Boston Sports Journal Weighing the cost, challenges for Bruins in a potential Jack Eichel blockbuster trade

[Smitty93]

I'm legitimately impressed that we managed to create 3+ pages of discussion out of a non-story. Well done!

But seriously, I keep seeing deals thrown out that are basically DeBrusk, a 1st rd pick, and a couple prospects. Why on earth does Buffalo agree to that? That's a terrible deal for them. We're seriously overrating DeBrusk and our prospects if we think that's anywhere close to enough.

They hang up the phone immediately if the offer doesn't start with Pastrnak or McAvoy, which, of course, Sweeney would never do. Just because the Bruins have been dumb enough to trade multiple stars for 50 cents on the dollar doesn't mean that another team is. Now, if Chiarelli gets hired again, then we can start talking.

 

[DKH]

Eichel never should have signed with Buffalo - he could have forced his way here by age 26

 

[DKH]

Trade pieces aside, with his focus on character, I also wonder if Sweeney would really want to integrate someone who was labeled as a "brooding superstar, a general manager and coach killer who’d throw his own grandmother under the bus."

I’m from Eichel country. Multiple co workers have kids who played with him, know him, know the family. I’ll go by them and people I know at BU hockey program and other assorteds.

Eichel would be great here on and off the ice.

he probably knows he f***ed up signing in Buffalo

 

[RussellmaniaKW]

I’m from Eichel country. Multiple co workers have kids who played with him, know him, know the family. I’ll go by them and people I know at BU hockey program and other assorteds.

Eichel would be great here on and off the ice.

he probably knows he f***ed up signing in Buffalo

I think he's thrilled he got his guaranteed money. It's only a matter of time before he gets traded somewhere better so he gets to have his cake & eat it too.

 

[FMichael]

Outsider here lurking...Made me think - would Buffalo be interested in shipping him to Detroit if the Wings win the lottery and Yzerman is willing to part with it ?

 

[PB37]

Outsider here lurking...Made me think - would Buffalo be interested in shipping him to Detroit if the Wings win the lottery and Yzerman is willing to part with it ?

Eichel and Larkin down the middle would be a great way to help jump start a new run for the franchise.

 

[JoeIsAStud]

Outsider here lurking...Made me think - would Buffalo be interested in shipping him to Detroit if the Wings win the lottery and Yzerman is willing to part with it ?

I don't see why Detroit would do that though. Lafreniere is from all accounts expected to be a similar talent to Eichel. And Detroit is awful now, so why would they want to give up 5 years of career and take on the huge contact at this point.

Honestly I don't see why Buffalo would want to either as they are much closer to competing than Detroit is, so it doesn't really make sense for them to start the rebuild over again

 

[DKH]

I think he's thrilled he got his guaranteed money. It's only a matter of time before he gets traded somewhere better so he gets to have his cake & eat it too.

I think he would be thrilled on the Bruins

however the Sabres should get a stud player this draft to go along with last years pick

I can see them being very good very shortly and Eichel going nowhere

 

[Aussie Bruin]

While it sounds great, is that actually the case though? I would argue it takes a lot of trust in management to execute on that and almost no management, including ours, should really be trusted to do that when it means taking bread off your own table. I would also definitely make the case that Buffalo is not a $2M player away from success.

Let's look in the mirror at Boston: Have the B's rewarded their core for taking below market deals?(Though I would argue Krejci's was a market deal). This year at the beginning of the season the combined cap hit of Dennis Seidenberg, Matt Beleskey, David Backes, and John Moore was $11.816 million dollars. Meanwhile, David Krejci played with 36 different right wingers including my uncle Mark who got a stab at it for being lucky number 9 to walk into the garden on "meet your heroes" night. If that $11.816M in cap was allocated to David Pastrnak, Patrice Bergeron, Brad Marchand, and Tuukka Rask would the team have looked any different?

Sure we've had success, but the foundation of that success hasn't been amazing cap management due to our core taking below market deals. Honestly, that's not the foundation of the success on the other team that you mentioned as well, St. Louis. They haven't treated free agency like a 2AM Vegas Buffett but they have a handful of bad deals.

I would argue that getting production out of your ELC's around your core is significantly more important than trying to squeeze your stars for money. When you look at the B's getting significant production from DeBrusk, McAvoy, Bjork, Lauzon, Clifton, Carlo, etc. over the last 2 years THAT is the driving force on having a good team. Same case with St. Louis: Thomas, Dunn, Sanford, Blais, Barbashev, Binnington,

That's simply something that Buffalo hasn't had. Not only have they not been accumulating picks but the picks they've used have been wiffs and their acquisitions are a muddy mess of people clearly trying to keep their jobs with a very volatile ownership group.

I also think $10M today for Eichel is an okay price, I'm with you there. He's a playmaker so on a bad team it doesn't show through in the stat lines or highlights but when you watch Buffalo I would argue only McDavid and MacKinnon influence a game more than Jack Eichel does at forward on an individual level. The problem is it's like the '13 finals when Tyler Seguin was threading the needle to Chris Kelly and Kaspars Daugavins. This year he started to shoot more which was a very positive thing for his game. I dunno, we'll see. If I were Jack I'd still give it a couple more years but if I hit 25 and was still in the lottery I'd ask out and no way would that make him a locker room problem....the same way that Ryan O'Reilly was not a locker room cancer (despite people calling him in Buffalo as well)

I’m not saying that good value contracts are everything, just that they’re a factor in the mix of what makes a successful team. I completely agree that it’s even more important for management to get their strategies and selections right and maximise the potential of their middle and lower-tier players. If Sweeney had used Backes’ $6 mil to hire a guy like Timo Meier then we’d have another Cup by now, let alone looking at the situation around Beleskey etc. Then there’s drafting well and so on and so on.

What I would say is that having your top players on reasonable deals gives a GM a greater opportunity and chance of getting things right in composing the rest of the roster, because there’s that little bit more cash and flexibility to play with. So Sweeney whiffed badly on Backes but, thanks to the relative cheapness of Bergy etc., was still able to get Coyle and MoJo and nearly snag a Cup even so. If those top guys are on closer to $10 mil then that’s not possible. I also think that having a more equal pay structure fosters a good culture in the team and can inspire the guys at the bottom to work harder and buy in to the team-first mentality. Brad Marchand in particular has been a really big driver of this in Boston and a believer that encouraging team-friendly deals and setting the right example has played a part in making the Bruins a strong franchise.

I’m not trying to push this too far – I agree that if Eichel was on $8 mil rather than 10 it certainly wouldn’t magically solve the Sabres’ many problems. What I’m getting at is that maybe players, particularly the top ones, could do a little more to help their teams out and drive team culture and hoped-for success by making fair compromises on their contracts rather than pushing for top dollar. You don’t have to go overboard – the Bruins’ top line is well-underpaid and a special case – but as a general rule I’d say if you’re asking for more than a tenth of your team’s entire cap then perhaps you need to consider if you’re asking for too much if you really care about gunning for a Cup.

 

[member 96824]

I'm legitimately impressed that we managed to create 3+ pages of discussion out of a non-story. Well done!

But seriously, I keep seeing deals thrown out that are basically DeBrusk, a 1st rd pick, and a couple prospects. Why on earth does Buffalo agree to that? That's a terrible deal for them. We're seriously overrating DeBrusk and our prospects if we think that's anywhere close to enough.

They hang up the phone immediately if the offer doesn't start with Pastrnak or McAvoy, which, of course, Sweeney would never do. Just because the Bruins have been dumb enough to trade multiple stars for 50 cents on the dollar doesn't mean that another team is. Now, if Chiarelli gets hired again, then we can start talking.

The only thing we would have going in these talks is the Pegula’s make Chiarelli look like an astrophysicist.

 

[member 96824]

say if you’re asking for more than a tenth of your team’s entire cap then perhaps you need to consider if you’re asking for too much if you really care about gunning for a Cup.

I agree with a lot of your post but disagree with this piece...two separate things IMO. One is about setting up yourself, your mom, dad, grandparents if they’re still around, kids and the other is strictly personal. I look at guys like Toews and Kane for example..I don’t think one could ever question their desire to win and yet I don’t believe post-ELC they’ve ever spent a moment under 10% each. Bergeron and Krejci both signed for north of 10%, Chara was 17% when he signed his first deal here and 11% in his second. Crosby has signed multiple well north of 10% and been very public that he views it as a discount. I don’t think anyone would question their cup desires either, but who am I to tell any of those guys that they should take below what the market says they’re worth so their GM can give Kyle Okposo $42M over 7 years.

 

[ON3M4N]

I'm legitimately impressed that we managed to create 3+ pages of discussion out of a non-story. Well done!

But seriously, I keep seeing deals thrown out that are basically DeBrusk, a 1st rd pick, and a couple prospects. Why on earth does Buffalo agree to that? That's a terrible deal for them. We're seriously overrating DeBrusk and our prospects if we think that's anywhere close to enough.

They hang up the phone immediately if the offer doesn't start with Pastrnak or McAvoy, which, of course, Sweeney would never do. Just because the Bruins have been dumb enough to trade multiple stars for 50 cents on the dollar doesn't mean that another team is. Now, if Chiarelli gets hired again, then we can start talking.

I wouldn't say we're overrating DeBrusk, in fact I think he might be a little underrated. Since joining the league he ranks the following among NHL wingers w/ a min of 100GP

Goals - 42nd
Points - 54th

If you wanted to look just at LW's by Hockey-Reference, he ranks in the 20's for both. He's one of the better scoring LW's in the league over the last 3 years. Interestingly enough some notable wingers around DeBrusk in goals scored over the last 3 years...

Rakell - 67 goals
Hall - 66 goals
Mantha - 65 goals
DeBrusk - 62 goals
Saad - 62 goals

^Those are all names that people have mentioned as players Bruins should try and add.

Now I do think there are some prospects we overrate, but DeBrusk would be a solid piece to get back as part of a deal for Eichel.

 

[Gee Wally]

Matt Grzelcyk feels for his good friend Jack Eichel in Buffalo - The Boston Globe

Matt Grzelcyk has seen Jack Eichel’s winning smile — just not lately.
Grzelcyk, from Charlestown, and Eichel, from North Chelmsford, played together on the 2014-15 Boston University team. With Grzelcyk as captain and Eichel, a freshman, having a Hobey Baker season, the Terriers rolled through the NCAA field before falling to Providence in the national title game.
After hearing Eichel voice his frustration recently with his situation in Buffalo, Grzelcyk is counting his blessings.
"It certainly makes you look inward and realize how grateful I am for the opportunity to play for such a great organization," the Bruins defenseman said Tuesday on a Zoom call.

We have such good leaders and such good veterans and guys who have been there before and know what it requires to get the job done. I’m so blessed to be on this team, and I think that going through the experiences in the playoffs just helps you grow each and every season.”


Grzelcyk said he hasn’t spoken with Eichel directly about the firings (“I’m sure he’s getting texts left and right”) but feels for him.
“I know that’s a tough situation, especially for Jack,” Grzelcyk said. “He’s one of my good friends. I know first-hand how competitive he is and how much he just wants to win more than anything.
“He’s not really concerned with individual accolades or anything like that. He’s aware you have the most fun at the rink when you’re winning. It’s for sure very frustrating for him.”
Eichel, the Sabres’ captain the last two years, has six years left on a contract worth $10 million per annum. He will cash a $7.5 million signing bonus this summer.
Money, they say, cannot buy happiness.
“I know Jack is quite antsy to get into the playoff picture and play in the most important games and shine in those big moments,” Grzelcyk said. “I hope he can reach that goal soon and we can see his full potential.”

 

[Aussie Bruin]

I agree with a lot of your post but disagree with this piece...two separate things IMO. One is about setting up yourself, your mom, dad, grandparents if they’re still around, kids and the other is strictly personal. I look at guys like Toews and Kane for example..I don’t think one could ever question their desire to win and yet I don’t believe post-ELC they’ve ever spent a moment under 10% each. Bergeron and Krejci both signed for north of 10%, Chara was 17% when he signed his first deal here and 11% in his second. Crosby has signed multiple well north of 10% and been very public that he views it as a discount. I don’t think anyone would question their cup desires either, but who am I to tell any of those guys that they should take below what the market says they’re worth so their GM can give Kyle Okposo $42M over 7 years.

That’s fair enough. I’m probably betraying my Australian-ness here. We have a really deeply ingrained ‘tall poppy syndrome’ and an aversion to people who value themselves highly. This and other factors have led to a pay structure in our sporting leagues that is more egalitarian than most. The highest-paid players in our leagues are on about 10% of the total cap. There’s a very strong attitude that if someone wants to ask for more than that then they’re full of themselves, not worth it and can p*** off, so it doesn’t happen. The fact we’re dealing with much lower caps than in the US ($13 mil for an entire AFL team) reinforces this.

But I acknowledge that things are a bit different in America, particularly when you sit hockey alongside the much bigger pay figures and money involved in the likes of the NBA and NFL. I have no issue with players considering their families and their futures and wanting fair value for their talents and work, especially in a type of career that could be ended at any point by a serious injury. I’m not calling out anybody as selfish, nor saying that the 10% figure as such should be set in stone. The principle is more about striking that balance between getting good value and financial security personally, and considering how my contract and the way I approach it sits within the wider needs and situation of the team and can help drive its ability to succeed, and just personally I feel that some of those top-end contracts are skewing that balance a little and perhaps straying too far into unnecessarily excessive and detrimental territory.

 

[08SeaBass08]

Only Haggs would put forward a deal as lopsided as that nonsense.

Glad I didn't click on the link.

 

[Fenway]

 

[GordonHowe]

No.

This is Haggerty territory.

 

[C77]

Man I'd sure like to cash a $7.5 million signing bonus this summer!

But for Eichel my opinion is that you give up whatever you have to with the exception of Pastrnak and McAvoy. Then you fix what you have to after.

 

[bbfan419]

Because to land Eichel you're either trading a player of equal value or you're trading a good chunk of your roster. The last big one for one that I recall was Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen

Seguin did not land the same talent nor did Thornton.

 

[bbfan419]

Glad I didn't click on the link.

Haggs is secretly a habs fan

 

[member 96824]

Seguin did not land the same talent nor did Thornton.

So 2 trades over the last 15 years set the precedent here?

How did those trades work out for the other side? Are people envious of the return that Boston got in either trade?

Would a rebuilding org look to either of those trades as the return they want?

 

[ON3M4N]

Seguin did not land the same talent nor did Thornton.

And the consensus by everyone from fans to those in the business was that Boston got bent over. Just because we made a few bad trades doesn't mean every team in the NHL is going to do the same. Boston traded Seguin after going to the SCF, Buffalo would be trading Eichel while continuing to struggle to make the playoffs. They have little to no star power (opposite of Boston) and need to put fans in the stands.

 

[RoccoF14]

Jesus Christ, lock this thread already......Its a non-story.

 

[bbfan419]

So 2 trades over the last 15 years set the precedent here?

How did those trades work out for the other side? Are people envious of the return that Boston got in either trade?

Would a rebuilding org look to either of those trades as the return they want?

I just gave two examples, point is often times players don't get the return talked about or fans think they will get. I thought Mark Stone would return a lot more than he did, I know they got a good prospect in it, but still fans had speculated the cost would be much more.

 

[bbfan419]

And the consensus by everyone from fans to those in the business was that Boston got bent over. Just because we made a few bad trades doesn't mean every team in the NHL is going to do the same. Boston traded Seguin after going to the SCF, Buffalo would be trading Eichel while continuing to struggle to make the playoffs. They have little to no star power (opposite of Boston) and need to put fans in the stands.

I get that, but at some point if Eichel asks for a trade his value in a trade goes down some, other teams know the Sabres are up against a wall and if he only wanted Boston then his trade value is really lowered. I am not saying any of that would happen, but if it did there is no way he would get back what Haggs was suggesting.