I think that is a fair statement. I think intimidation can exist, but that it can exist in other forms. A defenseman can be intimidated by an opponent's speed and it can affect how he plays that guy. Some goalies absolutely intimidate the other team. Situations can be intimidating (see Luongo, Roberto during the Cup finals).
When you get to the NHL level of achievement you are talking about the .01% of players in the world. They've played tough guys, they've played big guys, they've played fast guys, etc. The amount of intimidation goes down just because these guys have lived it for their whole lives.
Before I respond, let me say how incredible ridiculous it was of you to compare the mindset of toughness of a Patrice FN Bergeron with the other Bruins like Heinen and Bjork etc. That was either completely intellectually dishonest of you or (*edit* actually, I know you are a smart guy and it was option number one).
(1) You've pushed this idea for years --that NHLers don't feel real intimidation because they are NHLers! It's laughable, actually it is just a bizarre idea to put these guys on a Hellenistic Greek level of hero worship when they are just average humans who are really good at hockey. The few guys I know who made the NHL are no different than the guys who made just the AHL, or NCAA etc. I have an old friend who was a mean SOB 230pd Dman in the AHL with around 100 career fights --he will be the first to admit that there were guys that scared him, knowing he might have to fight them (would lose sleep the night before, have stomach issues the morning of games) ... none of that is great stuff for him to have to go through and I'm not celebrating that but he has told me that he always played hard but he would be afraid to cross the line against certain teams/players. I would love to hear your response to that.
**edit** he would still do it from time to time as part of his nature, but he was less likely to do so when he went into the game paranoid. I'm not trying to suggest that he played like a wilting daisy some games.
I do agree, however, that they (professional hockey players, even from CHL level up) have much more experience dealing with normal stressors as their HPA axis is constantly firing before/during games (even playing in front of large crowds is a stressor that most of us would be completely overwhelmed by, at first).
I wouldn't say that players never get intimidated. Of course they do (I said earlier that a great forechecker is a good thing to have). But in the heat of the moment if a guy sees a vulnerable player he's going to hit him if that's the kind of player he is, and he's going to lay up if that's the kind of player that he is.
Agreed. The problem here is that you completely overlook and/or bypass the idea the state of mind of the player leading up to being "in the moment" of that game. I'll get to that later
We are talking about situations where the amygdalla is working more than the frontal lobe, and their abilities to say "Hmm, what are the ramifications of making this hit." They are going to react according to their nature, their habits and other factors. I just don't think in that heat of them moment they are thinking "Hmm, who is over on the other bench". And if they do, the benefit of having that player on your bench has to be weighed against that player's actual ability to do something other than punch.
Again, I actually agree with this --but I still think you are missing the point.
*On a side note: the prefrontal cortex actually also acts as a large filter, if you will, of fear and emotion --it isn't something that "works" more of less or gets bypassed --as you suggest here-- depending on the stressful situation. The last I had read, the amygdala was under debate as to how much stress is linked to this little brain nugget; LeDoux often gets credited with assigning it as the "fear center" of the brain and even he won't commit to it.
We DO know, however, that it is at least crucial as a type of wiring for fear signals (we know this because when we it is removed from primates, they have "no fear" afterwards. So let us see this allegory though:
Hyenas are running around in a pack on the prowl --they are hunting (they are actually freaky SOBs with their dense muscle structuring and impressive bite force) and they come over a hill to see a young, vulnerable male lion sleeping, neck exposed and everything!
OF COURSE they are going to go in and rip out the jugular --it is in their nature and it removes a future threat to both them and their hunting lands (chance at 'winning') they are strong and their opponent is vulnerable = moving in for the kill shot.
The question goes back to: What was the hyenas state of mind?
The answer is: Fearless... which leads to the hyper confident nature (and a much higher degree of chance that it will do something hyper aggressive)
If the vulnerable lion had been properly protected by the lion pride (something we don't have right now) then the hyenas would not running around looking for a kill without a second thought for self preservation. If a big old male lion (Chara) had been roaring at them, some are going to be freaked out and not as aggressive. Others are not going to care because the big old lion couldn't be bothered to chase anything these days --but there are other adult male lions that will tear into them if they cross the line (except, as we see in Boston, when they are all traded away or injured and not replaced) and while there is still going to be hyenas that rush in from time to time --the overall mindset of the hyena is going to be one where there is caution mixed in if there are adults apex predators around to protect the pride.
A hyena around a herbivore looks and acts completely different than the same hyena around a lion (or another competing hyena).
Finally,
CRUCIALLY, what happens to the pride when there is no response made? In the scenario: a lion is vulnerable... hyenas rush in (as is their nature) and they drag one of your own and injure it badly. The lions wilt away rather than rushing out to defend the lion that is getting ripped apart? Or what if the pride sends out their two smallest lions over and over ---SOUNDS RIDICULOUS, RIGHT? --ask Krug and Marchand how that feels. The alpha male (Sweeney) decides that they don't need a pride that can fight back --if they get faster and more agile/skillful at running through the brush then it will make up for the lions that are lost or injured during attacks on the pride!
Even an animal will not put up with this; there will be no pride in the pride (lame, I know) and they will begin to reflect this identity of being victims instead of.... lions! After a while they are going to change how they themselves hunt and move around --watching as one lion after the other gets taken out without any warning or response to their attackers.
Edit: I've spent too much of my life on this thread --it is painfully obvious that what I said was going to happen to our team identity has now happened. It's right there in front of me on my 65" 4K TV and people typing away that it isn't happening isn't changing a damned thing about reality. It's ridiculous. I'm truly sorry for those of you that can't see it but I'm tired of educating you about it. I'm moving on to other threads with other topics.
