90's Pens. Not hard to play against. A pair of elite players and a bunch of waiver wire material types. The biggest difference may be that Craig Patrick at least had the excuse that he had no money to spend, even on coaches. Ray Shero does.

I agree with all of the things plaguing the Pens. I disagree that firing Bylsma fixes any of them

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

1. He budgeted 7.5M for Sid's wingers and gave us Kunitz and Dupuis. Yep, he missed on Parise. Maybe there was a deal out there, maybe not. That's the part that you just don't know . . . will he take a risk in a deal these days or only make it when his hand is forced (Staal) or it's a no brainer (Gologoski)? No way to know for sure.

There's a remarkably simple way. Just try to remember way back to the 2013 trade deadline. It seems to me that Shero risked a considerable amount to go "all in" and address our roster needs, even if it meant overpayment in some cases.

People love to criticize Shero for how much he gave up to land the likes of Morrow and Murray, but then they turn around and say he sits on his hands unless a deal's an automatic. It can't be both, man.

2. Coach, system, and team is pretty much unchanged despite the last two exits (and more). Is that indicative that Shero thinks it's right just as it is and it's just a question of the puck luck or that he really has his hands tied? And, if it's the latter, then who tied them?

The Pens have two new coaches and adopted a new defensive scheme this year, and changed 4 of their top 9 forwards and acquired a top 4 defenseman over the last couple seasons.

Don't tell me there hasn't been change.

Not unlike your Vitale/Jeffrey to Malkin's wing argument, it just hasn't been exactly the changes you've wanted.

 

[Fire Shero*]

All this goes back to Shero's hoarding of D-men. We could take a lot injuries at the D position & still be alright but only two injuries & Kobasew is playing on the 2nd line.

The closets thing we have to a prospect to promote when injuries occurred up front was Megna. The Neal & Bennett injuries are unfortunate but should not have been crippling if we weren't so starved at that position. In the end they're just excuses to distract from the fact this is not a balanced organization.

Exactly. Shero is the root of all of this teams' problems.

 

[IcedCapp]

There's a remarkably simple way. Just try to remember way back to the 2013 trade deadline. It seems to me that Shero risked a considerable amount to go "all in" and address our roster needs, even if it meant overpayment in some cases.

People love to criticize Shero for how much he gave up to land the likes of Morrow and Murray, but then they turn around and say he sits on his hands unless a deal's an automatic. It can't be both, man.



The Pens have two new coaches and adopted a new defensive scheme this year, and changed 4 of their top 9 forwards and acquired a top 4 defenseman over the last couple seasons.

Don't tell me there hasn't been change.

Not unlike your Vitale/Jeffrey to Malkin's wing argument, it just hasn't been exactly the changes you've wanted.

Penguins/Shero were definitely aggressive last year. I actually liked the roster. Hate how it was deployed.

He was aggressive this off-season, too. Not as aggressive as I'd have liked, but he made moves.

 

[KIRK]

I agree with all of the things plaguing the Pens. I disagree that firing Bylsma fixes any of them

Actually, I agree with that, with the added comment that firing Bylsma ameliorates some of them.

 

[KIRK]

There's a remarkably simple way. Just try to remember way back to the 2013 trade deadline. It seems to me that Shero risked a considerable amount to go "all in" and address our roster needs, even if it meant overpayment in some cases.

People love to criticize Shero for how much he gave up to land the likes of Morrow and Murray, but then they turn around and say he sits on his hands unless a deal's an automatic. It can't be both, man.



The Pens have two new coaches and adopted a new defensive scheme this year, and changed 4 of their top 9 forwards and acquired a top 4 defenseman over the last couple seasons.

Don't tell me there hasn't been change.

Not unlike your Vitale/Jeffrey to Malkin's wing argument, it just hasn't been exactly the changes you've wanted.

1. I assume you agree with 3, 4, and 5.

2. What did Shero 'risk' to go all in and where did I question the prices he paid for Morrow and Murray?

3. Coach, system, and team is PRETTY MUCH unchanged = I said no changes to team in your book. Straw man from you. No argument otherwise.

 

[KIRK]

Penguins/Shero were definitely aggressive last year. I actually liked the roster. Hate how it was deployed.

He was aggressive this off-season, too. Not as aggressive as I'd have liked, but he made moves.

1. I liked that Shero was aggressive at last year's trade deadline, but Shero also is the guy who kept the person who deployed his roster. Bylsma is his guy. No divorcing that. Now, you can love the coach like RRP, but you can't hate what the coach does and fully love the GM who enables him. I mean, I suppose caffeine can warp one's logic such that one COULD do that.

2. He signed Scuderi this offseason and let the free agent acquisitions from last year's deadline walk. Did I miss another personnel change?

BTW, for all the griping I may do about the coach thinking Niskanen is indispensable and that KCD cuts it when it counts, I'm afraid that it's not just the coach who thinks that.

 

[IcedCapp]

1. I liked that Shero was aggressive at last year's trade deadline, but Shero also is the guy who kept the person who deployed his roster. Bylsma is his guy. No divorcing that. Now, you can love the coach like RRP, but you can't hate what the coach does and fully love the GM who enables him. I mean, I suppose caffeine can warp one's logic such that one COULD do that.

2. He signed Scuderi this offseason and let the free agent acquisitions from last year's deadline walk. Did I miss another personnel change?

yes, I've come over to the side that Shero is to blame for whatever faults the Pens may or may not have.

He's either making the decisions or complicit in making them by enabling Bylsma to make them. Either way, he's the man in charge.

 

[SEALBound]

Bylsma is part of the problem...but only a part. The problem is the organization as a whole, top to bottom.

I love my beloved Penguins but what Torts said in that interview a couple years back was spot on. We are an arrogant organization. We have Sidney Crosby. The best player in the world, the hardest working player in the world, a marketing dream who's been coached his entire life on how to carry himself. He comes into an organization that hosted Mario Lemieux, perhaps the best player to ever play, who now owns the team along with a slew of already rich investors.

I truly believe that the goal of the board of directors, owners, CEO, etc is to make this organization that is the epitome of "family". I believe they want to be looked at as the organization of loyalty and family. They want people here long term. They want that "we are family" mentality.

By ALL accounts, Bylsma should have been fired after Game 4. Shero and Mario should have been in his office that night parking his **** into cardboard boxes and left it in front of the CEC upon his return. But they didn't...they said they believed in him. He's a nice guy who players like...he's younger-ish, and he helped win a cup. He's not the blood and guts, hard work and grit coach that can coach a team into winning when it has no business doing so. His coaching style is the exact opposite of what he preaches. There is no grind in his coaching.

Bylsma believes that Sid and Geno and Co can get by on finesse. I honestly believe that he believes they can just out Sid and Geno the other teams. Look at every post season since 09 and you'll see a blatant pattern of a complete inability to play the matchup game. Hal Gill frustrated Crosby, TB beat up an injured team, Coutierer hounded Malkin, Chara and Bergeron had their way with Sid and Geno. The arrogance in believing that Sid and Geno and Co are so good that they can just finesse by and win makes it extremely easy to coach against the Penguins, especially in the playoffs. Takes about 1 game (hell about 2 periods) for the other coach to figure out Bylsma and the Penguins. This puts us at a tremendous disadvantage.

Some of the decisions he makes at key points in the game make you just want to puke. I've said "Is this for real!?" more than a couple times. Several times I honestly think that he's about to call a TO and call everyone back saying "just kidding"...but it doesn't happen. I attribute some of this to his past. Being a 4th line player himself I believe he gives more credit to the 4th liners than he should. Perhaps living through them to get the opportunities that he never had? I believe that this skews his ability to coach top skill effectively. See KCD never getting split, Iggy on LW, Bennett, Joks, etc.

Then you come to the players. Sid is the best and he's a loyal guy. That is his downfall. No idea if he truly said anything about wanting to skate only with Kunitz and Dupuis but I could definitely see it happening for no other reason than to not hurt their feelings. If that is the case, get some balls Sid. I have no other fathomable idea as to why it wasn't Kunitz-Crosby-Iginla. Seriously...explain. Bylsma...perhaps...but isn't he supposed to be a "players coach" who listens to his players? Duper over Iggy was Sid, IMHO. And for what? Nothing...

This "family and loyalty" thing is doing things such as: Keeping KCD together, keeping Adams and Glass, sending younger guys who deserve shots back to AHL, giving Letang the contract of a lifetime without deserving it IMHO. If Letang didn't want 5.5x7, then buh-bye. We keep Orpik around despite serious regressing. We keep Fleury around despite being a complete playoff failure. We keep Bylsma despite serious shortcomings.

But to answer the question, yes...I would be okay with a losing streak to get Bylsma canned on the condition that we did not miss the playoffs. I don't think losing and not making the playoffs would be enough to get him fired. Another playoff embarrassment would more likely get him fired than missing them all together. But then again...this country club we are family ******** knows no ends.

Here is what boggles my mind. You have:

Scuds-Letang
Martin-Orpik
Maatta-Nisky

on defense and Engo-Vitale-Adams on the 4th line. Scuds goes down and doesn't come back leaving:

______-Letang
Martin-Orpik
Maatta-Nisky

with Engo-Vitale-Adams. Bylsma runs 5 dmen the rest of the game. Why not, and I know this is absolutely bat**** crazy...run:

Nisky-Letang
Martin-Orpik
Maatta-Engo

with Vitale-Crosby/Malkin/Sutter-Adams as the 4th line...especially in a game that you are having matchup problems and can't score!? :O That would have been way too easy...and it makes me sad something like that didn't happen. That tells me Bylsma is more in love with the 4th line than coaching the team as a whole.

More over, in the Toronto game...no one worked. No one felt they had to work for it. This team spends way too much time trying to make the pretty passes for setups that decreases the difficulty of scoring instead of getting into the corners, working it out, grinding it out, GETTING TRAFFIC IN FRONT OF THE G-D NET, and scoring dirty hard fought goal. Hasn't happened in awhile. Like I said in the PGT, its a symptom of what truly ails us. All that game said is "Hey, we are a damn family part of the finest country club in the league and we don't have to work for goals or wins because we have Sid and Geno and other veterans who are family who can simply out finesse the other team".

We have a long way to go to getting back to a great team...and simply having Bylsma gone isn't the only fix. It will absolutely help, no doubt, just its only a small part.

 

[#66]

All this goes back to Shero's hoarding of D-men. We could take a lot injuries at the D position & still be alright but only two injuries & Kobasew is playing on the 2nd line.

The closets thing we have to a prospect to promote when injuries occurred up front was Megna. The Neal & Bennett injuries are unfortunate but should not have been crippling if we weren't so starved at that position. In the end they're just excuses to distract from the fact this is not a balanced organization.

Gotta admit it would be nice to call up Tatar or Silfverberg right now instead of Despres.

People think Shero is trying to insulate MAF with all of these PMD but its more about the system. The defensemen and centers do most of the skating with the puck so that's what he goes after.

I wish the system was more about transistional wingers. They can cover more ice while playing it safe. Guys like Voracek or even Frolik going up and down the wing making plays rather than defensemen roaming around the ice.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

If the Pens go on an extended losing streak, Shero would probably just sign Bylsma to an even longer extension to show how much faith he has in him.

Bylsma's pay scale seems to be inverse to his actual on-ice success.

I truly believe Bylsma's job with the Pens will be his while Shero's the GM. The only way he gets fired is if Shero's no longer the GM. So unless this hypothetical losing streak the OP is talking about results in Mario and Co. firing Shero, I don't think Bylsma's going anywhere.

 

[KIRK]

yes, I've come over to the side that Shero is to blame for whatever faults the Pens may or may not have.

He's either making the decisions or complicit in making them by enabling Bylsma to make them. Either way, he's the man in charge.

You know, I don't even know what it is. I mean, he didn't make Bylsma use all of the acquisitions the way he did. By the same token, right now, THIS is the team Shero constructed.

Again, I go back to 2006. On the heels of the Craig Patrick era, Ray Shero walked in and talked about how the Pens no longer would be easy to play against.

And, as I said, for about 4 years, the top talent and matchups were just part of what made the Pens tough. The other part was that the Pens would hit you in the mouth. Much as we bemoan Sid and Geno getting the **** kicked out of them by the likes of Toronto and Boston, it used to be the Pens who would visit 2X that on the other team's stars and beat the **** out of anyone who looked at Sid or Geno cross eyed (yes, I know, mini hyperbole there, but I think you get the point).

What are the Pens now? They're like the late 90's Pens, except they've got Sid and Geno instead of just Jagr and they spend more money on the defense. That might be the biggest rub for me: Is this team any different than one Craig Patrick might have thrown out there in the late 90's? As I said, at least Patrick had an excuse for not being able to spend more money to improve results or make the team tougher to play against.

 

[KIRK]

Bylsma is part of the problem...but only a part. The problem is the organization as a whole, top to bottom.

I love my beloved Penguins but what Torts said in that interview a couple years back was spot on. We are an arrogant organization. We have Sidney Crosby. The best player in the world, the hardest working player in the world, a marketing dream who's been coached his entire life on how to carry himself. He comes into an organization that hosted Mario Lemieux, perhaps the best player to ever play, who now owns the team along with a slew of already rich investors.

I truly believe that the goal of the board of directors, owners, CEO, etc is to make this organization that is the epitome of "family". I believe they want to be looked at as the organization of loyalty and family. They want people here long term. They want that "we are family" mentality.

By ALL accounts, Bylsma should have been fired after Game 4. Shero and Mario should have been in his office that night parking his **** into cardboard boxes and left it in front of the CEC upon his return. But they didn't...they said they believed in him. He's a nice guy who players like...he's younger-ish, and he helped win a cup. He's not the blood and guts, hard work and grit coach that can coach a team into winning when it has no business doing so. His coaching style is the exact opposite of what he preaches. There is no grind in his coaching.

Bylsma believes that Sid and Geno and Co can get by on finesse. I honestly believe that he believes they can just out Sid and Geno the other teams. Look at every post season since 09 and you'll see a blatant pattern of a complete inability to play the matchup game. Hal Gill frustrated Crosby, TB beat up an injured team, Coutierer hounded Malkin, Chara and Bergeron had their way with Sid and Geno. The arrogance in believing that Sid and Geno and Co are so good that they can just finesse by and win makes it extremely easy to coach against the Penguins, especially in the playoffs. Takes about 1 game (hell about 2 periods) for the other coach to figure out Bylsma and the Penguins. This puts us at a tremendous disadvantage.

Some of the decisions he makes at key points in the game make you just want to puke. I've said "Is this for real!?" more than a couple times. Several times I honestly think that he's about to call a TO and call everyone back saying "just kidding"...but it doesn't happen. I attribute some of this to his past. Being a 4th line player himself I believe he gives more credit to the 4th liners than he should. Perhaps living through them to get the opportunities that he never had? I believe that this skews his ability to coach top skill effectively. See KCD never getting split, Iggy on LW, Bennett, Joks, etc.

Then you come to the players. Sid is the best and he's a loyal guy. That is his downfall. No idea if he truly said anything about wanting to skate only with Kunitz and Dupuis but I could definitely see it happening for no other reason than to not hurt their feelings. If that is the case, get some balls Sid. I have no other fathomable idea as to why it wasn't Kunitz-Crosby-Iginla. Seriously...explain. Bylsma...perhaps...but isn't he supposed to be a "players coach" who listens to his players? Duper over Iggy was Sid, IMHO. And for what? Nothing...

This "family and loyalty" thing is doing things such as: Keeping KCD together, keeping Adams and Glass, sending younger guys who deserve shots back to AHL, giving Letang the contract of a lifetime without deserving it IMHO. If Letang didn't want 5.5x7, then buh-bye. We keep Orpik around despite serious regressing. We keep Fleury around despite being a complete playoff failure. We keep Bylsma despite serious shortcomings.

But to answer the question, yes...I would be okay with a losing streak to get Bylsma canned on the condition that we did not miss the playoffs. I don't think losing and not making the playoffs would be enough to get him fired. Another playoff embarrassment would more likely get him fired than missing them all together. But then again...this country club we are family ******** knows no ends.

Here is what boggles my mind. You have:

Scuds-Letang
Martin-Orpik
Maatta-Nisky

on defense and Engo-Vitale-Adams on the 4th line. Scuds goes down and doesn't come back leaving:

______-Letang
Martin-Orpik
Maatta-Nisky

with Engo-Vitale-Adams. Bylsma runs 5 dmen the rest of the game. Why not, and I know this is absolutely bat**** crazy...run:

Nisky-Letang
Martin-Orpik
Maatta-Engo

with Vitale-Crosby/Malkin/Sutter-Adams as the 4th line...especially in a game that you are having matchup problems and can't score!? :O That would have been way too easy...and it makes me sad something like that didn't happen. That tells me Bylsma is more in love with the 4th line than coaching the team as a whole.

More over, in the Toronto game...no one worked. No one felt they had to work for it. This team spends way too much time trying to make the pretty passes for setups that decreases the difficulty of scoring instead of getting into the corners, working it out, grinding it out, GETTING TRAFFIC IN FRONT OF THE G-D NET, and scoring dirty hard fought goal. Hasn't happened in awhile. Like I said in the PGT, its a symptom of what truly ails us. All that game said is "Hey, we are a damn family part of the finest country club in the league and we don't have to work for goals or wins because we have Sid and Geno and other veterans who are family who can simply out finesse the other team".

We have a long way to go to getting back to a great team...and simply having Bylsma gone isn't the only fix. It will absolutely help, no doubt, just its only a small part.

1.

2. I think the word 'arrogance' conjures up a vision in people's mind that it's born out of malice. The Pens arrogance is born out of an odd mix of the obstinate and complacency. In a way, as we talk in another thread about Geno, I wonder if he's the poster child for it. People like me can't fathom why he's happy being #2 or why he's never complained about playing with, what, 2 dozen plus different linemates after the last few years or why he really didn't consider anything but resigning with the Pens where he could've named his team (including teams better positioned to win cups over the next 5-10 years). As you said, it's the family, where feeling good and entertaining the fans is every bit as important as making the type of reflective and hard look at itself that franchises in a similar place and after a similar last few years would make. It's where Matt Niskanen is indispensable and where KCD isn't just seen as fine, it's seen by everyone as a solemn promise that must be kept. And, then we wonder why a team constructed, coached, managed, and that plays by Marquis of Queensbury rules lacks the killer instinct that the Penguins had BEFORE they won the cup.

 

[KIRK]

Gotta admit it would be nice to call up Tatar or Silfverberg right now instead of Despres.

People think Shero is trying to insulate MAF with all of these PMD but its more about the system. The defensemen and centers do most of the skating with the puck so that's what he goes after.

I wish the system was more about transistional wingers. They can cover more ice while playing it safe. Guys like Voracek or even Frolik going up and down the wing making plays rather than defensemen roaming around the ice.

You could have guys like Voracek or Frolik IF you were willing to insert those young PMD and move the older defensemen. I mean, it's a cap world. Something has to give somewhere. If you draft all these young defensemen, then either you play them or you do what the Pens have done since Sid and Geno left their rookie deals, mitigate the one advantage the Pens would have over everyone else in the league if, from a roster building perspective, they chose to exploit it.

 

[eXile59]

Exactly. Shero is the root of all of this teams' problems.

Yes because that is exactly what I said.

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

Why are we in win now mode? Malkin and Crosby became 32 overnight?

What has Filip Forsberg done? Not much from what I've seen so if we are in WIN NOW mode, what's the difference between him and Pouliot?

Does Pouliot fill a need we have? PPQB .... I think so. And who's to say he is so many years off .... Maatta stepped in .... Letang did it before him. Wouldn't it be nice to have Pouliot be Gogo next year as the PP QB?

And the question no one will answer .... WHO THE HELL WAS AVAILABLE FOR THE PENS TO SIGN THAT WOULD HAVE MADE OUR TOP SIX BETTER FOR THE SAME AMOUNT OF MONEY DUPUIS AND KUNITZ TOOK?

WHAT TRADE DID YOU HEAR ABOUT THAT WOULD HAVE MADE US BETTER?

Sid and Geno are in the prime of their careers. That's why we're in win now mode. It's not hard to understand.

If DP reaches his potential, then yes he'll fill a need. However, that'll not be till Sid and Geno are in their 30s. The reason Olli made the team is because his defense is NHL ready. DP's defense needs a lot of work till it' at NHL levels. If you think DP will step in to be the Pens' PPQB next year, you're gonna be disappointed.

FF's done about as much as BB at this point, just at a younger age.

Over the past two seasons there have been many wingers that signed for 6M or less. Look them up for yourself, I'm not gonna list them all: http://capgeek.com/latest-contracts/?listing_type=latest&contract_limit=150

As for a trade; Seto was moved for a 2nd, which Shero could have easily beaten. IIRC there was also talk of a Orpik/Stewart deal when Stew was getting scratched by Hitch and before their young D were playing.

And isn't Shero supposed to be "the best trading GM in the league"? You'd think he could turn some of our plethora of Dmen into a top 9 winger.

 

[KIRK]

Yes because that is exactly what I said.

ROFL . . .

(I agree, the whole 'he's the captain of the ship' thing, but the way you said it was really runny).

 

[KIRK]

Sid and Geno are in the prime of their careers. That's why we're in win now mode. It's not hard to understand.

If DP reaches his potential, then yes he'll fill a need. However, that'll not be till Sid and Geno are in their 30s. The reason Olli made the team is because his defense is NHL ready. DP's defense needs a lot of work till it' at NHL levels. If you think DP will step in to be the Pens' PPQB next year, you're gonna be disappointed.

FF's done about as much as BB at this point, just at a younger age.

Over the past two seasons there have been many wingers that signed for 6M or less. Look them up for yourself, I'm not gonna list them all: http://capgeek.com/latest-contracts/?listing_type=latest&contract_limit=150

As for a trade; Seto was moved for a 2nd, which Shero could have easily beaten. IIRC there was also talk of a Orpik/Stewart deal when Stew was getting scratched by Hitch and before their young D were playing.

And isn't Shero supposed to be "the best trading GM in the league"? You'd think he could turn some of our plethora of Dmen into a top 9 winger.

You can't trade Orpik.

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

No Rags, you were talking about who made the NHL first being some sort of draft trump card. It's clearly not, so you're changing your argument.

Hey Ray, why bother investing millions of dollars on scouting resources when you can just check out TSN.ca?

No I was pointing out that the guy he picked at 22 is better than the guy he picked at 8.

You love Shero and are blindly defending the pick, I get it. The truth of the matter is that literally no one, outside of Shero, rank DP over FF or Truba (or many other guys picked after DP) before the draft or after.

 

[KIRK]

No I was pointing out that the guy he picked at 22 is better than the guy he picked at 8.

You love Shero and are blindly defending the pick, I get it. The truth of the matter is that literally no one, outside of Shero, rank DP over FF or Truba (or many other guys picked after DP) before the draft or after.

Jay Feaster might have.

EDIT: Seriously, I remember someone saying on draft coverage that the Flames really like him.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

There are many issues and Bylsma is one of them but I feel like his stubborness with the lines is one of the biggest issues.

We had the most dominant line in the NHL the past few years with Kunitz - Malkin - Neal and either because of stubborness or because he can't tell Crosby "no," he puts Kunitz back with Crosby and Dupuis, even to the point of forcing a future NHL hall of famer to play on his off-wing with Malkin despite Dupuis showing he can play on both wings easily: Dupuis - Crosby - Iginla, Kunitz - Malkin - Neal.

Kunitz should go back with Malkin and Neal. Bylsma should get over himself and put Bennett up with Crosby and Dupuis.

I do think the coaching staff has changed the style of play a bit, especially on the defensive side to have the centers come back deep in the zone to help the D.

The only other major ***** I have about Bylsma is that he continues to neglect playing Crosby or Malkin on the PK other than Sid taking faceoffs and then getting off the ice. We don't keep other teams honest at the point because Craig Adams and Tanner Glass aren't making anyone shake in their boots to make mistakes out there. I don't want to hear anyone talking about Malkin not being able to play defense for the PK either. Watch Team Russia play the past several times in tournaments when Malkin is playing. He's a demon on the PK intercepting cross-ice passes on the point and taking them up for scoring chances.

 

[Jules Winnfield]

Jay Feaster might have.

EDIT: Seriously, I remember someone saying on draft coverage that the Flames really like him.

Yeah, it would've been great if we took Forsberg and Maatta. But those defensemen boy...we're going to eventually have 4 or 5 defensive pairings and cut back on forwards out there. We can run forward lines with 2 and defensive lines with 3 soon enough the way Shero drafts.

/rant over

 

[DegenX]

I can understand where some of the folks holding Shero accountable are coming from. But I don't know that it's a reason to fire him. If he's working with Bylsma to find guys that would fit the system, well to me that makes sense. Why waste assets on a guy that Bylsma won't use or will flat out mis-use?

Now, keeping Bylsma, that to me is a reason to fire him. I don't buy that bringing in J. Martin was Bylsma's idea, though. Shero was AGM for the Sens for part of Martin's stint as the head coach there. He's the one with the connection to J. Martin, not HCDB.

Some of his moves don't make sense to me, true. But I'm not quite ready to see him shown the door yet. Hell, if Bylsma would just show some signs that he's learning and adapting, I'd probably be willing to put down my pitchfork, but instead he just keeps giving me new reasons to sharpen it.