Training Camp Starts 12 Sep 2013

[XX]

The top tier comment has me thinking we were legitimately in on Vanek, but got cold feet after he passed on an extension. He wants to play in Minnesota. So now what? You've got Cammalleri and Hemsky as options that make sense and won't require hard assets to change hands. Then there are guys like JVR out there that are longer term solutions.

In Maloney we trust.

 

[Desert Ice 11]

This might sound dumb but could GMDM trade Gormley (or whoever) and throw in Klesla for a top 6 and prospects? Kind of a salary dump with an acquisition.

 

[XX]

This might sound dumb but could GMDM trade Gormley (or whoever) and throw in Klesla for a top 6 and prospects? Kind of a salary dump with an acquisition.

The way I see it, our expendables are:
Gormley or Rundblad
Korpikoski or Moss
Summers, Schlemko
Picks

Anyone else is a bigger decision and would involve a more complex trade.

 

[KG]

We want a top 6 winger, they aren't cheap. Sadly, Klesla has a history of being injury prone, and as RT said, Gormley is unproven at the NHL level. He's a valuable asset, but if I was a GM talking to GMDM, my price might be a bit steeper than Klesla/Gormley.

 

[XX]

We want a top 6 winger, they aren't cheap. Sadly, Klesla has a history of being injury prone, and as RT said, Gormley is unproven at the NHL level. He's a valuable asset, but if I was a GM talking to GMDM, my price might be a bit steeper than Klesla/Gormley.

There is a distinct difference in value between an under 30, no question marks type of guy who is signed, and the type of player we are looking at. Teams don't trade the former during training camp hardly ever, and generally want a high price for them. The latter guys get traded all the time, because they are of no use to the team trading them. The Oilers have been looking to dump Hemsky for awhile, for example. He wouldn't command a blue chip like Gormley.

It's a short list of guys if we're talking about moving a few young spare parts and a pick. It's an entirely different animal if we are talking legit top 3 player.

 

[KG]

Agreed, so if we're looking at a guy like Hemsky instead of Vanek or something, why hasn't there been a trade yet?

 

[Desert Ice 11]

We want a top 6 winger, they aren't cheap. Sadly, Klesla has a history of being injury prone, and as RT said, Gormley is unproven at the NHL level. He's a valuable asset, but if I was a GM talking to GMDM, my price might be a bit steeper than Klesla/Gormley.

I did say "(whoever)" just picked a good prospect that is supposed to very good one day. And Klesla isn't the main part of the deal. He would be a salary dump and I guess a sweetener...maybe.

So I figured whoever+Klesla for top 6 + prospects (doesn't even have to be great ones).

 

[XX]

Agreed, so if we're looking at a guy like Hemsky instead of Vanek or something, why hasn't there been a trade yet?

It's no secret the Coyotes need a guy like that. And it's no secret we can't take on tons of salary in the process. So my guess is that GMs are asking a little too much for a salary retained deal, so Maloney is just waiting them out.

 

[RABBIT]

He probably was holding out for a contender. He won't get one. Now that we've got no way to unload Klesla bucks, we can't afford Vinny.

Prospal led his team in scoring. Perfect natural fit for that line. We may have wanted him but he didn't want us. We need one year out of this solution. Then Domi will be ready.

The top tier comment has me thinking we were legitimately in on Vanek, but got cold feet after he passed on an extension. He wants to play in Minnesota. So now what? You've got Cammalleri and Hemsky as options that make sense and won't require hard assets to change hands. Then there are guys like JVR out there that are longer term solutions.

In Maloney we trust.

Going by the quotes of Maloney, I think he's after something bigger. Someone who will be here for more than just a year.

I personally believe Yandle for Skinner straight up is almost too perfect of a deal, and I'm a hard core Yandle defender. Both young, both opposite team needs, both still have a ton on potential, both would be sent far out of their conferences, and almost a dollar for dollar deal.

Yandle Cap Hit: 5,250,000
Skinner Cap Hit: 5,725,000

A difference of 475k.

If we trade Yandle, there are only a handful of players I would want in return, Skinmer is one of the few.


Points over last 3 seasons:
Yandle: 132
Skinner: 131
with Yandle having played 24 more games over this span.

I can realllly dig it.

Boedker-Ribeiro-Doan
Skinner-Hanzal-Vrbata
Korpikoski-Vermette-Moss
Klinkhammer-Chipuchura-Brown/Lessio

OEL-Micahlek
Morris-Rundblad(with Klesla out)
Stone-Schlemko
Summers

Smith
Griess

 

[rt]

I think having Domi in the system makes that move an over reaction.

 

[Plub]

I think having Domi in the system makes that move an over reaction.

 

[RABBIT]

I think having Domi in the system makes that move an over reaction.

And whats the difference with Vanek? Before we would trade for Vanek, we would want him to be signed for another 6-8 years, no? Skinner is already a 30+ goal scoring first liner who is only 21 years old with 6 years remaining on hos contract. Bringing in Vanek would essentially be the same move, just a younger player with potentially less years on his contract.

 

[XX]

Does anyone here actually watch the Canes? Skinner is about as far away from a Tippett player as one can get. We're talking about a kid who had a tempter tantrum and thought it was a good idea to stomp on an opponent with his skate. No thanks.

 

[RABBIT]

Does anyone here actually watch the Canes? Skinner is about as far away from a Tippett player as one can get. We're talking about a kid who had a tempter tantrum and thought it was a good idea to stomp on an opponent with his skate. No thanks.

Yikes. Are we as fans of a goaltender who commits sometimes remarkable, yet sometimes over the top actions against opponents going to have reservations over a heat of the moment action? The stomp was trivial, it was more of a push that gave Scott Nichol a charlie horse. We have no room to nitpick here. Ribeiro is a hated player around the league for throwing questionable "dirty" plays, Mike Smith has the tendency to throw temper tantrums himself, OEL was late to training camp due to underwear modeling and yet we want to judge a players character off of that? Don't get me wrong, I love each and every player on our team, but everyone of them has committed a question play and has a character flaw.

 

[rt]

And whats the difference with Vanek?.

Cost to acquire. I would never advocate moving Yandle for Vanek.

 

[XX]

Don't get me wrong, I love each and every player on our team, but everyone of them has committed a question play and has a character flaw.

I think if you watch Skinner and see his game, you'll understand. The words "Boy that Skinner kid sure is gritty" have never been uttered by anyone. He makes good money, has had concussions, and isn't on an upward trend anymore. Yandle straight up for Skinner is not a particularly good deal. Hell, Yandle outscored Skinner last year (albeit in 6 more games).

I'm all for being creative but in no way is Jeff Skinner the answer to the question here. Not at the price of Yandle.

 

[_Del_]

And whats the difference with Vanek? Before we would trade for Vanek, we would want him to be signed for another 6-8 years, no?

Because presumably Buffalo isn't resigning him if they are looking to deal him. Which means he'll cost a lot less than Yandle in trade value.
Would I rather have Skinner than Vanek? Yes. Do I think the team is probably better with Vanek minus the asking price than they would be with Skinner minus Yandle? Yes.

 

[BAdvocate]

Either that or they really are going to pluck Domi out of juniors too soon just to fill a temporary hole next to the Czechs. Ugh. Sinking feeling in stomach. So short-sighted if they do that.

at some point I concluded not to question anything by GMDM & DT.

I don't think Boedker suffered so much from being thrown into the fire as an 18 year old. possibly he was negatively impacted by playing with so many other ones that weren't physically ready, and rushed their careers. one of the most common things heard was that he was already close to what his career playing weight was going to be.

Domi kind of fits that bill too. I can't remember if there were penalties on the Coyotes in the Canuck game, but I thought I heard that domi was playing on the pk in another preseason game? if he can play in all situations what's wrong with a pp/pk fireplug specialist learning from one of the best coaches in the game.

I still think he'll get cut, but if he stays I trust DT when he says it's not a 9 game tryout, and if he stays I think it's premature to assume his development would be stunted.

 

[Jakey53]

GMDM made some new comments about trading for a top-six forward mentioning it may be a larger trade. One of the offers mentioned by a HFer? Well, how about Domi+OEL+a high draft pick for Kessel. That was seriously mentioned...

By a Leafs fan.

 

[rt]

at some point I concluded not to question anything by GMDM & DT.

I don't think Boedker suffered so much from being thrown into the fire as an 18 year old. possibly he was negatively impacted by playing with so many other ones that weren't physically ready, and rushed their careers. one of the most common things heard was that he was already close to what his career playing weight was going to be.

Domi kind of fits that bill too. I can't remember if there were penalties on the Coyotes in the Canuck game, but I thought I heard that domi was playing on the pk in another preseason game? if he can play in all situations what's wrong with a pp/pk fireplug specialist learning from one of the best coaches in the game.

I still think he'll get cut, but if he stays I trust DT when he says it's not a 9 game tryout, and if he stays I think it's premature to assume his development would be stunted.

God damned if your username isn't just perfect. Haha. You've made some great points.

 

[RABBIT]

I think if you watch Skinner and see his game, you'll understand. The words "Boy that Skinner kid sure is gritty" have never been uttered by anyone. He makes good money, has had concussions, and isn't on an upward trend anymore. Yandle straight up for Skinner is not a particularly good deal. Hell, Yandle outscored Skinner last year (albeit in 6 more games).

I'm all for being creative but in no way is Jeff Skinner the answer to the question here. Not at the price of Yandle.

I have more of an understanding of where you're coming from now, and in a way,
I agree. Would just hate to see Yandle traded away for anything besides someone who can stay and grow with our organization, meaning I don't want to see anybody a few years older than he is in return. If we are going to trade Yandle, it had better be for a worthy piece who is capable and as willing to serve the remainder of his long career here as Keith is.

Because presumably Buffalo isn't resigning him if they are looking to deal him. Which means he'll cost a lot less than Yandle in trade value.
Would I rather have Skinner than Vanek? Yes. Do I think the team is probably better with Vanek minus the asking price than they would be with Skinner minus Yandle? Yes.

Great answer, I would most definitely prefer to keep Yandle and acquire a top 6 forward. That said, we'll probably be saying goodbye to Rundblad and/or Gormley.

at some point I concluded not to question anything by GMDM & DT.

I don't think Boedker suffered so much from being thrown into the fire as an 18 year old. possibly he was negatively impacted by playing with so many other ones that weren't physically ready, and rushed their careers. one of the most common things heard was that he was already close to what his career playing weight was going to be.

Domi kind of fits that bill too. I can't remember if there were penalties on the Coyotes in the Canuck game, but I thought I heard that domi was playing on the pk in another preseason game? if he can play in all situations what's wrong with a pp/pk fireplug specialist learning from one of the best coaches in the game.

I still think he'll get cut, but if he stays I trust DT when he says it's not a 9 game tryout, and if he stays I think it's premature to assume his development would be stunted.

Well said.

 

[KG]

It's certainly looking like we struck gold when Domi fell to 12th.

My only knock on him is how he handles the media.

 

[CC96]

It's certainly looking like we struck gold when Domi fell to 12th.

My only knock on him is how he handles the media.

What do you mean? I don't know much about how he is with the media.

 

[rt]

He chooses three cliches and repeats them over and over again. He gives non answers EXACTLY like a politician in a debate. When asked the same question twice or when asked a stupid question he has a hard time hiding contemptuous facial expressions, and his tone is noticeable different in the reply.

I actually think he's nearly perfectly groomed. I also think it's intelligent for him to adopt this strategy as a very young kid. If he came off like a goofball, it'd be misread. He can have a personality when he's established and has a solid pro resume.

 

[KG]

He also answers in as few words as possible and always looks bored and like he wants the interview over.

I mean, I get it, star hockey player in Canadian Juniors, former pro dad... probably has always had the best coaches and mentors for this stuff, it just rubs me the wrong way.