The COVID 19 Thread (Part II - READ MOD WARNING IN OP)

[MS]

No one is guilting you lol. You’re assuming everyone is taking precautions like you and I can almost assuredly say that’s likely not the case. If you’re taking those precautions, then all the power to you. I see people on my social media feeds doing the exact opposite. I see people in public doing the exact opposite.

My parents own a company, and my dad put tape on the ground for social distancing in line and put a sign to not walk right up the counter - 7/10 people walk right up to the counter, touching whatever along the way without having any sort of common sense or precautionary measures. A lot of people still think this is being overblown on top of it all.

I’d also argue you’re probably more likely to get the virus from a grocery store, rather than McDonald’s but whatever.

All we are doing is delaying what will likely have to be a lockdown, eventually.

I'm pretty sure F A N was trying to guilt me, ha.

I'm not saying that most people are being smart. There is an absolute shit ton of stupid happening right now. Especially when it comes to the amount of seniors still out and about. And people doing legitimately stupid things should absolutely be held to task for it.

I'm responding specifically to F A N's take on my original post. And we aren't in a lockdown right now. Golf courses are still open for crying out loud. In a world where people could literally go play a round of golf, stop at Home Depot and pick up a few things for their house on the way home, and then go through a McDonald's drive-thru for food … if you're feeling a sense of outrage about the idea of two people standing 12 or 15 feet apart outside in a back yard, your priorities might not be correct.

__________

Whatever the case - whether it's good planning and behaviour or just dumb luck - BC is doing pretty well right now, especially considering what a hub we are into Asia. New cases on a daily basis have been in a holding pattern at an average of 60-70/day since March 17, and the total number of active cases has barely gone up in the past week when new cases are measured against recoveries. And outside of Metro Vancouver … things are just dead. We'll see in the next week or two if we've really in a good position moving forward, or if things will pop up from below the surface.

 

[mriswith]

As far as social distancing goes, South Korea didn't even have to shut everything down and still stomped the virus by being extraordinarily proactive with testing and quarantining early. Sustainability for the long term is why it's so frustrating that our testing has been so sparse in BC because you can be a lot more comfortable with your environment when your community is proactive and consistent.

Like the backyard thing is totally fine if you're smart and self-aware about it. I wouldn't expect that to be the norm for everyone around vancouver, but really all the things talked about in this thread are more or less fine when people are being diagnosed early and quarantined early, anyone they had connections with quarantining as well, and ideally everyone has ppe. A real quarantine where they don't leave the house at all for weeks and groceries are dropped off at their door. When you're proactive with early detection and early quarantine, and ideally have everyone wearing ppe, you can more comfortably extend personal freedoms.

Instead we've got everyone living in this state of unknown where hardly anyone actually knows who has had it and who hasn't, and I really, really doubt that most people with symptoms but who can't get tested are actually quarantining themselves without a diagnosis. I would bet that most people with mild symptoms and no diagnosis are continuing to do their activities just as they were before symptoms and while most people are generally trying to follow the rules and keep their distance, virtually no one has access to/is using ppe so stopping asymptomatic spread/mild symptom spread is that much harder.

I'm very surprised our numbers aren't a lot worse, particularly the hospitals, even with the head in the sand approach we've had to testing. I'm not optimistic about April. It feels inevitable that we are moving towards a total lockdown at some point, which contrasted with the south korea model feels to me like using a sledgehammer to ensure that the drywall nails have been screwed in.

 

[VanJack]

Governments in Canada and the U.S. now saying that the COVID-19 restrictions could last into July at the very least, and a vaccine is probably at least 18 months away. They're also warning of the possibility of a second wave of this virus by fall.

I know it's a small point with so much misery and anxiety in every community around the world, but I think we can safely put the 2019-20 NHL season to bed. At this rate, they'll be lucky to be able to start training camps in September.

On a more sobering note, another three months of this and we'll be beyond talk of a recession, but the possibility of a full-blown depression.

All the human species can do is pull together, as we've never pulled together before.

 

[Frostage]

The interesting I have found is that Canada and BC still do not recommend the use of masks.


While I understand the priority for masks should be given to healthcare workers and the vulnerable, I do not understand the recommendation. The illness can be transferred via surfaces but it is mostly done through the air.


Taiwan dealt with the virus very well. If you have seen the interview between the Canadian doctor of the WHO and the Taiwanese reporter it is sad how he tries to escape her question.

Cheers y'all

 

[mriswith]

The interesting I have found is that Canada and BC still do not recommend the use of masks.


While I understand the priority for masks should be given to healthcare workers and the vulnerable, I do not understand the recommendation. The illness can be transferred via surfaces but it is mostly done through the air.


Taiwan dealt with the virus very well. If you have seen the interview between the Canadian doctor of the WHO and the Taiwanese reporter it is sad how he tries to escape her question.

Cheers y'all

Thinly veiled lie to ensure medical staff gets access to all ppe and avoid shortages to hoarding. Good intentions behind it.

Hopefully we are able to ramp up domestic manufacturing of ppe, everyone should have it.

 

[The Vasili Jerry]

The interesting I have found is that Canada and BC still do not recommend the use of masks.


While I understand the priority for masks should be given to healthcare workers and the vulnerable, I do not understand the recommendation. The illness can be transferred via surfaces but it is mostly done through the air.


Taiwan dealt with the virus very well. If you have seen the interview between the Canadian doctor of the WHO and the Taiwanese reporter it is sad how he tries to escape her question.

Cheers y'all

I believe the mask thing is that people who aren't used to wearing them will adjust it a lot and touch their face while doing it. It can give people a false sense of security because you can also get it from the virus going into your eye. At least that's what I've heard.

 

[Hit the post]

Thinly veiled lie to ensure medical staff gets access to all ppe and avoid shortages to hoarding. Good intentions behind it.

Hopefully we are able to ramp up domestic manufacturing of ppe, everyone should have it.

Yeah I think they fear the public hoarding face masks much like toilet paper.

Look at the relatively few deaths as a result of the virus in Hong Kong. And look at their close proximity to China (not just geographically but constant movement of people back and forth). Most people wear face masks there. Have to think that is a factor. But I’m no expert.

 

[Hit the post]

I believe the mask thing is that people who aren't used to wearing them will adjust it a lot and touch their face while doing it. It can give people a false sense of security because you can also get it from the virus going into your eye. At least that's what I've heard.

Good thing I still wear eye glasses vs contacts.

 

[F A N]

Right now anything I do is well over and above the recommended guidelines which are 2 meters of social distancing. If it's decided that 2 meters isn't actually safe ... the bigger problem is that every government in the world has been giving people terrible guidelines to follow for the last month.

McDonald's doesn't need to be open. People can get food from grocery stores. Right now, it has been decided that some risk is acceptable. But two people standing ages apart in outdoor setting isn't a risk of anything, at all. And we are not in a lockdown right now, especially for those of us outside Metro Vancouver. If the government decides a more stringent lockdown is necessary, then I'll abide by that. The situation is incredibly fluid. But right now I'm not going to be guilted about performing zero-risk activities outdoors, completely within the current recommended guidelines, by people who are acting like we're actually in a lockdown before we are.

Zero risk activities outdoors? Seriously? You're saying your friends won't come into your house why? Because there is a risk? You're saying your friends will bring their own beer. Why? Because there is a risk? You only said 1-2 friends. Why? Because the risk grows with more friends meeting together?

We are not in a complete lockdown because our government is hoping that its citizens would do the right thing. Our government has warned that if citizens can't do the right thing they will implement measures to force people to.

The actions you suggest and god forbid you are doing are simply reckless and endangering the lives of others.

 

[F A N]

NY started with 250 people, then 150, then 50, then 25, and finally 2.

Totally don't understand your post but the above isn't true. NY state has seen a rising number of infected people. There are definitely more than 2 people infected in NY state.

 

[Peen]

ok yep fan is that guy who will run up to cars and tell them to get off the road confirmed

 

[Jack Burton]

The ring master and the rest of his circus just keeps performing while the death rate just keeps rising.

Just stay safe BG

Continue to self isolated and take care of that beautiful wife of yours.

I know i'm going to need your reports from Utica when we all get through this.

Trump is a moron and i think when this is all said and done....we might just be a better place.

 

[Jack Burton]

Totally don't understand your post but the above isn't true. NY state has seen a rising number of infected people. There are definitely more than 2 people infected in NY state.

Your such a Strawman.

Read his entire post and then maybe you'll get the jist.

 

[RobertKron]

Totally don't understand your post but the above isn't true. NY state has seen a rising number of infected people. There are definitely more than 2 people infected in NY state.

lol

 

[Grantham]

@Bad Goalie

post #60 above was written so well, I have to commend you. You are able to articulate your thoughts so well, you should be a journalist or writer. Gave me great insight as to what you friends and neighbours are going through south of the border. Keep safe and strong!

 

[Hit the post]

I’ll give FAN the benefit of the doubt in misreading the post. I’ve done that myself.

 

[F A N]

Your such a Strawman.

Read his entire post and then maybe you'll get the jist.

lol

@Bad Goalie

post #60 above was written so well, I have to commend you. You are able to articulate your thoughts so well, you should be a journalist or writer. Gave me great insight as to what you friends and neighbours are going through south of the border. Keep safe and strong!

I’ll give FAN the benefit of the doubt in misreading the post. I’ve done that myself.

Sorry if I misread @Bad Goalie 's post. I don't have any immediate plans to re-read it either but I'll take you guys word for it. Thanks. Carry on...

 

[polarbearcub]

Latest from Bonnie Henry


Cautious optimism .... the curve is flattening In BC. Hope this is true. Stay home now people so we can get out of this earlier

 

[Hockeyphysio]

Latest from Bonnie Henry


Cautious optimism .... the curve is flattening In BC. Hope this is true. Stay home now people so we can get out of this earlier

The hospitalizations are increasing If they continue at this rate we will be full in 6-8 weeks. Hopefully that number will slow down

 

[tradervik]

Yeah I think they fear the public hoarding face masks much like toilet paper.

Look at the relatively few deaths as a result of the virus in Hong Kong. And look at their close proximity to China (not just geographically but constant movement of people back and forth). Most people wear face masks there. Have to think that is a factor. But I’m no expert.

I saw an article that compared countries where people commonly wear masks vs those that don't. The article concluded that mask wearing was helpful but the author somehow missed putting China in the "mask wearing" category (sorry, no link). If masks helped that much, would we have a pandemic in the first place?

Here's an article on the effectiveness of masks from the BBC.

Surgical masks are not recommended for the general public because:

• they can be contaminated by other people's coughs and sneezes or when putting them on or removing them
• frequent hand-washing and social distancing are more effective
• they might offer a false sense of security

However, I think the point about avoiding mask hoarding is also very relevant.

 

[Hit the post]

However, I think the point about avoiding mask hoarding is also very relevant.

You know hoarding is gone nuts when people buy up all the one-ply toilet paper (YES, *ONE* ply toilet paper! ).

 

[Kryten]

You know hoarding is gone nuts when people buy up all the one-ply toilet paper (YES, *ONE* ply toilet paper! ).

At that point it’s more economic to just get high grit sandpaper

 

[Hansen]

The hospitalizations are increasing If they continue at this rate we will be full in 6-8 weeks. Hopefully that number will slow down

This is in part due to the fact that we are basically only testing those who are in need of urgent care. There's still a larger number of undiagnosed cases, however, it has been just about long enough for that to become the rule and the stats are indicating that we are faring well. I am worried that the news that we have "flattened the curve" will cause a surge in new outbreaks as people drop their defences. We are working on a 2 week delay and need to be as cautious as we can reasonably be.

When it comes to the news around a lack of risk with airborn or that you are safe with takeout or groceries, its propaganda to keep the morale up and panic down. But the good thing is that we havent had people hoarding masks en masse like TP. With takeout there is an inherent risk any time you do not control the process of cooking/assembly from ingredients to on the plate, but it is restricted significantly (I would hope that people are taking seriously to stay home if they are sick, but there are many out there who cannot afford to miss a cheque unfortunately). The best practice is to treat any foreign object coming into your home as if it is contaminated. Wash your groceries, dont eat out of the bag. Treat all foodstuffs, even if it is packaged, as if it is raw meat and you should be fine.

Local restaurants seem to be stepping it up in terms of sanitization, to the point of having employees wear masks, unless someone sneezes or coughs on your food, you should be fine. If word gets out that an outbreak has been caused by a local restaurant they will sadly go out of business, they don't want that to happen. But you have to settle with the risk of that contamination happening unbeknownst when you choose to let someone else prepare your food. I think that that is a large reason for all of these high profile diagnoses, the upper class have a middle-person for all aspects of life, drivers/cooks/cleaners/child care/etc. whenever there is something that they choose to let someone else act in, there is risk.

It seems overwhelming but these are in reality simple additional steps that we can take to protect each other. We're doing a good job. The important thing to keep in mind is that you can only control what you can control, and what will happen will happen. Recognize and acknowledge the stress and anxiety and then let it go, worry does not change anything. Focus on being present and existing in relation to that immediately around you, don't stress over numbers at a national level or what's going on in the US/EU for now, it doesn't help. Person by person we can continue to slow the roll.

Anyways that's my wine and mango juice infused spiel for the night

 

[Ozone]

Hey fellow Isolators.
To help pass the time..

 

[DL44]

Some numbers sent to me...