Speculation: Will the 11th Overall Pick be traded ?

[Buresflyingelbow]

We traded a 1st round pick and the lesser of the two we had. We will not be trading ours and if we do it will be to move up or move back and acquire extra assets.

 

[credulous]

Wouldn’t mind Carlo or Erik cernak for the 11th pick.

i think at least one of them moves and will move for less than hronek moved for. one of the reasons i disliked the hronek deal so much

 

[MS]

i think at least one of them moves and will move for less than hronek moved for. one of the reasons i disliked the hronek deal so much

Carlo getting moved makes zero sense to me.

He's a pretty integral player in their top-4 signed long-term at a very good price at $4 million and they have Mike Reilly and Derek Forbort as spare parts on that blueline making $3 million.

When they make a move, it will be to pay to dump those guys, not to dump a prime-age near-core player.

 

[Nuckster]

Carlo getting moved makes zero sense to me.

He's a pretty integral player in their top-4 signed long-term at a very good price at $4 million and they have Mike Reilly and Derek Forbort as spare parts on that blueline making $3 million.

When they make a move, it will be to pay to dump those guys, not to dump a prime-age near-core player.

And to add, if they're forced to move Carlo is because they are in a cap crunch. You don't give them our 11th overall to help them out

 

[MS]

And to add, if they're forced to move Carlo is because they are in a cap crunch. You don't give them our 11th overall to help them out

Yeah, I like Carlo as a player but you aren't trading #11 - which again, to me, is like a top-5 pick in most drafts - for 4 years of team control on a #4 defender.

That pick probably has about a 50% chance of being an impact top line/top pairing player. The value there is absolutely massive.

Carlo is the sort of asset you'd move, like, Hoglander or Podkolzin and a 2nd for or something like that.

But again, it makes no sense to me that they'd trade Carlo for cap space when they have two much worse defenders in Forbort/Reilly that they could pay a pick for someone to take, and who clear nearly as much cap space.

 

[Nick Lang]

It is completely unrealistic to expect it to have stayed at exactly 13th in any scenario. 13-15 was the ideal. 17 is close enough to the ideal that it absolutely did not motivate a trade to capture the ~2 spots advantage like someone else was trying to say.

Especially in this draft.


There's no way that the protection on the pick added value to it let alone enough value to motivate a trade. I would have been very unhappy if we had kept it and it bumped to next year. 17th in this draft is better than 10th next year so the Isles have to be a lot worse next year than this year, and it's far from guaranteed that the Isles are worse at all next year.

Not a huge difference but they had a real chance of staying where they were and even a chance that became a high lottery pick next year. The other teams also had 4 games on them at that point, the Isles went on a run, even with Barzal going down. Certainly 13 is better than 17 and we came out pretty good in terms of how it could have gone. I think that's the point.

 

[CanucksSayEh]

Dont watch many Bos games, but every time I do, I think, hmm, this Carlo guy kinda sucks..

 

[me2]

And to add, if they're forced to move Carlo is because they are in a cap crunch. You don't give them our 11th overall to help them out

It's only cap dumps that nobody wants that the buyer has the option to play that hard. For useful players it is who you are negotiating against for the player, in that case you are giving up more than what those competitor othera tems offer. Cap issues or not won't change Carlo's value in a bidding war.

 

[MarkusNaslund19]

It is completely unrealistic to expect it to have stayed at exactly 13th in any scenario. 13-15 was the ideal. 17 is close enough to the ideal that it absolutely did not motivate a trade to capture the ~2 spots advantage like someone else was trying to say.

Especially in this draft.


There's no way that the protection on the pick added value to it let alone enough value to motivate a trade. I would have been very unhappy if we had kept it and it bumped to next year. 17th in this draft is better than 10th next year so the Isles have to be a lot worse next year than this year, and it's far from guaranteed that the Isles are worse at all next year.

You're free to express your own feelings about it, but the possibility of an unprotected 2024 pick was very enticing.

Let's not forget that they finished with the 7th seed in the east WITH Sorokin having an almost historically strong season, their cap situation is pretty f***ed and they have some of the worst prospect depth/high-end in the entire league.

So if one or two injuries happened, or Sorokin had a year like Demko just did that pick could have been looking at Celebrini. You're free to have an opinion, but that definitely adds value to the pick at the time of the trade.

 

[lawrence]

Massive rumours on Reddit circulating Blackhawk’s is trying to move the 19th pick up.

11th pick for 19th and 35th pick.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

Massive rumours on Reddit circulating Blackhawk’s is trying to move the 19th pick up.

11th pick for 19th and 35th pick.

Maybe, but only if they'll take Myers and/or Boeser too.

 

[Nuckster]

Maybe, but only if they'll take Myers and/or Boeser too.

Why do people keep talking about Myers? After Sept 1 after his $5 mil bonus is paid, alot of cap floor, lower cap teams would be happy to take him.

1. He's only paid 1 mil cash at that stage, owners are happy. But has a 6 mil cap hit. Its perfect for cheap owners. You pay very little cash but get a sizable cap hit to be above the floor.

2. He's a 6'6" RD who can skate, those are valuable assets. And he doesn't "suck". He is overused here and over paid for the role he fits. But given #1 clearly that's taking care of itself for a low cap team.

3. He's on an expiring contract, therefore he's a valuable asset for a rebuilding/cap floor team looking for futures at the trade deadline. RD's are valuable assets, he's big, and can skate, playoff teams would love him as a rental, so the buyer of him after Sept 1 gets some assets back later.

Myers is a player who will easily be moved after Sept. There's no need to pay someone to take him. Someone is willing to OEL off our hands for trading the 11 and moving down, then we talk. We don't need to move the 11th overall to move Myers on an expiring contract, that's just silly

 

[Breakers]

I hope we don’t trade with Chicago

That past Chicago trade was franking embarrassing for us.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Why do people keep talking about Myers? After Sept 1 after his $5 mil bonus is paid, alot of cap floor, lower cap teams would be happy to take him.

1. He's only paid 1 mil cash at that stage, owners are happy. But has a 6 mil cap hit. Its perfect for cheap owners. You pay very little cash but get a sizable cap hit to be above the floor.

2. He's a 6'6" RD who can skate, those are valuable assets. And he doesn't "suck". He is overused here and over paid for the role he fits. But given #1 clearly that's taking care of itself for a low cap team.

3. He's on an expiring contract, therefore he's a valuable asset for a rebuilding/cap floor team looking for futures at the trade deadline. RD's are valuable assets, he's big, and can skate, playoff teams would love him as a rental, so the buyer of him after Sept 1 gets some assets back later.

Myers is a player who will easily be moved after Sept. There's no need to pay someone to take him. Someone is willing to OEL off our hands for trading the 11 and moving down, then we talk. We don't need to move the 11th overall to move Myers on an expiring contract, that's just silly

Agreed..giving up a possible future impact player ( that we will have on an ELC) to alleviate yourself from Tyler Myers ( in the final year of his contract) is just so incredibly idiotic.

 

[strattonius]

Why do people keep talking about Myers? After Sept 1 after his $5 mil bonus is paid, alot of cap floor, lower cap teams would be happy to take him.

1. He's only paid 1 mil cash at that stage, owners are happy. But has a 6 mil cap hit. Its perfect for cheap owners. You pay very little cash but get a sizable cap hit to be above the floor.

2. He's a 6'6" RD who can skate, those are valuable assets. And he doesn't "suck". He is overused here and over paid for the role he fits. But given #1 clearly that's taking care of itself for a low cap team.

3. He's on an expiring contract, therefore he's a valuable asset for a rebuilding/cap floor team looking for futures at the trade deadline. RD's are valuable assets, he's big, and can skate, playoff teams would love him as a rental, so the buyer of him after Sept 1 gets some assets back later.

Myers is a player who will easily be moved after Sept. There's no need to pay someone to take him. Someone is willing to OEL off our hands for trading the 11 and moving down, then we talk. We don't need to move the 11th overall to move Myers on an expiring contract, that's just silly

Okay you give this PowerPoint presentation to all the GM's in the league and we should be happily rid of Myers. Excellent work.

 

[Nuckster]

Agreed..giving up a possible future impact player ( that we will have on an ELC) to alleviate yourself from Tyler Myers ( in the final year of his contract) is just so incredibly idiotic.

Its funny, because many of the same people (media and otherwise) who roasted benning for moving Errikson, Roussel and Beagle in the last year of their contract for a quick fix (that didn't work) now are suggesting the same with Myers, who actually has some value.

 

[racerjoe]

Its funny, because many of the same people (media and otherwise) who roasted benning for moving Errikson, Roussel and Beagle in the last year of their contract for a quick fix (that didn't work) now are suggesting the same with Myers, who actually has some value.

This misses the entire point of what people are saying.

 

[BluesyShoes]

Trading the pick to move out cap is too short sighted. Thinking this 11th pick is the asset to solve our problems is pure desperation. Realistically it won't move the needle. Next year is a total success if we make the playoffs, expectations are pretty low. Even hypothectically, replacing OEL next season with a $7.5M FA d-man doesn't project us as a contender, not even close.

This past season was such a mess it is hard to evaluate what we even have. Unless a hockey trade presents itself to move a winger, we should really bet on the team performing better out of the gate instead of the historically bad first half they put together last year. If they repeat that again, keeping the pick will have been even more justified.

In any case, the 11th pick coming in on an ELC in 2-3 years will be much more valuable then moving it for cap in years we have given no reason to project as a playoff team. We should sit and suffer through the bed we made while unsavory contracts become more tradable or expire. The most we can hope for next year is that they put together a consistent year how they played under Tochett and that maybe a market develops for some of these players through the course of the season.

 

[Nuckster]

This misses the entire point of what people are saying.

I think you're projecting here

 

[Nuckster]

Okay you give this PowerPoint presentation to all the GM's in the league and we should be happily rid of Myers. Excellent work.

lets wait and see what happens, and when I'm right you can pretend you're not wrong and not respond when I call you out on it.

 

[strattonius]

lets wait and see what happens, and when I'm right you can pretend you're not wrong and not respond when I call you out on it.

I'm happy to be wrong on this one. It would mean no more Tyler Myers.

Let's not confuse the argument though:
-You think Myers will be moved free of charge this summer because his bonus will be paid and a team will be looking to hit the CAP floor.
-I think if Myers were to be moved we would have to add an asset. Myers has to waive his NMC as well.

Your odds aren't good my dude, but I admire your optimism.

 

[EverTheCynic]

So long as we're moving the pick in a package for Brad Richards, I'm all for it

 

[Nuckster]

I'm happy to be wrong on this one. It would mean no more Tyler Myers.

Let's not confuse the argument though:
-You think Myers will be moved free of charge this summer because his bonus will be paid and a team will be looking to hit the CAP floor.
-I think if Myers were to be moved we would have to add an asset. Myers has to waive his NMC as well.

Your odds aren't good my dude, but I admire your optimism.

Your Canuck's fan bias is showing. Myers does not "suck". Yes he didn't have a good year, but all the years prior he has played pretty well for us.

He played alot better with the new coaching staff, he has played very well at the worlds, and the issue with him is not skating or age.

I don't think you, and many are recognizing that strong skating RD are at a premium. Mid year, this year, not many teams had cap room. In fact most of the trades in prior to the deadline involved the Canucks for that reason.

When a season is over, teams have turnover, they have contracts that expire, they gain cap space. Add in cap floor teams and the issue I mentioned, well we aren't giving away Myers for Free. We're giving someone else the asset that will return something pretty decent at the deadline as a rental which is the 'extra asset'. That is value to a team, particularly a rebuilding one.

If you think 6'6" RD who can skate and are physical and are on expiring contracts are not of value at the trade deadline to playoff teams, I am not sure how much hockey you watch. Because defensive depth is one of the most important aspects of winning a cup.

 

[strattonius]

Your Canuck's fan bias is showing. Myers does not "suck". Yes he didn't have a good year, but all the years prior he has played pretty well for us.

He played alot better with the new coaching staff, he has played very well at the worlds, and the issue with him is not skating or age.

I don't think you, and many are recognizing that strong skating RD are at a premium. Mid year, this year, not many teams had cap room. In fact most of the trades in prior to the deadline involved the Canucks for that reason.

When a season is over, teams have turnover, they have contracts that expire, they gain cap space. Add in cap floor teams and the issue I mentioned, well we aren't giving away Myers for Free. We're giving someone else the asset that will return something pretty decent at the deadline as a rental which is the 'extra asset'. That is value to a team, particularly a rebuilding one.

If you think 6'6" RD who can skate and are physical and are on expiring contracts are not of value at the trade deadline to playoff teams, I am not sure how much hockey you watch. Because defensive depth is one of the most important aspects of winning a cup.

I am not talking about next trade deadline. His value will have changed dramatically and there's a chance a team will take on an expiring contract in return for a draft pick - agreed.

But we were talking about this summer/off-season. Or to be more precise, shortly after Myers' bonus is paid. Is this not what you have been arguing about? The two timelines change everything.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

I'm happy to be wrong on this one. It would mean no more Tyler Myers.

Let's not confuse the argument though:
-You think Myers will be moved free of charge this summer because his bonus will be paid and a team will be looking to hit the CAP floor.
-I think if Myers were to be moved we would have to add an asset. Myers has to waive his NMC as well.

Your odds aren't good my dude, but I admire your optimism.

Yeah,no..

There was even strong interest in Myers at last seasons TDL

When his $5M bonus is paid,he will be very tradeable indeed…appealing to teams with tighter budgets.