The Great Fight Debate thread

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KrejciMVP

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Times they are a changin'.

Broad Street Bullies currently have no fighting majors this season.

I think the torch is being passed to teams like Washington and Montreal now. Habs had no shame going all in on the diving hockey for a decade, now the culture is changing with Claude there. Caps have Tom Wilson, who is playing out of his mind right now. Domi right now is looking like the next big thing in hockey, skilled and fights, I can see Montreal running with that.
 

ODAAT

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I think the torch is being passed to teams like Washington and Montreal now. Habs had no shame going all in on the diving hockey for a decade, now the culture is changing with Claude there. Caps have Tom Wilson, who is playing out of his mind right now. Domi right now is looking like the next big thing in hockey, skilled and fights, I can see Montreal running with that.
Domi has had 1 fight (I don`t count his BS in pre season a fight) and went after heavyweight Orlov:sarcasm:

He`s having a terrific offensive season thus far but far from the next "big thing", he`s a highly skilled player but let`s not go overboard here
 

Sheppy

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Personally, I cannot wait for the B’s (probably Cam) to go out and add some “toughness” to the roster...

Just so I can listen to people complain that the tough guy didn’t do anything about a particular situation or player when it happens.

:laugh:
I can’t wait until the team does nothing and the Bruins continue to get pushed around so I can read what excuse the anti-toughness crowd comes up with next.
 
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Glove Malfunction

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I can’t wait until the team does nothing and the Bruins continue to get pushed around so I can read what excuse the anti-toughness crowd comes up with next.
Who is this "anti-toughness crowd" you keep talking about? I've seen literally no one saying they want a soft team, or one that has no toughness. They just want tough players who can play. I know that's what you want too, but a lot of times you come across as wanting guys who will fight above all else. I really don't think anyone's really all that far apart with what they want. It seems to be more in how they ask for it.
 

Sheppy

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Who is this "anti-toughness crowd" you keep talking about? I've seen literally no one saying they want a soft team, or one that has no toughness. They just want tough players who can play. I know that's what you want too, but a lot of times you come across as wanting guys who will fight above all else. I really don't think anyone's really all that far apart with what they want. It seems to be more in how they ask for it.
It seems like there’s a constant argument no matter what, though. It’s kind of frustrating, honestly.
 

Chief Nine

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It seems like there’s a constant argument no matter what, though. It’s kind of frustrating, honestly.

What was frustrating to me was seeing the same posts multiple times in every single GDT about a "lack of toughness". There's more than one reason games are won and lost but this seems to be your only focus
 

Glove Malfunction

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It seems like there’s a constant argument no matter what, though. It’s kind of frustrating, honestly.
Like I said, I think it's more delivery of the message than the message itself. There's a degree of what toughness means that's different. But I think we all want a tough team that will fight through checks, not peel off from hits, finish their checks and stand up for teammates. Is that pretty close to what you're wanting too?

I want to add, I think the main difference is between those who feel the direction the NHL is moving, which is away from fighting, is wrong, and who want fighting, and those who have accepted the new NHL direction and just want guys who will do the things I listed above. I think we can all agree that the days of the enforcer who doesn't bring much else except the odd handful of points a year are pretty much done. The real problem seems to be how to fill the void of teammate protection left by the demise of the enforcer role.
 

LSCII

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It seems like there’s a constant argument no matter what, though. It’s kind of frustrating, honestly.

When some of the posters here claim they want a tough team with hockey players that are physical, then turn around and suggest guys that are more known for pugilism, it kind of shows what they're really asking for, no?

I'm not saying that's your view either, because you and I have had this discussion already, but you have to understand why it's perpetuated.
 
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LSCII

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What was frustrating to me was seeing the same posts multiple times in every single GDT about a "lack of toughness". There's more than one reason games are won and lost but this seems to be your only focus

Even in the Cassidy quotes that the "B's are soft" crowd has clung to, he mentions scoring first, followed by big hits and physicality. It's funny how the first part has gotten continually dropped in this argument though. Scoring matters. Imagine that?
 

GloryDaze4877

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I can’t wait until the team does nothing and the Bruins continue to get pushed around so I can read what excuse the anti-toughness crowd comes up with next.

I would have liked nothing better than for someone to grab Polak and rag-doll him the other night. My question is how high should getting a guy to do that be on your priority list?

More than a 3rd line C? More than a legit Top 6 RW?

I would answer no. It would be great if someone like Cave or Frederic stepped up and they could address multiple needs internally instead of via trade.
 

Sheppy

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Just FYI I completely agree that scoring is an issue and I would like to see that addressed. I just don’t think we have any significant upgrade internally.

I also think if you can replace a guy like Acciari with a bigger, physical guy, they should do it, but that can be a secondary move or maybe you can even get that guy in a package for a top 6 wing/3 C.

All in all, I just want to see this team built for a playoff war. I just don’t think this is the roster that ultimately gets that done.
 
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LSCII

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Just FYI I completely agree that scoring is an issue and I would like to see that addressed. I just don’t think we have any significant upgrade internally.

I also think if you can replace a guy like Acciari with a bigger, physical guy, they should do it, but that can be a secondary move or maybe you can even get that guy in a package for a top 6 wing/3 C.

All in all, I just want to see this team built for a playoff war. I just don’t think this is the roster that ultimately gets that done.

Can you replace a guy like Acciari with a bigger physical guy? Sure. But at what cost? Weren't you the guy last year all over Ryan Reaves as a player they should add? That guy got nearly 3 mill per year, so is it realistic to get a guy like that to replace a bottom 6 player? I think that's the real question. How much of an upgrade is a guy like that really going to be, and is he worth the difference in money? Is a Reaves type worth $2 million more than Acciari?
 

KrejciMVP

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I think the biggest impact will be scoring a guy like Horton Lucic Iginla were who can play in top 6 and provide nastiness. 4th line plugs will be 4th line plugs. They also need a 3rd line center and someone with the toughness than can play the Mcquaid role.

We are currently missing all 3
 

Glove Malfunction

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I think the biggest impact will be scoring a guy like Horton Lucic Iginla were who can play in top 6 and provide nastiness. 4th line plugs will be 4th line plugs. They also need a 3rd line center and someone with the nastiness than can play the Mcquaid role.

We are currently missing all 3
Are any of those 3 types of players available to be had? Not at the moment. if any of them WERE available, would they be available at at reasonable and rational cost? Given the demand for those of players, probably not, though there are always surprises, and the Bruins have a lot of trade chips in their pocket.

It's really easy to identify what the Bruins are missing. People have been saying this same thing you did since before the season started. Finding a solution is a whole lot harder.
 
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KrejciMVP

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Are any of those 3 types of players available to be had? Not at the moment. if any of them WERE available, would they be available at at reasonable and rational cost? Given the demand for those of players, probably not, though there are always surprises, and the Bruins have a lot of trade chips in their pocket.

It's really easy to identify what the Bruins are missing. People have been saying this same thing you did since before the season started. Finding a solution is a whole lot harder.

Im not sure if they are available but I think adding those pieces would go a long way. I have no illusion acquiring those players right now is easy
 

LSCII

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I think the biggest impact will be scoring a guy like Horton Lucic Iginla were who can play in top 6 and provide nastiness. 4th line plugs will be 4th line plugs. They also need a 3rd line center and someone with the toughness than can play the Mcquaid role.

We are currently missing all 3

It's easy to say that, but realistically, who fills that role and what's the cost to obtain? Is a player like that even available?
 

Glove Malfunction

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Im not sure if they are available but I think adding those pieces would go a long way. I have no illusion acquiring those players right now is easy
I think you're right, would indeed go a long way. Just not sure it's reasonable to expect much until a lot closer to the deadline. I had hopes for Gabrielle being able to be an agitator, but he seems to have gone backwards. I was hoping Frederic would fill that 3C spot with some physicality, but he's having trouble staying on the ice. So it doesn't look like we've got the right pieces (at the current time) internally, and externally, the landscape is pretty barren (currently), so I think what we've got is what we've got. It will help to get some of our D back healthy, especially Miller, who is about the nastiest of the bunch (is that saying much?)
 
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KrejciMVP

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It's easy to say that, but realistically, who fills that role and what's the cost to obtain? Is a player like that even available?

In retrospect I would have added Kovy, doesn't provide quite the grit but he does have size and can score. Would have kept Mcquaid until a suitable replacement was found. I was against keeping Riley Nash but now it looks like it would have been good to keep him around especially with Bergy and Krejcis health. Obviously this in Monday morning qb'ing

Bergy is out a month now. Does that mean Krejci plays with Marchand and Pasta?
 

Sheppy

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Can you replace a guy like Acciari with a bigger physical guy? Sure. But at what cost? Weren't you the guy last year all over Ryan Reaves as a player they should add? That guy got nearly 3 mill per year, so is it realistic to get a guy like that to replace a bottom 6 player? I think that's the real question. How much of an upgrade is a guy like that really going to be, and is he worth the difference in money? Is a Reaves type worth $2 million more than Acciari?
I wanted the Bruins to grab Reaves as soon as we lost Thornton, I don’t expect them to go after Reaves because like you said, he’s fairly expensive. I also believe Reaves brings much more to the table than Acciari. I don’t think he’s a realistic target unless Vegas retains, which they won’t. They love him there.

I have also mentioned Anderson, Ferland, etc this past offseason. Both are playing good hockey and their teams seem happy. I have been watching Anderson a lot this year, he and Dubois are pretty dominant. They’re a traditional line, a line with great size and good skill. Both guys hit, both guys will get nasty, and both guys will score. We’re lacking that here. I don’t get how people continue to argue against it.

I don’t even see a guy coming up in the system that really brings a big physical element that we’re missing. We’re kind of trapped on an island I think.
 
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bb_fan

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Not having police because they don’t prevent crime is one thing. Not having enforcers on a hockey team’s roster because they don’t prevent cheap shots is something else entirely.

You say the point remains the same regardless of what analogy it involves, but that’s not true. You are saying that enforcers in hockey operate on the same principles as the police, which is pretty clearly not true.

The analogy is not apt, it’s flawed. I wasn’t trying to be cool (that ship has sailed), I was just pointing that out.

The analogy being someone saying something doesnt prevent everything so its pointless to prevent something.

And try a beard, i hear 8f you style it just right it brings cool waaaay back.
 

Dr Hook

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I don’t even see a guy coming up in the system that really brings a big physical element that we’re missing. We’re kind of trapped on an island I think.

We're trapped on skill island :laugh: I think what probably ought to happen near term is that the players we have just need to step up the physical play to the extent they can. Bjork has managed to do it, and if we can some of these guys to play with a bit more drive and intensity, it would really help. Probably is a good long-term idea to find a couple of decent players who bring that element to the table, but it will be hard to do in-season I think for cost reasons.
 

LSCII

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Irrelevant at this point since i dont watch or follow much outside the bruins anymore.

So you come to this thread and clamor for a more physical player and say the team is too soft, yet you're not aware of anyone that fits the bill, let alone if they're available, what they'd cost in salary, and what they'd cost to obtain?

Awesome. Literally awesome. :laugh:
 
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BruinsFanSince94

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So you come to this thread and clamor for a more physical player and say the team is too soft, yet you're not aware of anyone that fits the bill, let alone if they're available, what they'd cost in salary, and what they'd cost to obtain?

Awesome. Literally awesome. :laugh:

I always love situations where people comment on something they have zero clue about.
 
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