Didalee Hed
I’m trying to understand
- Sep 14, 2019
- 1,963
- 2,005
I would like to see them finish the 19-20 season before worrying about the next. If it takes two years to get one proper season in, so be it.
The COVID 19 Thread (Part II - READ MOD WARNING IN OP)
- Thread starter Mr. Canucklehead
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Didalee Hed
I’m trying to understand
- Sep 14, 2019
- 1,963
- 2,005
A much younger Didalee Hed moved to alberta to cash in, then got out way ahead before he went insane.
@Melvin
I know Fauci released the 100,000 number. Dr. Birks said 100- 200,000.
No, I was referring to the 2.2 million they said would die if they did nothing. Trump took that 2.2 number and ran like an Olympic speed skater with it.
"2.2 million, blah, blah, blah"
"2.2 million, that's a lot of people."
"2.2 million. Wow, 2.2 million."
"2.2 million if we did nothing. Because of the great job we are doing it will be 100,000 He will always choose the number that best suits his cause so Birk's possibly as high as 200,000 doesn't get thrown around). That's a lot, but it could have been s-o-o-o many more. Hopefully, it won't even be that many, but if it is, we will have done a great job."
He has cited the 2.2 million number and contrasted it with the 100,000 so many times since it was first stated it's nauseating. He is selling his followers on the idea that he has saved 2.1 million lives. Never mind that the 100,000 will be too many and how many less than that might there have been if he hadn't buried his head along with those of his base for 2 months while this thing spread all over the nation.
He also keeps bragging about how the US has tested more people than any other nation in the world, over 800,ooo. The US has a population of 327 million. less than 1% of the entire population has been tested. How many people are carrying this thing around? No one has a clue. Trump and company refused the test kits from WHO. They wanted to use their own. The first ones were a fiasco as they basically didn't work. Finally got them up and running , but had so few only people who showing severe symptoms were eligible for testing, so the rest were still at large in the country. The stated all still say they can't do adequate testing. You stop this thing by finding who is positive and removing them from circulation. Can't do that without, as every epidemiologist n the country keeps saying, test, test,test. Every day we keep hearing about all of the new easier tests with shorter turnaround results that have been developed, but not sure exactly who is using them/where they are, but the test numbers still don't show a huge number of people being tested.
The ideal would be to have every American tested. I don't see that happening, but they could/should deluge the hot spots with testing if the tests are available in those kind of numbers. It's probably more prudent to test out the population in all of the states with low numbers of positive cases. Otherwise we will continue to see what has been happening. States with very low numbers have slid along for weeks and then, BAM! Michigan and Florida are examples. Louisiana, Texas, and Michigan hit the big time. It's going to go from state to state. The virus doesn't have any political leanings, but many of the states have huge trump followers and they bought all of his BS for months now and it's only a matter of time.
I know Fauci released the 100,000 number. Dr. Birks said 100- 200,000.
No, I was referring to the 2.2 million they said would die if they did nothing. Trump took that 2.2 number and ran like an Olympic speed skater with it.
"2.2 million, blah, blah, blah"
"2.2 million, that's a lot of people."
"2.2 million. Wow, 2.2 million."
"2.2 million if we did nothing. Because of the great job we are doing it will be 100,000 He will always choose the number that best suits his cause so Birk's possibly as high as 200,000 doesn't get thrown around). That's a lot, but it could have been s-o-o-o many more. Hopefully, it won't even be that many, but if it is, we will have done a great job."
He has cited the 2.2 million number and contrasted it with the 100,000 so many times since it was first stated it's nauseating. He is selling his followers on the idea that he has saved 2.1 million lives. Never mind that the 100,000 will be too many and how many less than that might there have been if he hadn't buried his head along with those of his base for 2 months while this thing spread all over the nation.
He also keeps bragging about how the US has tested more people than any other nation in the world, over 800,ooo. The US has a population of 327 million. less than 1% of the entire population has been tested. How many people are carrying this thing around? No one has a clue. Trump and company refused the test kits from WHO. They wanted to use their own. The first ones were a fiasco as they basically didn't work. Finally got them up and running , but had so few only people who showing severe symptoms were eligible for testing, so the rest were still at large in the country. The stated all still say they can't do adequate testing. You stop this thing by finding who is positive and removing them from circulation. Can't do that without, as every epidemiologist n the country keeps saying, test, test,test. Every day we keep hearing about all of the new easier tests with shorter turnaround results that have been developed, but not sure exactly who is using them/where they are, but the test numbers still don't show a huge number of people being tested.
The ideal would be to have every American tested. I don't see that happening, but they could/should deluge the hot spots with testing if the tests are available in those kind of numbers. It's probably more prudent to test out the population in all of the states with low numbers of positive cases. Otherwise we will continue to see what has been happening. States with very low numbers have slid along for weeks and then, BAM! Michigan and Florida are examples. Louisiana, Texas, and Michigan hit the big time. It's going to go from state to state. The virus doesn't have any political leanings, but many of the states have huge trump followers and they bought all of his BS for months now and it's only a matter of time.
The NHL doesn't have a lucrative enough TV contract to bother with this. They will play in front of paying fans or not at all. Also not going to play without our European players, many of which are stuck across the pond.
Also, Bettman should just cancel the regular season and refund season ticket holders for the games that aren't going to be played. We're in the middle of an economic crash and the NHL is holding onto ticket money that people could probably use right now.
Peen
Rejoicing in a Benning-free world
- Oct 6, 2013
- 30,110
- 25,639
Just curious about your guys thought on the extent of social distancing. I've seen people being berated for going on drives and I don't really get why as it's a solo activity. I understand the shaming for going to large social gatherings, etc as I haven't been in a place of more than five people outside of the grocery store in 3 weeks now. Also, do you think it's OK for someone to go visit their parent? Their significant other? I'm just curious about where people draw the line.
Nucker101
Foundational Poster
- Apr 2, 2013
- 21,151
- 16,619
also interested in this. My group of friends who have their parents/siblings living within driving distance seem close to 50/50 on this, half of them are still visiting them and the other half are just on full lockdown.
UticaHockey
Registered User
I posted this in the Comets thread but it is relevant here too.
Over the past two days Dr Fauci has stated that between 100,000 and 200,000 people may die just in the US alone. This thing isn't going peak in a couple weeks and then we go back to life as normal in May or June. Even if it does start to subside in the warmer summer months he is warning of the possibility that it starts to reemerge again next October. Hopefully by then we will be closer to having a vaccine and therapies that are proven to work with patients who have been stricken with it.
I miss going to the Aud and watching the Comets play. I miss turning the TV on and watching live sports and the break they offer from everyday life but there are more important things than sports right now.
Over the past two days Dr Fauci has stated that between 100,000 and 200,000 people may die just in the US alone. This thing isn't going peak in a couple weeks and then we go back to life as normal in May or June. Even if it does start to subside in the warmer summer months he is warning of the possibility that it starts to reemerge again next October. Hopefully by then we will be closer to having a vaccine and therapies that are proven to work with patients who have been stricken with it.
I miss going to the Aud and watching the Comets play. I miss turning the TV on and watching live sports and the break they offer from everyday life but there are more important things than sports right now.
Same is true for the AHL. The Comets have said they plan to refund our payment for lost games, but the way they suggest doing it is to roll it over onto the next season's ticket price. Fine for those who want to do it, but I'd like to see the money back on my credit card. I'll take care of next season when we know there will be one.
I know this is a difficult one to come to grips with, but the older folks, like me, are much safer if not exposed to the younger folks who have been out in the real world, may have been exposed, or worse are asymptomatic. E-mail, texts, PHONE calls, skype and visits with you in the driveway while the rents stay inside and talk through the screen door are the best ways to safely maintain contact. The absence of physical contact is the most difficult part of this whole ordeal, but if it works out for the better it's worth it. I believe when this thing is finally licked the human race is going to be a lot more civil and physical with each other. At least I certainly hope so. There are huge numbers of people doing things right now that reveals the kind of humanity that as a species we were always capable of, but seemed to have forgotten. Let's hope we come out of this on the other side fully expressing our new lease on life.
Hit the post
I have your gold medal Zippy!
Or at the very least, give enough time for factories *HERE* to be "retooled" to handle produce PPE (personal protective equipment) like facemasks. Sometimes outsourcing to the cheapest option (overseas) isn't the best alternative.
There's definitely some overkill happening where some people have taken it upon themselves to shame anyone for leaving their house to do anything that looks remotely fun. And maybe it's necessary because there will always be some idiots who stupidly ruin things for everyone else.
Personally, I don't think there's any problem with doing these sorts of things :
- having a friend or two over for a beer around a fire in your back yard standing 10-15 feet apart.
- going for a bike ride, as long as you're backing it off a bit and not doing anything stupid/dangerous or parking in a crowded lot.
- going for small sightseeing drives, provided you aren't interacting with locals and you're maintaining correct social distancing. And aren't going to a place that many other people are going to.
- going camping in a secluded area for a night or two.
Basically, if it's outdoors and/or limited to yourself and your significant other/family group, that's reasonable.
Likewise, if you have a significant other you don't live with, I think it's stupid to expect that you shouldn't see each other for several months. It might be a good time for people to evaluate their relationships and either decide you're in it together or end things.
People need to have healthy, enjoyable outlets to stay mentally healthy. If you could kill this whole thing by locking everyone in their houses for 4 weeks, sure. Everyone fully locked down. But given the many months this should go for, it isn't reasonable to assume people should drop every single activity if those activities are perfectly capable of being managed safely. Because when you turn the reasonable into the illegal, people will just say f*** it and that's when chaos ensues.
One thing people should absolute NOT be doing under any circumstances is visiting parents over age 60, other than to drop off groceries and have a well-distanced outdoor conversation.
Obviously this is all liable to change if things escalate drastically. But right now BC is doing a good job and cases have basically been in a holding pattern for the last 10-11 days.
Melvin
21/12/05
One thing to keep in mind is that going to the hospital for any reason puts strain on the system, so in driving and playing sports you're taking a small risk of a car accident or an injury. It is a very bad time to break your arm, you know? Not saying it should be banned, but it is another variable. We are helping by limiting the amount of car accidents and other such things in addition to the help of not spreading the virus.
If literally nobody went outside for 14 days, this thing would be over. The more "stuff" we do, the longer it needs to go. But of course, yes, that isn't reasonable and so some balance needs to be found since some people do need to go out and everyone needs to exercise and do some activities for the sake of mental health. I'm just saying it's something additional to keep in mind.
So I'd say, go for a drive, go for a run, all those things, but maybe you don't have to every day, you know? Every little bit counts, here.
I don't disagree with any of that in principle, and as I said, if things escalate significantly my take may change.
I live in a popular mountain biking area and right now there's this notion going around that 'YOU CAN'T RIDE, YOU'LL GET HURT AND FILL UP OUR OVERCROWDED HOSPITALS!'
... but there isn't a single COVID-19 patient at our hospital right now (or any of the 3 hospitals nearest to where I live). And the hospitals are completely dead because normal traffic has been hugely reduced by social distancing measures and the fact that everyone is just sitting at home.
If I break my arm today, it isn't really putting any extra stress on anything. If, however, a month from now things have escalated and hospitals are full - absolutely, pull the plug on medium-risk solo activities as things approach that point. Like, if you live on the North Shore where there are a far higher number of cases, my take would be a bit different.
And I agree completely that things should be limited to a couple days/week and risk levels should be dialed back.
I am toxic
. . . even in small doses
I know you are suggesting it as a hypothetical, as obviously many would die if health care workers and others did this, but 14 days is not enough. eg. a 27 day outlier was reported in Hubei on February 22. So start by doubling the period. And ignore the thousands that would perish as a result of essential services being shut down.
But the rest of your point stands - the fewer trips out, the better, both to reduce exposure and also reduce the chance of accident requiring non-Covid related hospital treatment.
I am toxic
. . . even in small doses
Where I live a small fire in my pit in my backyard is perfectly legal. Obviously that would not be an option if you live in Burnaby or whatever.
Having a friend over and sitting far apart outdoors and having a beer isn't a risk of anything and isn't changing anything. Having a friend over and sitting close together indoors, by contrast, is idiotic.
Like, gatherings of up to 50 people are still legal in BC right now ... and that actually is a bit silly.
Again, people need to have outlets and social systems and we need to allow safe actions which preserve this. We can't just lock everyone in their houses for the next 6 months.
__________
Also, this notion (which is all over social media) that 'The better we social distance, the less time we'll have to do it for!' is well-intentioned but incorrect. If we did zero social distancing, this would all be over really quickly and we'd have herd immunity in a couple months - it's just the human cost of getting to that point would be obscene. The better we social distance, the longer we'll be doing it for as we're spreading out infections over a longer period of time to ease the burden on the health care system and essentially waiting for a vaccine. Also, the more competently we social distance in general, the more we can retain some small freedoms, of the sort I mentioned in my original post.
Alberta offers a much higher quality of life (for now...) relative to everywhere else in the country. Affordable housing (Vancouverite translation - that means under $1,000/sqft), amazing accessibility to public services, high professional salaries (teachers, nurses and doctors, all whom are absolutely being put through the ringer right now are still the highest paid in the country), terrific infrastructure.
I have many friends in the Lower Mainland who are talking about moving back because they just can't afford it.
I think this is all it boils down to. Overshooting guideline restrictions is a much, much better risk adjusted strategy vs offering too much leniency.
You must live quite far away from Metro Vancouver. Don't think there is any city in Metro Vancouver that allows open fire in the back yard without a permit.
Anyhow, my question to you then is when your friend comes over does he come into your house to wash his hands? Do you wear gloves when handing him/her/them a beer from your fridge and also when you are disposing of it? Are you rubbing services down before your friends arrive and after?
I understand that people need to have outlets but the whole idea of social and physical distance and telling people to stay home is that not having an outlet is a small inconvenience and suffering in our fight against the virus. Purposely inviting friends over for beers is an unnecessary risk. Why not just skype or zoom each other and have a beer in your own back yards?
PG Canuck
Registered User
- Mar 29, 2010
- 63,020
- 24,250
What part of social distancing do people not get. Small social gatherings is not social distancing. Hanging out at home with friends is not social distancing.
PG Canuck
Registered User
- Mar 29, 2010
- 63,020
- 24,250
I highly, highly doubt people that are having friends over, are doing any sort of cleaning or taking any sort of precautions. They just assume their friends aren’t going to have it.
It’s pissing me off that I’ve completely abandoned my social life, haven’t seen my friends coming on four weeks now and haven’t left my house for anything other than work in four weeks, meanwhile we have people STILL having gatherings at their household because they think since it’s not in public, it’s perfectly fine!
And then these same people will wonder why the virus is still around two months from now...
I haven't lived in Metro Vancouver for a long time, no.
And I'm also not stupid. No friend who comes over can go in my house, and in that scenario they can bring their own beer over. Standing outside in the same yard with another person and not co-touching anything isn't a risk. Same as if you meet a friend or family member and stay well apart while going for a walk through a park. Or whatever. There's safe and reasonable, and there's stupid. And there's way too much stupid going on right now to be singling out people who are being safe and reasonable. And what's safe and reasonable in one place and one time might not be safe and reasonable in a different place at a different time.
And again, I'm not advocating doing this on a daily basis. But if you catch up with a friend once every week or two in a properly spaced outdoor setting, that isn't going to tear down the central tenets of social distancing. Again - this could go on for the rest of this year, and people need to find ways to stay balanced and mentally healthy and to have a sense of normalcy. We need to be finding ways of doing this safely and support people who are doing this safely, not start a process of reactionary shaming on anyone who isn't locked in their house 24/7.
I mean, for f***'s sake, I can still go through a McDonald's drive-thru and be handed food that has been touched by several people who are all in the same room. We should maybe be prioritizing the risks here.
So what you're suggesting is to have a friend or two (you personally have an arbitrary limit) open the gate to your back yard bringing their own beer and you stand around a live fire shouting at each other and nodding to each other? Do you all wear a mask? And what if others have the same idea to meet and "walk through a park"? There's a reason parks are closed you know.
Like you said, the advice can change. Right now the advice is stay 2 metres away. What if the advice later changes and 2 metres isn't deemed enough? Do you spread out even farther to shout at each other in your back yard?
The reason they are not shutting McDonald's down is because it's considered an essential service and people need food. But it's not safe at all. The virus can live on cardboard for 24 hours and plastic and steel for longer. The advice to support the restaurant industry by ordering takeout is actually a risky endeavor. But there has to be some food places open. We need to keep the supply chains open and truckers need places to grab food. You don't need to meet your friends in your back yard this week or next week or the following week just to have a beer together in the same physical location. You can do that over video conferencing.
Right now anything I do is well over and above the recommended guidelines which are 2 meters of social distancing. If it's decided that 2 meters isn't actually safe ... the bigger problem is that every government in the world has been giving people terrible guidelines to follow for the last month.
McDonald's doesn't need to be open. People can get food from grocery stores. Right now, it has been decided that some risk is acceptable. But two people standing ages apart in outdoor setting isn't a risk of anything, at all. And we are not in a lockdown right now, especially for those of us outside Metro Vancouver. If the government decides a more stringent lockdown is necessary, then I'll abide by that. The situation is incredibly fluid. But right now I'm not going to be guilted about performing zero-risk activities outdoors, completely within the current recommended guidelines, by people who are acting like we're actually in a lockdown before we are.
PG Canuck
Registered User
- Mar 29, 2010
- 63,020
- 24,250
No one is guilting you lol. You’re assuming everyone is taking precautions like you and I can almost assuredly say that’s likely not the case. If you’re taking those precautions, then all the power to you. I see people on my social media feeds doing the exact opposite. I see people in public doing the exact opposite.
My parents own a company, and my dad put tape on the ground for social distancing in line and put a sign to not walk right up the counter - 7/10 people walk right up to the counter, touching whatever along the way without having any sort of common sense or precautionary measures. A lot of people still think this is being overblown on top of it all.
I’d also argue you’re probably more likely to get the virus from a grocery store, rather than McDonald’s but whatever.
All we are doing is delaying what will likely have to be a lockdown, eventually.
My parents own a company, and my dad put tape on the ground for social distancing in line and put a sign to not walk right up the counter - 7/10 people walk right up to the counter, touching whatever along the way without having any sort of common sense or precautionary measures. A lot of people still think this is being overblown on top of it all.
I’d also argue you’re probably more likely to get the virus from a grocery store, rather than McDonald’s but whatever.
All we are doing is delaying what will likely have to be a lockdown, eventually.
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