Windsor Spitfires 2020 Offseason Thread (Part 2)

[Crease Master]

It didn't happen in Windsor so I'm sure nothing will become of this. Kitchener is one of Branch's little sweetheart franchises so it was clearly an isolated incident and not indicative of a culture of hazing or drug abuse there. I forget, when we had a hazing incident in Windsor, we escaped any sort of league punishment and it just went away without any blow back at the team, right?

That being said its unfair to characterize this as a junior hockey problem, its much more of a universal teenager problem. Its part of growing up, whether its teammates or classmates you're probably going to have somebody that matters to you pressure you into doing drugs. I'm sure its an unpopular opinion but this kid is just hopping on the social media sympathy train for an easy fix. I miss the good old days when a man would either be expected to do the drugs and move on with his life, or not do the drugs and deal with whatever those consequences might be, real or imagined. That's part of growing up, that's why every tv show in the 80's had an episode teaching how to deal with this exact same circumstance. I don't remember seeing the episode of Captain Planet where a planeteer is offered drugs, does them and then looks for instagram likes about how horrible it was a couple of years later. If anybody has that on VHS shoot me a copy. That's the problem with kids today, no good cartoons. Maybe if Stephen Universe spent more time battling cosmic coke heads instead of promoting alternative lifestyles and having a good cry, this kid would have had the wisdom to say no.

 

[HockeyPops]

This kid is a victim. How you cannot see that, I have no idea.

 

[TheGremlin]

This kid is a victim. How you cannot see that, I have no idea.

Don’t worry. Master doesn’t always see things the way others do. You just ignore him and move on.

 

[Crease Master]

This kid is a victim. How you cannot see that, I have no idea.

I don't subscribe to the modern theory that everyone who faces a tough decision is a victim. He're some help courtesy of a dictionary:

vic·tim
noun
noun: victim; plural noun: victims

1. a person harmed, injured, or killed as a result of a crime, accident, or other event or action.
2. a person who is tricked or duped.
3. a living creature killed as a religious sacrifice.

Strangely I don't see "a person who willingly does drugs because he wants to fit in with his peers" listed here. A case could be made that he was duped into taking the drugs but even that's a stretch. He went into a bathroom with other men at a party. Lets not pretend he thought they needed help with their zipper, ok?

 

[punch1943]

C.M. He was a victim. He was at the time also a minor. Whether the player who provided the drug(s) was also a minor or not is immaterial.

 

[HockeyPops]

While peer pressure is also an issue, this goes way, way beyond peer pressure.

When every adult you could turn to is decentivized from helping you, that is an issue.
When all of your peers are decentivized from stepping in when they see something wrong, that is an issue.
When your lifelong goals and dreams are at risk if you yourself speak up, that is an issue.

But that's fine. Brush this 16 year old off as not being man enough, instead of understanding the systemic problems still plaguing the league, and advocating for their change. Even though it repulses me and disgusts me to think any kid would be put in that situation, I suppose you have the freedom to say there is nothing wrong with it and instead he may have been the one at fault. I will surely not change your mind, but at least others might realize not everyone on this board subscribes to your thoughts on this.

 

[Square Corners]

I don't subscribe to the modern theory that everyone who faces a tough decision is a victim. He're some help courtesy of a dictionary:

vic·tim
noun
noun: victim; plural noun: victims

1. a person harmed, injured, or killed as a result of a crime, accident, or other event or action.
2. a person who is tricked or duped.
3. a living creature killed as a religious sacrifice.

Strangely I don't see "a person who willingly does drugs because he wants to fit in with his peers" listed here. A case could be made that he was duped into taking the drugs but even that's a stretch. He went into a bathroom with other men at a party. Lets not pretend he thought they needed help with their zipper, ok?

So it's textbook #1 of the definitions you provided lol.

He was harmed (clearly mentally and you could also probaby argue physically as well) as a result of a crime (giving drugs to a minor)

 

[Crease Master]

Sure he's a victim if you want him to be, but I see it differently. He was a kid who faced a difficult choice and made the wrong one. Now he regrets it and is using social media to make himself feel better with some juicy attention and sympathy. Good for you kid, you are truly the modern man. Take no responsibility for your actions and blame your failures on the system, attaboy!

 

[RayzorIsDull]

C.M. He was a victim. He was at the time also a minor. Whether the player who provided the drug(s) was also a minor or not is immaterial.

Right and when you include the criminal nature of this yes he was a victim. Of course since Guest seemingly isn't willing to talk I can't see this case getting off the ground. If nobody at the party is willing to talk or say names and the organization didn't know about it this case is finished before it started.

 

[Otto]

Take no responsibility for your actions and blame your failures on the system, attaboy!

From the guy who at the top of the page blames Dave Branch for the Spitfires woes

 

[TheGremlin]

I’m pretty sure the kid said nothing about it causing his failures. Also if an older kid locks a door and tells you that you aren’t leaving until you do this the chances are you will eventually give in and do it just to get out of situation and want to be left alone. There is a lot of things that go on in this league that shouldn’t. Forcing someone to do something isn’t right. Having to fear that if you say something your hockey career may be over isn’t right either. I’ve heard things that former Spits players have done recently and its pretty disgusting. This kinda stuff needs to get out of this league. These kids need to be held to a different standard then normal high school kids.

 

[member 71782]

Only two Spits prospects invited to the US U20 Summer Showcase camp, Tuch and Fensore.

No Webber, Evans or McKown or any other US prospects.

Anyone have any info on the possibility of any of these longshot flyers showing up? I believe all but McKown have NCAA commitments. Webber had a Boston commitment but played in the BCHL at one point last season so we'll have to see if he's at Boston this year.

Webber and Fensore are both NHL drafted while Tuch, Evans and McKown I believe are all draft eligible this year.

I doubt we see any, particularly Fensore but a couple of flyers reporting would help this team a lot going forward.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

Only two Spits prospects invited to the US U20 Summer Showcase camp, Tuch and Fensore.

No Webber, Evans or McKown or any other US prospects.

Anyone have any info on the possibility of any of these longshot flyers showing up? I believe all but McKown have NCAA commitments. Webber had a Boston commitment but played in the BCHL at one point last season so we'll have to see if he's at Boston this year.

Webber and Fensore are both NHL drafted while Tuch, Evans and McKown I believe are all draft eligible this year.

I doubt we see any, particularly Fensore but a couple of flyers reporting would help this team a lot going forward.

Bowler working the phones to make some acquisitions.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

Is anyone left praying at the altar of junior hockey??? Bueller?? Bueller???

More explosive and shocking allegations against junior hockey in newly filed lawsuit - TheHockeyNews

 

[OHLTG]

This is going to get bigger and bigger as it goes along... and rightfully so.

 

[Otto]

Is anyone left praying at the altar of junior hockey??? Bueller?? Bueller???

More explosive and shocking allegations against junior hockey in newly filed lawsuit - TheHockeyNews

I'd be curious to know how many players are taking part in the class action

 

[aresknights]

Is anyone left praying at the altar of junior hockey??? Bueller?? Bueller???

More explosive and shocking allegations against junior hockey in newly filed lawsuit - TheHockeyNews

This makes me sick. If any part of it is true.
So wrong. Ill bite my tongue for now.

 

[tomschman]

This makes me sick. If any part of it is true.
So wrong. Ill bite my tongue for now.

The article says that some of this was done in front of the coaches. If that is true those coaches should be banned from the CHL for life. If that happens, hopefully ALL other leagues in North America (and possibly the World) should also honor those suspensions.

The players should also be dealt with, but in reality it might have happened to them in their rookie year. While that doesn't make it right, they could be on both sides of lawsuits. I don't believe the saying that boys will be boys is an excuse. The teams have to teach their players that this is not acceptable. The way teenagers talk, I believe that all of this gets back to management and they just choose to ignore it. Junior players are periodically charged with sexual assault. The same mentality runs wild through teenage boys minds. The peer pressure makes it worse. This does not apply to just hockey players, but many teenage boys. I comes out more on teams of any kind, because no one wants to be an outsider. As I mentioned previously, management needs to be on the watch for all of it. The Spitfires had a player convicted of sexual assault as result of an incident at a team sponsored party. The player alleged that it was consensual but the underage victim was determined to be too drunk to consent. Where was Spitfire Management when underage people were getting drunk at their party.

 

[OHLTG]

One of the things that bugged me pretty good when I was reading everything earlier was the attitude that speaking out is the player's way of looking for fame. That 15-min in the spotlight. I realize we're in the social media age where every Joe Schmoe can get behind a keyboard and say anything they want without repercussion but holy cow, get a life. Imagine going through the things the players did, feeling firmly that you can't say anything or do anything without your hockey career being done (which, in many cases, is all they know). At some point, you hit that breaking point where you need to speak out. I applaud guys like Guest for going "here's the reality." Light needs to be shed on situations, whether that's liked by the Joe Schmoe's of the world or not. The stuff I've read is horrifying and I cannot imagine anyone going through that, let alone at such a young age. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. A serious culture change is needed throughout the hockey world.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

The article says that some of this was done in front of the coaches. If that is true those coaches should be banned from the CHL for life. If that happens, hopefully ALL other leagues in North America (and possibly the World) should also honor those suspensions.

The players should also be dealt with, but in reality it might have happened to them in their rookie year. While that doesn't make it right, they could be on both sides of lawsuits. I don't believe the saying that boys will be boys is an excuse. The teams have to teach their players that this is not acceptable. The way teenagers talk, I believe that all of this gets back to management and they just choose to ignore it. Junior players are periodically charged with sexual assault. The same mentality runs wild through teenage boys minds. The peer pressure makes it worse. This does not apply to just hockey players, but many teenage boys. I comes out more on teams of any kind, because no one wants to be an outsider. As I mentioned previously, management needs to be on the watch for all of it. The Spitfires had a player convicted of sexual assault as result of an incident at a team sponsored party. The player alleged that it was consensual but the underage victim was determined to be too drunk to consent. Where was Spitfire Management when underage people were getting drunk at their party.

I would agree everything comes from the top. As they say a fish rots from the head. Leadership in individual organizations or lack thereof in this instance is the root cause for all these problems. In certain cases mentioned coaches laughing it off, tossing a blind eye to it. Not creating an atmosphere where players feel comfortable enough to tell coaches/management etc.. Also leadership in the case of the OHL with Branch. He's had his time and I'm not sure the purpose he serves with the educational lawsuit done, now another class action lawsuit. A guy has over stayed his welcome and at this time the chickens have come home to roost.

 

[Otto]

The article says that some of this was done in front of the coaches. If that is true those coaches should be banned from the CHL for life. If that happens, hopefully ALL other leagues in North America (and possibly the World) should also honor those suspensions.

The players should also be dealt with, but in reality it might have happened to them in their rookie year. While that doesn't make it right, they could be on both sides of lawsuits. I don't believe the saying that boys will be boys is an excuse. The teams have to teach their players that this is not acceptable. The way teenagers talk, I believe that all of this gets back to management and they just choose to ignore it. Junior players are periodically charged with sexual assault. The same mentality runs wild through teenage boys minds. The peer pressure makes it worse. This does not apply to just hockey players, but many teenage boys. I comes out more on teams of any kind, because no one wants to be an outsider. As I mentioned previously, management needs to be on the watch for all of it. The Spitfires had a player convicted of sexual assault as result of an incident at a team sponsored party. The player alleged that it was consensual but the underage victim was determined to be too drunk to consent. Where was Spitfire Management when underage people were getting drunk at their party.

Jeff Perry was with the Knights for two seasons after he left Sarnia and then mysteriously disappeared …

 

[punch1943]

Owen Sound notice to season ticket holders.....//Season Ticket Members! You asked and we listened! We have extended the Early Bird Deadline to July 31st.
Probably a good idea for all OHL teams...

 

[windsor7]

Owen Sound notice to season ticket holders.....//Season Ticket Members! You asked and we listened! We have extended the Early Bird Deadline to July 31st.
Probably a good idea for all OHL teams...

Probably good to extend Windsors to September. Lol

 

[I guard the door]

Let's surmise for a little..... with people here calling for Letowski's head, and the events happening in Buffalo and Rochester, what are the thoughts of replacing him with Chris Taylor who was Rochester's head coach? Would he come? Other than the final year of Letowski's contract, what would it cost?

 

[windsor7]

Let's surmise for a little..... with people here calling for Letowski's head, and the events happening in Buffalo and Rochester, what are the thoughts of replacing him with Chris Taylor who was Rochester's head coach? Would he come? Other than the final year of Letowski's contract, what would it cost?

Not thinking savage would open up their pocketbook.
Thinking they will stay cheap. Seems to be working lol