OT: To Trotz or not to Trotz

[eXile3]

Good coaches coach according to the roster they have. Trotz certainly leans defensive, but I think he coaches with what he has. Those Islander teams were not talented enough to win by running-and-gunning, so he went heavily defensive with them. And it got them pretty f***ing far. When he had a highly skilled Capitals team, they finished 6th, 2nd, 3rd, and 9th in GF. So it's not like he wants to win 2-1, but if that's what it takes, then that's what he does.

Losing 6-5 is better than losing 2-1, but sports are fun to watch when there is something on the line. If winning 2-1 is what is needed to win, then sign me up. No idea if Trotz would take the job, but if he would, I'd welcome him with open arms.

I mean it’s pretty much been proven we can’t win by run and gun now. We need some defense.

 

[Andy99]

On coaching, while acknowledging Sullivan will never be fired, RW had this to say on his blog this morning:

“I think the most important person who needs to step up and make something happen is the head coach. Mike Sullivan is deserving of a lot of the praise he receives. He also gets let off the hook quite a bit for his inability to construct lines to perk up depth scoring or his lack of ability/creativity to make in-game adjustments to generate goals when needed. These have been long-standing complaints I’ve had. His most damning mistake lately is his Dan Bylsma-esque loyalty to players who are playing like absolute garbage. Bench Brian Dumoulin! Do it already! It is flat out embarrassing that an NHL coach can’t put two and two together and do what is right for the team. This isn’t a recent development. He was washed last year. He has shown no signs of life this year and yet there he is during a seven-game losing streak game after game lining up on the top pairing. Letang has his own issues to work out at the moment. He shouldn’t have to babysit a below replacement level player on top of it.”

 

[pistolpete11]

I mean it’s pretty much been proven we can’t win by run and gun now. We need some defense.

Absolutely. Even if they went more defensive, though, I think they are still going to get their fair share of goals. They're 9th in GF right now and that's with an impotent PP.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that Trotz wouldn't necessarily turn them into the Islanders. There are many shades of gray between playing 6-5 games and playing 2-1 games.

 

[eXile3]

On coaching, while acknowledging Sullivan will never be fired, RW had this to say on his blog this morning:

“I think the most important person who needs to step up and make something happen is the head coach. Mike Sullivan is deserving of a lot of the praise he receives. He also gets let off the hook quite a bit for his inability to construct lines to perk up depth scoring or his lack of ability/creativity to make in-game adjustments to generate goals when needed. These have been long-standing complaints I’ve had. His most damning mistake lately is his Dan Bylsma-esque loyalty to players who are playing like absolute garbage. Bench Brian Dumoulin! Do it already! It is flat out embarrassing that an NHL coach can’t put two and two together and do what is right for the team. This isn’t a recent development. He was washed last year. He has shown no signs of life this year and yet there he is during a seven-game losing streak game after game lining up on the top pairing. Letang has his own issues to work out at the moment. He shouldn’t have to babysit a below replacement level player on top of it.”

Yes Sully deserves a lot of blame but people need to stop letting Hextall off the hook. He rebuilt the defense for the worse. The bottom 6 isn’t scoring because Carter is the only one who provides scoring depth and he’s injured and is one of the more complacent players defensively.

It shouldn’t be surprising that McGinn, Kap, DOC and Poehling aren’t lighting it up. How’s Sullivan supposed to give them offensive talent they don’t have?

The teams built for the top 6 to carry them but they aren’t able to do that anymore.

 

[pistolpete11]

On coaching, while acknowledging Sullivan will never be fired, RW had this to say on his blog this morning:

“I think the most important person who needs to step up and make something happen is the head coach. Mike Sullivan is deserving of a lot of the praise he receives. He also gets let off the hook quite a bit for his inability to construct lines to perk up depth scoring or his lack of ability/creativity to make in-game adjustments to generate goals when needed. These have been long-standing complaints I’ve had. His most damning mistake lately is his Dan Bylsma-esque loyalty to players who are playing like absolute garbage. Bench Brian Dumoulin! Do it already! It is flat out embarrassing that an NHL coach can’t put two and two together and do what is right for the team. This isn’t a recent development. He was washed last year. He has shown no signs of life this year and yet there he is during a seven-game losing streak game after game lining up on the top pairing. Letang has his own issues to work out at the moment. He shouldn’t have to babysit a below replacement level player on top of it.”

I can understand not benching him, but AT LEAST stop giving him 20+min a night against the other team's best.

 

[Andy99]

Yes Sully deserves a lot of blame but people need to stop letting Hextall off the hook. He rebuilt the defense for the worse. The bottom 6 isn’t scoring because Carter is the only one who provides scoring depth and he’s injured and is one of the more complacent players defensively.

It shouldn’t be surprising that McGinn, Kap, DOC and Poehling aren’t lighting it up. How’s Sullivan supposed to give them offensive talent they don’t have?

The teams built for the top 6 to carry them but they aren’t able to do that anymore.

Agree…Hextall did a horrific job filling out the roster and the D moves made us worse. I think moving Rust back to L2 and Rakell up to L1 would help…I think both top six lines are fine offensively but L1 w Rust is atrocious defensively. The problem is not the top six at ES at all…it’s the PP and depth scoring. Sullivan can also do something about the former if he wanted lol

I can understand not benching him, but AT LEAST stop giving him 20+min a night against the other team's best.

He needs to play 14 min a night, including on the PK, which means like 10 min a night at ES…and that should be done on the third pairing…he’s Scuderi at this point

 

[SEALBound]

Agree…Hextall did a horrific job filling out the roster and the D moves made us worse.

I still don't understand this notion - from you or Ryan Wilson (and I'm starting to think you're the same person).

We brought back Rust and Rakell - top 6 wings. We got 18g scorer Heinen back for $1mil.

We added Poehling who has size and skill and has generally done well for the bottom 6.

Rutta has been fantastic. And both he and Petry provide the elements we were sorely lacking in the playoffs.

The only questionable one is Kapanen but it's not like we are losing games because of Kapanen. And that's even coming from a guy who is advocating a swap.

So...how did Hextall do a horrific job filling out the roster exactly? Who should have he signed instead?

 

[HandshakeLine]

Hextall did an okay job getting the pieces, Sully's just kinda... f***ing up the execution.

 

[pistolpete11]

The top 6 bleeding goals is a much bigger issue than the bottom 6 scoring. How much of that is on Dumo-Letang I don't know because Sullivan refuses to make any changes.

 

[Snooki Stackhouse]

Would Barry Trotz have prevented Hextall from making several bonehead decisions constructing this roster? If there's a change to be made it's in Hockey Ops.

 

[BusinessGoose]

Sullys failures were GMJRs and GMRHs

The excuse train chugs on

 

[Josey Wales]

On coaching, while acknowledging Sullivan will never be fired, RW had this to say on his blog this morning:

“I think the most important person who needs to step up and make something happen is the head coach. Mike Sullivan is deserving of a lot of the praise he receives. He also gets let off the hook quite a bit for his inability to construct lines to perk up depth scoring or his lack of ability/creativity to make in-game adjustments to generate goals when needed. These have been long-standing complaints I’ve had. His most damning mistake lately is his Dan Bylsma-esque loyalty to players who are playing like absolute garbage. Bench Brian Dumoulin! Do it already! It is flat out embarrassing that an NHL coach can’t put two and two together and do what is right for the team. This isn’t a recent development. He was washed last year. He has shown no signs of life this year and yet there he is during a seven-game losing streak game after game lining up on the top pairing. Letang has his own issues to work out at the moment. He shouldn’t have to babysit a below replacement level player on top of it.”

Ryan want to explain how he is supposed to make players play better??

I still don't understand this notion - from you or Ryan Wilson (and I'm starting to think you're the same person).

We brought back Rust and Rakell - top 6 wings. We got 18g scorer Heinen back for $1mil.

We added Poehling who has size and skill and has generally done well for the bottom 6.

Rutta has been fantastic. And both he and Petry provide the elements we were sorely lacking in the playoffs.

The only questionable one is Kapanen but it's not like we are losing games because of Kapanen. And that's even coming from a guy who is advocating a swap.

So...how did Hextall do a horrific job filling out the roster exactly? Who should have he signed instead?

Because Ryan/Andy99 Thinks Sullivan is a Big Doodyhead

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Ryan want to explain how he is supposed to make players play better??

Isn't that part of a coach's job? To get his players to play better?

I guess I'm confused about what it is that you CAN blame a coach for if it's not his fault when his team is looking lost and confused and not playing up to its potential.

 

[Andy99]

I still don't understand this notion - from you or Ryan Wilson (and I'm starting to think you're the same person).

We brought back Rust and Rakell - top 6 wings. We got 18g scorer Heinen back for $1mil.

We added Poehling who has size and skill and has generally done well for the bottom 6.

Rutta has been fantastic. And both he and Petry provide the elements we were sorely lacking in the playoffs.

The only questionable one is Kapanen but it's not like we are losing games because of Kapanen. And that's even coming from a guy who is advocating a swap.

So...how did Hextall do a horrific job filling out the roster exactly? Who should have he signed instead?

Rutta was a decent signing but Petry has not been so far…Archibald decent signing so far…the rest are worthless…in fact, the only two players who are scoring in our bottom six are Carter and Archibald and Carter has other issues…McGinn v Tanev…no brainer to keep Tanev…Poehling is a nothing burger…Heinen is very inconsistent and looks much worse in the bottom six than playing in the top six lol…in fact, it seems more of our players do better when they play away from the Pens lol

 

[Josey Wales]

Isn't that part of a coach's job? To get his players to play better?

I guess I'm confused about what it is that you CAN blame a coach for if it's not his fault when his team is looking lost and confused and not playing up to its potential.

How is he supposed to do it, was Sully a great coach because Sid, Geno, Letang & MAF/MM were otherworldly

 

[Rakell67]

Who is on the desirable list?

Tocchet

 

[Night Shift]

Why do I have a bad feeling FSG would give Bylsma a call?

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Why do I have a bad feeling FSG would give Bylsma a call?

Whatever happened to this reputation FSG had of being a "no loyalty, results are all that count" type ownership who'd cut ties with a star player/star GM/star coach if they weren't getting results that we kept hearing about when they first bought the team?

 

[Night Shift]

Whatever happened to this reputation FSG had of being a "no loyalty, results are all that count" type ownership who'd cut ties with a star player/star GM/star coach if they weren't getting results that we kept hearing about when they first bought the team?

It's starting to seem like a cheesy B horror film,

Killer Rooney's from outer space. They killed FSG when they got here.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Whatever happened to this reputation FSG had of being a "no loyalty, results are all that count" type ownership who'd cut ties with a star player/star GM/star coach if they weren't getting results that we kept hearing about when they first bought the team?

Probably applies to teams they give a shit about, not a situation where they're buying up huge real estate opportunity that just so happens to coincidentally come with an NHL team that's on the steep downturn.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Yeah, I'm starting to agree that clearly FSG isn't really concerned with how this franchise is being run.

 

[Night Shift]

Yeah, I'm starting to agree that clearly FSG isn't really concerned with how this franchise is being run.

Or they are getting really bad advice like: "Dont fire coaches in this city, yinzers really love their head coaches"

 

[Pens x]

Yeah, I'm starting to agree that clearly FSG isn't really concerned with how this franchise is being run.

I think keeping Hextall reinforces they don’t give a ****.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

FSG has a hoard of finance and investment nerds at their disposal. They didn't buy the Penguins without knowing absolutely without question that the team was headed for a huge drop off and inevitable rebuild. They bought a team that's struggled to sell out the arena for a while now, were three consecutive 1st round losses deep at the time of the purchase, and Sid/Geno/Letang were already well into the twilight of their careers. Chalk up another 1st round exit this past spring, and they not only kept the FO, but signed the coach to an extension before his current deal was even up, and allowed said FO to basically plonk together the same team more or less for another go.

I think anybody that's hoping FSG steps in and rights this ship has gotta take off the black and gold glasses and put down their Sid body pillow. Era's over, it's on cruise control from here on out. The most I think we'll see is Hextall fired by the New Year if the team keeps struggling. Sully's safe forever, accept it. They'll start caring about the team's performance once the rebuild kicks in and the team starts building up to contend again in like 7 years, after they've hashed out all of their real estate plans.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Or they are getting really bad advice like: "Dont fire coaches in this city, yinzers really love their head coaches"

That would be pretty horrifically bad advice, true.