The Cake Is A Lie. The Tank Is Real.

[geebaan]

I still honestly dont know what you are trying to argue here... You are arguing a straw man and refuse to budge and think he is the emotional one.

You are preteind he said:
"We are currently 3rd last in the standings." and then are using the standings as "proof" against a claim he didnt make.

dude you are ruining these boards, please stop

 

[bandwagonesque]

I still honestly dont know what you are trying to argue here... You are arguing a straw man and refuse to budge and think he is the emotional one.

You are preteind he said:
"We are currently 3rd last in the standings." and then are using the standings as "proof" against a claim he didnt make.

I didn't do that at all. I referred to the standjngs not to show that the Canucks were not one of the worst three teams, but thst they were far enough from those teams that the idea that they might be a bottom three roster is untenable. This was clear from my wording and I know you're intelligent enough to have understood this.

 

[4Twenty]

You said this was one of the worst three rosters in the league. If it was even close you might have a leg to stand on here. It isn't. You don't. You're wrong, and doubling down.

Is 9th worst not close enough to 3rd worst? Their points% is 9th worst and the Bleus would pass them tonight if they win.

I mean people like to puff their chests out after winning streaks, before this current streak they were the 3rd worst points% in the league on December 5th, not even 3 weeks ago.

 

[bandwagonesque]

Is 9th worst not close enough to 3rd worst? Their points% is 9th worst and the Bleus would pass them tonight if they win.

I mean people like to puff their chests out after winning streaks, before this current streak they were the 3rd worst points% in the league on December 5th, not even 3 weeks ago.

No. Their points and their goal differential indicate they are significantly better. I'm not even taking into account their difficult schedule so far or quality of conpetition, which would likely separate them further.

All I'm doing here is calling a wrong thing wrong. I have no faith that this is a good team or any emotional investment in believing that it is.

 

[4Twenty]

No. Their points and their goal differential indicate they are significantly better. I'm not even taking into account their difficult schedule so far or quality of conpetition, which would likely separate them further.

All I'm doing here is calling a wrong thing wrong.

Shall I go back to see if you were puffing your chest out on December 5th, when they were 3rd worst and their goal differential -21? You're picking your spot here in my opinion.

Less than 3 weeks ago they were on pace for the 3rd least amount of points and had the 3rd worst goal differential.

I would say that they're not as good as their recent streak and not as bad as losing 12 of 13.

Even now, their goal differential is 23/31. You're getting duped by their point totals also, they've played a lot more games than the other teams around them.

It's like you don't understand that being even .500 2/3 of the league is ahead of you./

 

[PuckMunchkin]

No. Their points and their goal differential indicate they are significantly better. I'm not even taking into account their difficult schedule so far or quality of conpetition, which would likely separate them further.

All I'm doing here is calling a wrong thing wrong. I have no faith that this is a good team or any emotional investment in believing that it is.

Make this interesting just for my sake.

Where in the standings do you think they end the season?

 

[Melvin]

How many pages do I need to go back to see what the point of this argument is?

 

[bandwagonesque]

Make this interesting just for my sake.

Where in the standings do you think they end the season?

Considering the roster and schedule I'd guess 7th to 10th last.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

How many pages do I need to go back to see what the point of this argument is?

@clunk thinks we have the 3rd worst roster in the league.
@bandwagonesque disagrees.

Thats pretty much all.

 

[Numba9]

Shall I go back to see if you were puffing your chest out on December 5th, when they were 3rd worst and their goal differential -21? You're picking your spot here in my opinion.

Less than 3 weeks ago they were on pace for the 3rd least amount of points and had the 3rd worst goal differential.

I would say that they're not as good as their recent streak and not as bad as losing 12 of 13.

Even now, their goal differential is 23/31. You're getting duped by their point totals also, they've played a lot more games than the other teams around them.

It's like you don't understand that being even .500 2/3 of the league is ahead of you./

The initial post that started this was that the Canucks, even when healthy were a bottom 3 team. They were one of the worst injured teams during their losing streak losing 11 out of 13 games and still weren't even dead last . Now since they have a normal amount of injuries they are winning games. Clunk also said that he based it on what the Canucks look on paper . Does he was every other team as closely as the Canucks, did he even account for progression from Canuck players and decline of other players through out the NHL. The only way to somewhat accurately make that determination is look at the current standings taking account injuries and strength of schedule.

 

[Pavel96]

Thanks, great work. Over the last three seasons, we have the worst record in the league. I would not consider this a positive.

But, if you don't count the last game, they are on a three game winning streak. So there is that.

 

[PG Canuck]

Horvat - goal, assist
Pettersson - assist
Virtanen - goal, assist
Leivo - goal
Gaudette - goal

Once again, the youth are leading the charge. Can’t be upset with that.

 

[valkynax]

Horvat - goal, assist
Pettersson - assist
Virtanen - goal, assist
Leivo - goal
Gaudette - goal

Once again, the youth are leading the charge. Can’t be upset with that.

I think we gonna need a bigger tank

 

[PG Canuck]

Honestly, I don't see us finishing where we need to be in order to get one of the top rated prospects. Our youth players are just too good and are just progressing too fast. We actually have two lines that are threats because of Horvat/Pettersson centering them. Horvat has taken his game to a complete new level.

I think the Canucks schedule gets a bit more favourable in the new year, but haven't really looked.

 

[valkynax]

Yes Juolevi and Virtanen were not great picks. Also JB did find an elite 1st line winger with a late 1st round pick. Also got the best player in the 2017 draft with even drafting in the top 3.

Yzerman is probably one of the better GM since the lockout. Even he makes mistake by drafting Drouin over Jones. With the exception of the Jets from 2011 to 2016. I don't think there are any GMs that hit on their 1st round picks 5 or 6 years in a row. If I am wrong. Please challenge me.

The crowd that only said negative things about JB and JB supporters. The truth is somewhere in the middle.

To be fair, Yzerman realized his mistake and worked to resolve it in most spectacular fashion. He turned a whiny little turd into a legit top 4 and potentially top 2 D. This guy just seem to be drawn towards crisis and chews them up like popcorn.

I'm not expecting him to hit every draft pick, no one can do that without access to either a time machine or Rick's portal gun. What I find incredibly frustrating is how Dim Jim basically screwed up two INCREDIBLY obvious picks.

Put it this way, if he hit Nylander and Tkachuk picks, missed EP40 and BB6 picks, I will be disappointed but I wouldn't blame him nearly as much. Why? Because the first two were clear BPAs that couldn't be more obvious - virtually every source indicated those two players as the best at that draft rank, while the other two were from a very messy draft year and a low first round pick. That's like if I easily ace my Linear Algebra exams while getting a 27% on grade 5 math. If he can hit the target with those difficult picks, why couldn't he hit the easier ones? And I'm not asking this with condescension or sarcasm, because I really want to know. If he can make a consistent system out of the EP40 and BB6 draft years, our draft quality would improve by a large margin, wouldn't you think so?

 

[PuckMunchkin]

To be fair, Yzerman realized his mistake and worked to resolve it in most spectacular fashion. He turned a whiny little turd into a legit top 4 and potentially top 2 D. This guy just seem to be drawn towards crisis and chews them up like popcorn.

I'm not expecting him to hit every draft pick, no one can do that without access to either a time machine or Rick's portal gun. What I find incredibly frustrating is how Dim Jim basically screwed up two INCREDIBLY obvious picks.

Put it this way, if he hit Nylander and Tkachuk picks, missed EP40 and BB6 picks, I will be disappointed but I wouldn't blame him nearly as much. Why? Because the first two were clear BPAs that couldn't be more obvious - virtually every source indicated those two players as the best at that draft rank, while the other two were from a very messy draft year and a low first round pick. That's like if I easily ace my Linear Algebra exams while getting a 27% on grade 5 math. If he can hit the target with those difficult picks, why couldn't he hit the easier ones? And I'm not asking this with condescension or sarcasm, because I really want to know. If he can make a consistent system out of the EP40 and BB6 draft years, our draft quality would improve by a large margin, wouldn't you think so?

I know its an unpopular point to bring up but our successes are from NCAA / USA (Bracket) and Sweden (Gradin).

This goes against the thinking that Benning is responsible for the draft and the discussion gets swamped.

 

[valkynax]

I know its an unpopular point to bring up but our successes are from NCAA / USA (Bracket) and Sweden (Gradin).

This goes against the thinking that Benning is responsible for the draft and the discussion gets swamped.

That's something I have little knowledge of, so I can't really comment on it.

I expect some consistency. If we gonna give Benning credit for his hit picks, he will also bear the scrutiny of missed picks; If we are gonna blame missed picks on our scouts, then they will also get credit for the hit picks.

Unless there's explicit and concrede evidence from reputable source that says otherwise (ie. TSN article from McKenzie saying Benning wanted Tkachuk but scouts strongly objected and insisted on OJ), I think it's fair to have this consistency.

 

[PG Canuck]

Like I said, that year's draft rank was a total cluster ****, it's like digging through a box of legos to find a piece of megablock. Which is why I think it's quite impressive that Benning picked out our Calder candidate. Same with BB6, finding a player in low first round position is no easy task, and Benning picked him out.

The JV draft, if I'm not mistake, everyone on this board wanted either Ehlers or Nylander, and Benning basically got out-drafted by a bunch of random internet pedestrians.

The polls got deleted I believe, but Nylander/Ehlers were 1/2, then I believe it was Virtanen at 3 and Ritchie was close at 4.

 

[F A N]

The JV draft, if I'm not mistake, everyone on this board wanted either Ehlers or Nylander, and Benning basically got out-drafted by a bunch of random internet pedestrians.

In the Petersson draft, nobody here would have drafted him #1 overall, #2 overall. There may have been one or two who had him #3 overall. Did Benning out-draft a bunch of random internet pedestrians?

In reality, the 2014 draft wasn't fully Benning's draft, yet it's probably the best draft overall in Benning's tenure so far.

 

[Jack Burton]

Playoffs?

 

[MadaCanuckle]

Playoffs?

Too soon. Let us play against someone not named Blues.

 

[valkynax]

In the Petersson draft, nobody here would have drafted him #1 overall, #2 overall. There may have been one or two who had him #3 overall. Did Benning out-draft a bunch of random internet pedestrians?

In reality, the 2014 draft wasn't fully Benning's draft, yet it's probably the best draft overall in Benning's tenure so far.

Ah the bullshit is strong in this one.

Did you read the whole post? Are you willfully ignoring the fact that I praised the Benning for how he drafted BB6 and EP40 despite both being hard picks (twice)? Or are you used to making up horse manure?

Show me, right now, where did I say Benning got out-drafted by a bunch of pedestrians for the EP40 draft.

Benning did get out-drafted for both the JV and OJ draft, that's a fact. Deny it how ever you like, facts won't change.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Alright, enough of that bickering. Agree to disagree and move on.

 

[Melvin]

In the Petersson draft, nobody here would have drafted him #1 overall, #2 overall. There may have been one or two who had him #3 overall. Did Benning out-draft a bunch of random internet pedestrians?

I would have drafted him #1 overall. Maybe 2 at lowest.

In reality, the 2014 draft wasn't fully Benning's draft, yet it's probably the best draft overall in Benning's tenure so far.

What does this tell you?

 

[Jack Burton]