Why is hockey the only sport not to produce a GOAT-calibre player in the last decade or so?

[Turin]

And other sports haven't?

Not on the same curve, not even close.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

And other sports haven't?

Not to the extent it effects hockey really. Most sports there is still a reasonable comparison across eras. There isnt in hockey. You simply cant compare 80s numbers to numbers today it is impossible. Which then makes records set in the 80s entirely unreachable. Other sports really dont have that problem.

 

[I am not exposed]

Not to the extent it effects hockey really. Most sports there is still a reasonable comparison across eras. There isnt in hockey. You simply cant compare 80s numbers to numbers today it is impossible. Which then makes records set in the 80s entirely unreachable. Other sports really dont have that problem.

I mean I grew up watching rugby union and football (soccer) in that era. Rugby wasn't even a professional sport until the mid 90s!

 

[Eisen]

Don't be silly, there are many athletes more physically gifted than Lemieux, even relative to his peers. One such example is the wrestler Alexander Karelin. Don't have his numbers in front of me but I recall he didn't loose a single point in a bout in over ten years.

Karelin was known as an absolute maniac when it came to training. I don't know if you could call that gifted. He worked hard for that.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

I mean I grew up watching rugby union and football (soccer) in that era. Rugby wasn't even a professional sport until the mid 90s!

That's fair I really have no idea about rugby.

 

[Eisen]

Ok, so which male tennis player is better than Federer and Nadal?

Rod Laver has a case. He won an astonishing 200 single titles.

 

[Eisen]

Not on the same curve, not even close.

Soccer did. The game is completely different from the 80s.

 

[djpatm]

I seriously think Crosby could’ve been that GOAT-tier player if not for injuries. During his injury plagued years, he scored at a ridiculous clip:

2006-07: 72P in 53 GP (111 point pace)
2010-11: 66P in 41 GP (132 point pace)
2011-12: 37P in 22 GP (137 point pace)
2012-13: 56P in 36GP (127 point pace, or 75 points in the shortened season)

Even if you assume he cools down and finishes around 5–15 points less than his projected totals, Crosby still wins the Ross comfortably in 2011, 2012, and 2013, and presumably takes the Hart those seasons as well.

Add that to his 3 Cups, 2 Smythes, 2 Rockets, 2 Rosses and 2 Harts and you got a resume stacked enough to challenge anyone not named Wayne or Mario.

Staying healthy is part of being a GOAT.

 

[KlefDown]

what other sports have produced a GOAT in the last 10 years?

Messi, Ronaldo
Trout
LeBron James
Brady

 

[djpatm]

Nadal and Djokovic are both better than Federer.

lol. Yes, in the sense that they have both won less often and have a far lower peak for less time, sure.

 

[Jumptheshark]

disagree with the theory the OP has given out and his defending

McDavid looks to be on that level--Sid the Kid will be in the discussion for being one of the best all time

Alex O?

I think it is hard to compare say Babe Ruth to say Yelch and other ball players--different time

and I think this (get ready to be offended) we are dealing with an era where the younger generation of fans has a default setting where some current player is better than all players that came before him

Topping the likes of Jordon and Gretz will be hard to do

 

[Los merengues]

Karelin was known as an absolute maniac when it came to training. I don't know if you could call that gifted. He worked hard for that.

Guy had palms the size of frying pans. Absolute manster that man.

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

lol. Yes, in the sense that they have both won less often and have a far lower peak for less time, sure.

No, in the sense that they have spanked him on every surface and dominate him H2H. They just had the misfortune of competing against each other and not against random chumps like Hewitt and Roddick. Easy to pick up wins with no competition.

 

[King Mapes]

He won six in a row if you're talking about full seasons he played in. The Bulls lost in 1995 to the Magic with him, but he was joining the team very late in the season out of basketball shape that year. The next year where he had a full training camp + regular season they won the title and would win another two after that, so a second threepeat.

Also that season (95-96) is probably the greatest season in NBA history -- a then record 72 wins + a championship, so he has that on his resume too (best player on the team with the greatest full season ... sorry Golden State).

Ah thanks. I could have looked it up but you know. Sill though, that’s crazy to think. Jordan was such an animal to watch. Jordan in basketball was like Gretzky in hockey and they likely won’t be touched for some time

 

[Eisen]

Guy had palms the size of frying pans. Absolute manster that man.

Yeah, but that's not that what set him apart. Size is common in that weight class. It was his sheer strength. He had this one move that he often performed when he grabbed around the waist of an opponent while reaching over their head and he would just flip them. Nobody did it like him, probably because they couldn't.

 

[djpatm]

No, in the sense that they have spanked him on every surface and dominate him H2H. They just had the misfortune of competing against each other and not against random chumps like Hewitt and Roddick. Easy to pick up wins with no competition.

You ever think that everyone that Roger spanked was viewed as a chump because Roger made them into a chump during his prime? Nadal didn't come on the scene until Federer was already in his mid twenties, Novak even later. Nadal is a one surface pony and Federer leads him on every other surface.

Roger has:

The Most Grand Slams
Defended the Most Grand Slams
The Most Grand Slam Finals Appearances (by a mile)
Most consecutive Grand Slam finals (10! that's almost 3 years)
The Most Grand Slam wins
The most consecutive ATP events won
The most weeks at #1 (nearly 6 years)
The most consecutive weeks at #1
the most consecutive weeks at #2
The most weeks at #2 (10 years)

It's not even close. There are great tennis players whose entire careers are shorter than the time Federer has been top 2 in the world. He is untouchable and at 38 years old, 10 years after most tennis players already are on the decline, is a favorite at every grand slam.

 

[StoneHands]

Messi, Ronaldo
Trout
LeBron James
Brady

This is Brady's 20th NFL season.
MJ was better than Lebron. Even if you disagree there's no doubt that there's a debate.
Trout is not the best baseball player of all time. He could be someday but the same can be said for McDavid so if that's the standard we're going on then this thread doesn't make sense.

 

[P10p]

Every other sport seems to have produced at least one GOAT-level player while no one has come remotely close to entering that zone in hockey since Mario retired. Crosby and Ovi are great and all but they're simply not on that level, and one can argue that neither of them are even top 10 players of all time; it's also wayyyyy too early to put McDavid near that category.

Additionally, no goalie since Brodeur has been a GOAT or high-end ATG goalie either. There's probably a greater depth of goalies rn but none of them are exactly standout generational goalies.

Is it just the nature of the game in terms of how much it's changed or have prior greats like Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Howe, etc. set the bar too high for anyone to reach?

Ovechkin is the best goal scorer in nhl history. How is that not GOAT....

 

[P10p]

Also hockey and its fans romantisize the fact that alot of greats feasted on players who could barely skate. Much harder to do now..

 

[lomiller1]

Messi, Ronaldo

Not over Pele

Trout

Not over Babe Ruth, Ted Williams, just off the top of my head

LeBron James

Not over Wilt Chamberlin

Brady

He’s a possibility. He has championships and longevity, but did he really out produce his peers in terms of raw performance? I’d still be inclined to rank Marino as the top QB, and comparing other positions becomes very difficult.

 

[deckercky]

Also hockey and its fans romantisize the fact that alot of greats feasted on players who could barely skate. Much harder to do now..

Disagree. Certainly there were goons to feast on, and poor goaltenders that aren't around anymore, but why didn't other players feast on those goons to the same extent? Crosby for a brief moment looked to be approaching those levels, but only in the midst of several injury plagued seasons.

Crosby, Ovechkin and Jagr are in, or on the cusp of the top 10 all time players, but nothing they've done makes them contenders for unseating any of the big 4.

 

[P10p]

Disagree. Certainly there were goons to feast on, and poor goaltenders that aren't around anymore, but why didn't other players feast on those goons to the same extent? Crosby for a brief moment looked to be approaching those levels, but only in the midst of several injury plagued seasons.

Crosby, Ovechkin and Jagr are in, or on the cusp of the top 10 all time players, but nothing they've done makes them contenders for unseating any of the big 4.

Good catch, I didn't mean to imply everyone was garbage back then. Simply more so less parity. The top player across the board produced HUGE numbers while alot of depth guys just weren't up to snuff.

Also, imo, crosby seems to be getting there and is making his case stronger as each season passes.

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

You ever think that everyone that Roger spanked was viewed as a chump because Roger made them into a chump during his prime? Nadal didn't come on the scene until Federer was already in his mid twenties, Novak even later. Nadal is a one surface pony and Federer leads him on every other surface.

Roger has:

The Most Grand Slams
Defended the Most Grand Slams
The Most Grand Slam Finals Appearances (by a mile)
Most consecutive Grand Slam finals (10! that's almost 3 years)
The Most Grand Slam wins
The most consecutive ATP events won
The most weeks at #1 (nearly 6 years)
The most consecutive weeks at #1
the most consecutive weeks at #2
The most weeks at #2 (10 years)

It's not even close. There are great tennis players whose entire careers are shorter than the time Federer has been top 2 in the world. He is untouchable and at 38 years old, 10 years after most tennis players already are on the decline, is a favorite at every grand slam.

No those players were just chumps. It's not a coincidence that as soon as Nadal and Djokovic showed up that Federer started losing. Don't really care about the stats he racked up facing zero competition. Nadal is a "one surface pony" yet he has a career golden slam, has won a GS on 3 different surfaces in the same year and has at least 2 GS on every surface. Btw, Federer has none of those things. But yeah, "one surface pony" lol

 

[djpatm]

No those players were just chumps. It's not a coincidence that as soon as Nadal and Djokovic showed up that Federer started losing. Don't really care about the stats he racked up facing zero competition. Nadal is a "one surface pony" yet he has a career golden slam, has won a GS on 3 different surfaces in the same year and has at least 2 GS on every surface. Btw, Federer has none of those things. But yeah, "one surface pony" lol

What would you call 12 of his 18 grandslams being the French?

Guy has won one Australian Open. No different than Federer winning one French Open.

There is no doubt that Nadal is the GOAT of Clay Tennis though, I'll give you that. Outside of Clay? He's Murray.

 

[Eisen]

Ovechkin is the best goal scorer in nhl history. How is that not GOAT....

If one facet of the game counts than we have a gazillion goats. And it's even debatable if he's the greatest goalscorer (and no, it's not Bossy).